Topic: Turn 7

[Grumbaki]

Actually, you shot yourself in the foot with your offer: Titus was furious that you besieged Delburz, wanted him to take second place to Urenbach, did not want to marry into Urenbach's house even if Urenbach could still produce an heir. Yes, he considered Urenbach beneath him. Moreover, adopting him would have been no use as the Wolf throne is not a hereditary title, otherwise there would be no election.

Awesome how our entire game plan revolved around an offer that insulted the offeree. 

Still, that's how things go!

[Demonslayer]

I remember offering either von Kerpen's daughter or my Kislevite character's sister to Urenbach as a bride... Kinda happy you didn't take me up on that .

[Grumbaki]

I remember offering either von Kerpen's daughter or my Kislevite character's sister to Urenbach as a bride... Kinda happy you didn't take me up on that .

It was our second choice! But if we went with that, we'd likely have put all 4 armies in Grossfurre to break the siege. Which would have meant no drama, or chaotic post-campaign RPing. So I'm glad we didn't take up your (excellent) offer either, because this has turned out to be really fun.

[Mathi Alfblut]

Fun for you, I guess.

You did not understand me, at all. I got the feeling you simply see other persons character as not proper and only yours as proper ones. Your post with its rather extreme view of with a 12th century human would be (in a very sweeping characterization I might add) to be the proper way to play a moderate Middenlander.

Problem is that if you look at it, with all Middenlanders being as Al-Qaida as your characters there would not be any Middenland because you would have purged the bejesus out of yourself.

I tried to build a believeable character based on a historical 15th-16th century noble. Heck, I even used his own castle as my imaginary setting for my character story. But I realized most people were not interested in it, because it was a bad character that was too 21th century, kinda. Yeah right. Yeah, sorry for even trying to interact with you two superior RP:ers...

[Grumbaki]

Fun for you, I guess.

You did not understand me, at all. I got the feeling you simply see other persons character as not proper and only yours as proper ones. Your post with its rather extreme view of with a 12th century human would be (in a very sweeping characterization I might add) to be the proper way to play a moderate Middenlander.

Problem is that if you look at it, with all Middenlanders being as Al-Qaida as your characters there would not be any Middenland because you would have purged the bejesus out of yourself.

I tried to build a believeable character based on a historical 15th-16th century noble. Heck, I even used his own castle as my imaginary setting for my character story. But I realized most people were not interested in it, because it was a bad character that was too 21th century, kinda. Yeah right. Yeah, sorry for even trying to interact with you two superior RP:ers...

Are you asking me to stop playing a poorly educated, bigoted, super religious character because you want to play a moderate? I never said you couldn't play a moderate, or even one who has 21st century values. It's your character. You could base his home off of your own house. It wouldn't bother me. But please don't tell me that I have to change my character because you don't enjoy interacting with a PC which doesn't like your PC.

[Drasanil]

Problem is that if you look at it, with all Middenlanders being as Al-Qaida as your characters there would not be any Middenland because you would have purged the bejesus out of yourself.

What's extreme about our characters? They're just standing up for proper Middenhiem values, like purging Sigmarites at a period of time where the Sigmarite Heresy is very much a thing and a proper social code like denying women the right to wear pants because that's improper.

You accuse of us being extremist Al Queada types. But I would say your position of 'Sigmar isn't that bad' is the one that is extreme (and verging on heretical) given we're in a period of time where the Empire is in a massive schism just because a bunch of people really do think Sigmar is exactly that bad.

[Grumbaki]

Just wanted to add this. Urenbach faction isn't really like Al Qaeda. We're more like anti-abortion protestors. Sure, one of us "might" have bombed a clinic. And we totally don't approve of what happened. But they so deserved it...but we had nothing to do with it.

See? That's a more apt analogy. Hilde and Korrigan are on the run. Karl and Ana are just left behind, denying any wrongdoing while ranting about why what happened was just. If we were more Al Qaeda ish, Karl and Ana would have suicide bombed your castle three pages ago.

