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Author Topic: New Rare skirmishers  (Read 12779 times)

Gump

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New Rare skirmishers
« on: June 14, 2009, 05:12:35 PM »
I would love to have some nice skirmishers with brace of pistols :biggriin:
So i thought about M4 WS3 BS3(ch4) S3 T3 W1 A1 Ld 7 brace of pistols, LA and cloak 5+AS vs shooting 6+ in meele. They will fight with two HWs. For each 4 men you can promote one of them to champion 5pts(BS4 may have rep pistol+normal 5pts and one use pidgeon bomb 10pts), unit size 4-12 10 per model +2pts for scouts rule. Want them?[Any ideas(mainly balancing them)are welcome]
                                                                                                       Gump :happy:

Offline sniperjolly

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2009, 06:43:09 PM »
so, a 10 pt per model rare unit, huh? Maybe huntsmen and duelists need to be in the same category (wait, duelists already are, DOW) the absolute maxed out unit of these guys would be 189 (?) points, and a maxed out flagellants are 310, STank, 300. I simply don't think these guys are rare material, if you don't mind me saying. Then again, empire rare slots are less valuable than empire special, but for me, I think that I would just take duelists instead.
What's up with that Phillyt guy... he's not what I would call '' pleasant''.

Offline Obi

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2009, 05:32:04 PM »
like sniper, I don't think they're rare. Just a core, not counting towards the minimum number of units. But I like the rest of your set-up. Only they should cost more for this equipment. I think the current DoW duellists with pistols are fine, therefore these guys should be 10 points (with one pistol), can have a brace at + 3 pts /2models (yeah, that sucks, I know) and +2 to scout.
Hello Athiuen and welcome to the Back Table.

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I killed a duck with a spear, can't read train timetables though
"To be is to do"-Socrates;
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"Do Be Do Be Do"-Sinatra

Offline der Hurenwiebel

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #3 on: July 09, 2009, 06:01:23 PM »
How bout sharps rifle breechloaders as an upgrade weapon that the huntsmen can take.

30 inch range, move and shoot, S4 -3 as, 4 points per.

the hunstmen would still have skirmish scout and so forth, but in order to take this unit you must have at least one hero level engineer, (he brought the guns).
"DEfighter wrote:
Hey, trolls stay the hell out, this is a serious thread. Empire are cheese. 2 steam tanks, a war altar and 4 cannons is so obviously overpowered. Anyone who thinks otherwise clearly hasn't had their dragon shot down on turn 1 yet."

oh really now.  LOL ROFLMAO oh the irony.

Offline Obi

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2009, 07:12:52 PM »
How bout sharps rifle breechloaders as an upgrade weapon that the huntsmen can take.
How would that make sense? Fluffwise?
Hello Athiuen and welcome to the Back Table.

caveat lector
I killed a duck with a spear, can't read train timetables though
"To be is to do"-Socrates;
"To do is to be"-Sartre;
"Do Be Do Be Do"-Sinatra

Offline Inarticulate

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #5 on: July 09, 2009, 07:24:57 PM »
Air guns!

Windbüchse Jaeger!
I for one welcome our new flying cat overlords.

Offline Obi

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #6 on: July 09, 2009, 07:31:00 PM »
Air guns!

Windbüchse Jaeger!
Yes.... or....

NO
Hello Athiuen and welcome to the Back Table.

caveat lector
I killed a duck with a spear, can't read train timetables though
"To be is to do"-Socrates;
"To do is to be"-Sartre;
"Do Be Do Be Do"-Sinatra

Offline Inarticulate

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #7 on: July 09, 2009, 07:47:50 PM »
Whats wrong with Air guns? They're not strictly within the time period, but they're a historical weapon and formation from the equivalent real-world area. They were quite deadly with a high rate of fire and were completely silent.
I for one welcome our new flying cat overlords.

Offline Obi

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #8 on: July 09, 2009, 09:20:01 PM »
Whats wrong with Air guns? They're not strictly within the time period, but they're a historical weapon and formation from the equivalent real-world area. They were quite deadly with a high rate of fire and were completely silent.
Well, upon looking it seems air guns are actually from that time frame, not at all what I expected, I must admit. Still, It just doesn't fit with the Empire. I mean, three things make the Empire great: faith, steel and gunpowder. Gun powder and airguns ...
Hello Athiuen and welcome to the Back Table.

caveat lector
I killed a duck with a spear, can't read train timetables though
"To be is to do"-Socrates;
"To do is to be"-Sartre;
"Do Be Do Be Do"-Sinatra

Offline Union General

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2009, 01:40:42 AM »
How bout sharps rifle breechloaders as an upgrade weapon that the huntsmen can take.
How would that make sense? Fluffwise?