[Drasanil]

And to further clarify, Ana doesn't even believe any of the crap she's spouting. She's just looking to subvert things for her own benefit. She's like an evil corporate type who's pretending to be an anti-abortion protester in the hopes of getting the group to also attack that Muslim Shawarma restaurant next to the clinic because she wants to buy the property.

Though she did bet on the wrong horse, given how it all turned out, so that's pretty much a mixed bag... best she has going for her now is that she never put a pair of pants on, never lead her own army and never left Grossefure.

[Derek Contyre]

This is hilarious. The last two pages had me in stitches.
mathi, no one should alter characters... characters are there to
be enjoyed and played with. Understandably, what happens on campaign between
characters stays between characters as fa as i am concerned... I cant wait
to see how this sll pans out

[Mathi Alfblut]

Oh, I get my words twisted, how kind. I never said you had to change your character. What I say is that you come across as not being seriously interested in interacting with my character because he does not conform to what you see as the as the correct view Of Middenlands Empire.

[Grumbaki]

Oh, I get my words twisted, how kind. I never said you had to change your character. What I say is that you come across as not being seriously interested in interacting with my character because he does not conform to what you see as the as the correct view Of Middenlands Empire.

What? I wrote from my character's point of view. Which is that *anyone* who shows *any* respect for, or belief in, Sigmar the Divine, is a heretic. I was more than happy to interact with you and your character. If Herr Kane decided to defend himself, Karl would have gladly ranted at him some more. He might have even resorted to base insults and personal attacks against Herr Kane's parentage, hygiene, fashion, or some combination thereof. Herr Kane could then have responded in any way that he so chose.

What you seem to be implying is that "interacting" means "a pleasant conversation with mutual respect." I'm sorry, but Karl did not respect Kane. He did not like Green Eggs and Ham. He did not like it, Sam I am.

And you quit after the first page of the book.

[S.O.F]

Oh, I get my words twisted, how kind. I never said you had to change your character. What I say is that you come across as not being seriously interested in interacting with my character because he does not conform to what you see as the as the correct view Of Middenlands Empire.

If his interest was throwing your character out a window I think that would be suitable for the 16th century setting. Defenestration always a popular past time for the era. 

[Grumbaki]

Oh, I get my words twisted, how kind. I never said you had to change your character. What I say is that you come across as not being seriously interested in interacting with my character because he does not conform to what you see as the as the correct view Of Middenlands Empire.

If his interest was throwing your character out a window I think that would be suitable for the 16th century setting. Defenestration always a popular past time for the era. 

If only this campaign had spoils, that would be an amazing special project! 

[Mathi Alfblut]

Yeah, I guess you would find it that way. I would have to come up with a way of getting even.

Why would Isaac stick around for pointless ranting anyway. Not his style. He saw your character for a scoundrel and followed an old Hochland proverb. He silplysimply turned and walked away.

[Grumbaki]

IC: "The old hochland approach, eh? Which would that one be. Is it sleeping with one's cousin? No, no. This isn't Ostland. It must be incest with one's daughter. One might think that it would be cattle, but Hochlanders are not as deviant as Averlanders. The fact that they often can't afford cattle does play a part in it. That, and we all know that Hochlanders are naught but base cowards, which goes along with their predation on children. You see, where a real Middelander will fight you, eye to eye, what does a Hochlander do? He walks away. They just walk away, and they use their damned..their...their guns. Oh...the Hochland approach. I think that today has been enlightening enough. It looks like rain. And I left the fire burning. Good day!"

[Mathi Alfblut]

IC:
Isaac Kane made a wry smile towards the Urenbachers.
"It is clear I am not welcome in this company. So I shall not waste my time listening to insults. I have better tings to do."
With that he turned and left the room.

[Grumbaki]

Let's see....this campaign I did my best to offend:

1. Averlanders
2. Nordlanders
3. Reiklanders
4. Ostlanders
5. Hochlanders

Now I'm sad that it's over. I didn't even get the chance to start insulting the different parts of Middenland, until only Grossfurre was left. 

But not to worry. My A7 character will be a proper and polite gentleman. Which is not a joke, pretty much the opposite of Karl. So perhaps we can interact on more friendly terms then, Mathi.


Oh, and on a personal note. Out of 11 PCs so far, 5 of them have died. That is counting Karl. If he gets executed in the final fluff, that'll push me over the 50% mark, where I've managed to get the majority of my characters killed. After re-reading this thread, I can't figure out what I'm doing wrong...

[GamesPoet]

edit: Our plan was to have us hit Delburz and you guys hit Sudenberg. That way we'd cut off Titus' escape routes and maul his armies. And when you guys refused, we sent a few more letters asking to work together. Our original orders were for Finn to stay in Sudenberg to defend it, hopefully with help from your forces. Part of the reason he quit was that he felt it was suicide to do so. When he quit, we reconsidered and moved his armies away, seeing as how we got no reply from you on working together, so we felt that 1 army down south just wouldn't cut it. When you hit us with 7 armies, we were proven right.

OOC:  The problem with that plan was our forces had not finished congregating to increase the likelihood of its success.  And we ended up defending versus an attack from Titus.  Not defending Eldagsen, Titus taking it, us going to Sudenberg, put us in jeopardy of having Sudenberg not taken while maybe even having an issue retreating, or worse, having our supply line cut, plus Titus having access to Carroburg.  Nope, not a wise tactical nor strategic idea.  Besides, then Von Urenbach supporters moved on Sudenberg anyway.  By the time we made a move towards Sudenberg, we then had an agreement for a ceasefire with Titus, and he wasn't our first choice to provide Von Rudorf's votes to during the election.  Once our first option disappeared, and things were changing across the board, including the deterioration of Von Urenbach's position, Titus seemed the next obvious choice.  Also, only Titus' force hit you at Sudenberg and the defense with one army still wouldn've failed.  Von Rudorf's armies really were sitting on a ridge, and seemingly got there too late to attempt a negotiated settlement.

[GamesPoet]

Ar uLric was understandably more uspset that you slaughtered dwarfs (who live in Middenland so are citizens of the Empire) over a trivial thing such as their families and other such people supporting Titus. The ambassadors would be upset cause they are dwarfs. They don't like such uncalled for slaughter.

So the campaign has picked back up suddenly and surprisingly. Wasnt quite expecting so much activity. This is still going to be the last turn for now, there's too much burn out to have more without a break. When do people wish for the turn to end for me to rap it all up?

Ending it no later than Saturday April 20th seems good.  Gives folks plenty of time to send more letters (Von Rusdorf faction is waiting for a couple replies and still needs to send at least two more replies to others currently), and provides time for some additonal interaction with Facion figureheads as well.  Then its probably time to shut it down and let the GMs provide some final fluff, before eventually carrying it on into a different campaign.

[GamesPoet]

ReiklanderCaptain:

As I recall:

1. We lift the siege (turns out there was no family there to threaten. oops)
2. Urenbach adopts Titus (thereby making Titus the legal heir of Grossfurre and bringing the families together)
3. Titus backs Urenbach for Emperor

In our mind, we needed an heir for Urenbach. He needed someone to carry on the proud traditions of getting shot in the knee with an arrow and gaining far too much weight. Turns out you can't be an adventurer with a knee wound. So by doing that with Titus, we could have someone worthy take over after Urenbach inevitably chokes to death on a turnip.

We were warned that Titus was stubborn, and that he might be offended by the idea of being beneath Urenbach. So we laid siege to Delburz, in the hope of adding some force to the offer.

"Hey there. We've got your kids here with us. They're doing just swell, no need to worry. I'm here to make you an offer that you can't refuse. We'd like to make you the legal owner of the Grossfurre estates. Sounds pretty nice, right? Just support Urenbach for Emperor. You've got three days to respond. Oh, and don't worry about the little ones. They'll be staying with us for the winter, receiving a proper education and learning all about the lands that will soon be theirs. We look forward to working with you."

Stupid Titus and his weak loins. 