They do have repeating weapons... 
I like your thinking  Mr. General  what a Genius

Offline der Hurenwiebel

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2009, 05:19:24 AM »
How bout sharps rifle breechloaders as an upgrade weapon that the huntsmen can take.
How would that make sense? Fluffwise?

They do have repeating weapons...

Well it would make sense this way, the engineers are tinkerers correct, and they are presented with the problem of how do we make a better firearm, same as our RW engineers.  So in the continuous quest of improving the state troopers hand gun, some will surely have concluded that while it might be nice to be able to hide behind a tree or convenient fallen log the muzzle loading smooth bore is very slow to reload.  So how do we devise a breech loading method that goes quicker?

    Enter the cam locking, falling breech block, rifle bored, Scharf shutzenbuchse of some named engineer yadda yadda.  This handgun type is very certianly simple enough for the makers of a repeater hand gun, as it is literally what it says.  A simple lever which acts also as a trigger guard is lowered, this in turn unlocks a cam locked breech block lowering it into the stock of the weapon.  The rear of the firearm can then be charged by thumbing a pre-packed paper package of a bullet on top of a load of powder, into the breech.  The lever is then simply raised, locking the breech into place ready for firing, a primer charge of powder in the gun lock, and bang.  The gunlock for this weapon can even still be as simple as the matchlocks modeled on the current plastics or with a bit of engineery tech might even be as fancy as a flintlock or fulminating caplock.  Like the alchemists in the lore of metal can't share a bit of that chemistry with the engineering guild, or figure it out for themselves. 

Oh and as for the rifle boring, well the HLR has it why wouldn't they put it into a new weapon designed specifically for skirmishers. 

I mean if a steam tank, which really is a steam engine or tractor that has been armoured for use in a hostile environment can be invented and used then certainly a simple cam closing the end of a pipe can be devised. 

when it boils down to it all firearms are essentially air guns, think about it.  What did YOU think pushed the bullet down the barrel fast enough to hurt someone a long ways away.   How those expanding gasses are stored on the other hand, chemical, mechanical, or pneumo is another question.

Hey I haven't even touched the idea yet of Minie' ball bullets yet and what they did for the rate of fire and effective range of firearms. 

"DEfighter wrote:
Hey, trolls stay the hell out, this is a serious thread. Empire are cheese. 2 steam tanks, a war altar and 4 cannons is so obviously overpowered. Anyone who thinks otherwise clearly hasn't had their dragon shot down on turn 1 yet."

oh really now.  LOL ROFLMAO oh the irony.

Offline Derek Contyre

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2009, 03:09:58 AM »
Even scouts with handguns would be extremely powerful for ten points an model.
Take a unit of handgunners and for maybe three points? each, the can scout.
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Offline der Hurenwiebel

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2009, 04:52:22 AM »
good the concept is acceptable, now we can hammer out the method of execution.
"DEfighter wrote:
Hey, trolls stay the hell out, this is a serious thread. Empire are cheese. 2 steam tanks, a war altar and 4 cannons is so obviously overpowered. Anyone who thinks otherwise clearly hasn't had their dragon shot down on turn 1 yet."

oh really now.  LOL ROFLMAO oh the irony.

Offline Union General

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2009, 08:55:16 PM »
good the concept is acceptable, now we can hammer out the method of execution.

Points per model: 8
Scouts
M4 WS3 BS3 S3 T3 W1 I4 A1 Ld8
Marksman
Same except BS4

Equipment
Each Scout carries a bow and a hand weapon.

Options
You may promote one Scout to a Marksman for +5 points. Each member of the unit may carry a breech-loading handgun for +5 points per model. In addition, each member of the unit may also wear light armor for +3 points per model.

Special Rules
Scouts: The unit's name implies their function. Scouts have the Scouting special rule at +2 points per model.