Ouch.  My read of the Titus character doesn't strike me as him deciding he'd cow tow to that.

Actually, you shot yourself in the foot with your offer: Titus was furious that you besieged Delburz, wanted him to take second place to Urenbach, did not want to marry into Urenbach's house even if Urenbach could still produce an heir. Yes, he considered Urenbach beneath him. Moreover, adopting him would have been no use as the Wolf throne is not a hereditary title, otherwise there would be no election.

[Grumbaki]

edit: Our plan was to have us hit Delburz and you guys hit Sudenberg. That way we'd cut off Titus' escape routes and maul his armies. And when you guys refused, we sent a few more letters asking to work together. Our original orders were for Finn to stay in Sudenberg to defend it, hopefully with help from your forces. Part of the reason he quit was that he felt it was suicide to do so. When he quit, we reconsidered and moved his armies away, seeing as how we got no reply from you on working together, so we felt that 1 army down south just wouldn't cut it. When you hit us with 7 armies, we were proven right.

OOC:  The problem with that plan was our forces had not finished congregating to increase the likelihood of its success.  And we ended up defending versus an attack from Titus.  Not defending Eldagsen, Titus taking it, us going to Sudenberg, put us in jeopardy of having Sudenberg not taken while maybe even having an issue retreating, or worse, having our supply line cut, plus Titus having access to Carroburg.  Nope, not a wise tactical nor strategic idea.  Besides, then Von Urenbach supporters moved on Sudenberg anyway.  By the time we made a move towards Sudenberg, we then had an agreement for a ceasefire with Titus, and he wasn't our first choice to provide Von Rudorf's votes to during the election.  Once our first option disappeared, and things were changing across the board, including the deterioration of Von Urenbach's position, Titus seemed the next obvious choice.  Also, only Titus' force hit you at Sudenberg and the defense with one army still wouldn've failed.  Von Rudorf's armies really were sitting on a ridge, and seemingly got there too late to attempt a negotiated settlement.

Then why didn't you contact us before attacking? Or at least tell us about the negotiations so we could have joined in?

[GamesPoet]

Then why didn't you contact us before attacking? Or at least tell us about the negotiations so we could have joined in?

The answer is here ...

OOC:  ... Besides, then Von Urenbach supporters moved on Sudenberg anyway.  By the time we made a move towards Sudenberg, we then had an agreement for a ceasefire with Titus, and he wasn't our first choice to provide Von Rudorf's votes to during the election.  Once our first option disappeared, and things were changing across the board, including the deterioration of Von Urenbach's position, Titus seemed the next obvious choice.  Also, only Titus' force hit you at Sudenberg and the defense with one army still would've failed.  Von Rudorf's armies really were sitting on a ridge, and seemingly got there too late to attempt a negotiated settlement.

At the same time, we were detecting the falsehood sent our way, we were attempting to close down the ceasefire.  When we didn't get a reply to our last message, that left us little if any other alternative, continue attempting to finalize the ceasefire, and move to Sudenberg hoping to put ourselves in a spot to broker a deal depending on what was found or not (not that we would've been successful, who knows?), and after our last dispatch to Von Urenbach hadn't been replied to either its the best we could do.  And we did consider attacking with Titus, and decided against it.  A full ceasefire with Titus wasn't achieved until after Sudenberg was taken by Titus, and it was possible that we might have even ended up fighting with their armies as well.  It was all quite touch and go, as these things sometimes are, and really quite understandable because not everything is under any one faction's control, and instead many times a faction can only respond to what is happening outside of what they have the abiltiy to decide upon themselves.

[Grumbaki]

Well, I don't recall not responding to a letter. As I recall, we felt tipped off towards treachery because we were sending letters asking to work together and weren't getting a reply. Which I suppose is par for course with diplomacy. So I find your excuse plausible. You may live...for now.   

[Mathi Alfblut]

That will of course depend on the relations to the new Emperor.

[Silas]

Are people still around? I know I am, I've got several letters to respond to, but I'm waiting on a figurehead reply. Anyone else still here? We got a definitive date for the turn end?