Breech-loading Handguns
An innovation collaborated between the USM and the Empire, the breech-loading handgun utilizes a system of springs and levers to open and accept a cartridge, drastically reducing loading time. They fire with the following profile...
Range: 16" S4, AP, Move-and-fire

Just a draft at the moment. I'm feeling creative.  :-D

-The General
I like your thinking  Mr. General  what a Genius

Offline t12161991

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2009, 10:16:54 PM »
Maybe let anyone become a marksman, in the same fashion as Troll/Giant Slayers?
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Hail! to the victors valiant
Hail! to the conqu'ring heroes
Hail! Hail! to Michigan
The leaders and best!

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Offline Inarticulate

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #15 on: October 29, 2009, 11:20:15 PM »
Jaegars: Hochland Long rifle unit.

Now that would be a rare unit!
I for one welcome our new flying cat overlords.

Offline Union General

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #16 on: October 30, 2009, 12:09:09 AM »
Jaegars: Hochland Long rifle unit.

Now that would be a rare unit!

Hmm.....
By the way, this is all in good fun and just to throw historical units into WHFB...

US Sharpshooters

M4 WS3 BS4 S3 T3 A1 I3 W1 Ld8
Sergeant: BS5

Unit Size: 5-10

Equipment: Target Rifle (Hochland Long Rifle), bayonet (hand weapon)

Special Rules:
Scientific Precision. The Hochland Long Rifle functions as normal.
Killing Blow. Sharpshooters are trained to aim for the vital areas when shooting from cover. They have Killing Blow.

Just for fun.  :biggriin:

-The General
I like your thinking  Mr. General  what a Genius

Offline t12161991

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #17 on: October 30, 2009, 12:31:37 AM »
Additional Special Rule

Air Strike
When a situation becomes untenable, US Sharpshooters can call in air strikes, allowing them to escape relatively unharmed.
Once per turn, all enemy units withing 3d6" of the Sharpshooter unit are removed.
Grutch:  Careful, someone I know on a forum I visit works for Sony.  He says they aren't to be trusted.

Hail! to the victors valiant
Hail! to the conqu'ring heroes
Hail! Hail! to Michigan
The leaders and best!

10-2

Offline Union General

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #18 on: October 30, 2009, 12:35:46 AM »
Including ethereals?  :engel:

-The General
I like your thinking  Mr. General  what a Genius

Offline Derek Contyre

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #19 on: October 30, 2009, 05:30:58 AM »
@ der Huren.
Too expensive for what they are. . .

I think maybe a unit like this;

Rare;
 Imperial Scouts.
10pts a model. Each model is equipped with a longbow, hand weapon and light armour.

M4 WS3 BS4 S3 T3 W1 I3 A1 LD8
M4 WS3 BS5 S3 T3 W1 I3 A1 LD8 Marksman.

May upgrade one model to marksman +6pts
Marksman may take Hochland long rifle +20, repeater handgun +15, Brace of pistols (free)

Imperial scouts may trade in their Longbows for pistols +4pts or handguns +4pts.
Special Rules: Skirmishing, scouts.
A man who builds his army around his fluff . . . respect . . .  :::cheers:::

Offline The Dice-Shaman

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #20 on: October 31, 2009, 07:21:09 AM »
One silly word:   Blunderbuss!

I mentioned this elsewhere but I wanna see Halflings running around with Blunderbusses in a Skirmish formation.  And if they roll a one it knocks them on their butts or something.
If your Speculum falls into a river of lava, don't reach in after it.  It's already gone bro...

Offline Fandir Nightshade

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #21 on: December 18, 2009, 12:00:32 PM »
Because of you guys (and empire total war ....perhaps I should play austria after I have beaten the game with the frogs) how this windbüchse worked.

Offline Derek Contyre

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #22 on: December 18, 2009, 12:59:31 PM »
lol i beat the game as the brits. twas good. . .

and we should totally have scouting troops with rifles. would save so many a game with them sniping machine crews and rogue wizards.
A man who builds his army around his fluff . . . respect . . .  :::cheers:::

Offline Inarticulate

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #23 on: December 18, 2009, 02:03:20 PM »
Hochland Jaegars should be a RoR I reckon. Huntsmen with Hochlands.
I for one welcome our new flying cat overlords.

Offline Derek Contyre

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Re: New Rare skirmishers
« Reply #24 on: December 18, 2009, 02:55:15 PM »
And bs4. . . *drool* lol
A man who builds his army around his fluff . . . respect . . .  :::cheers:::