home

Author Topic: Allocating wounds  (Read 2032 times)

Offline grobidrengi

  • Members
  • Posts: 27
Allocating wounds
« on: August 18, 2015, 04:39:59 PM »
"When inflicting damage, if you allocate a wound to a model, you must keep on allocating wounds to that model until either it is slain, or no more wounds remain to be allocated."

"... no more wounds remain to be allocated" -> surely, this refers to the current phase, or more precisely, that units damage result?

Player one: "that'll be 3 wounds"
Player two: "I allocate as follows -bla bla. Are there any more wounds to allocate from this units' attacks?"
Player one: "Nope"

This infers that we are triggering the "no more wounds remain..." condition, which implies that the "contract" is fulfilled, and the restriction on allocating wounds is lifted until the "when inflicting damage..." condition is triggered anew.

This could have a great effect one the game. Say I have some unit with big dudes that are at 5 wounds each. In shooting (arguably, this could even be the same combat phase, only a second unit is attacking) I receive 3 wounds, and I allocate to a given model until slain or no more wounds are left to allocate. Contract fulfilled. In combat, I receive 4 wounds, and I allocate this to a different model. I am still fulfilling my contract, as I allocate all 4 wounds on this model, until slain or no more wounds are left to allocate.

Next Hero phase, some ability or spell has a healing effect on my unit, where each model restores x wounds. This of course, has a much greater effect on a unit where more models are still standing, and wounds are spread across. I mean, how else would spells/abilities healing "every model in unit" be any better than spells/abilities healing "target model in unit", if it was such that there would only ever exist one single model in a unit, that had one or more wounds taken of it?

Does this make any sense to you guys?  :? Or does "... no more wounds remain to be allocated" in fact refer to the very end of the game?  :|

I'm no munchkin, I just have an interest in implication  :engel:

Offline Darknight

  • Pure of Heart
  • Members
  • Posts: 7547
  • Dipped in Magic, Clothed in Science
Re: Allocating wounds
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2015, 05:14:05 PM »
I think the intention of the rule is clear; there are never multiple models in a unit with less than their full complement of wounds. There is only ever one "wounded" model. This is both to mitigate the power of multi-wound models (who otherwise would be very powerful indeed) and also to make record-keeping simpler.
Completed Projects | History of Ophelia VII

Quote from: PhillyT
Everyone finds their balance between satisfaction and obsession.

Offline Alexis

  • Members
  • Posts: 438
Re: Allocating wounds
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2015, 05:31:56 PM »
What Darknight said.  :::cheers:::
"Dressing a bear in fine silks does not make it civilised, though in the city of Kislev it could pass at court."

Offline Discoking

  • Members
  • Posts: 54
Re: Allocating wounds
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2015, 06:19:40 PM »
I think this is in part to help special abilities like Warsphinxs take half damage so someone can't take each attack individually and allocate wounds after each attack and thus negate the special ability.

Offline grobidrengi

  • Members
  • Posts: 27
Re: Allocating wounds
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2015, 08:48:31 PM »
With the knowledge I have of previous editions, I too believe this is their intention. But is this what they have actually written? And is such an interpretation not heavily influenced by previous experience? Without said experience, is it really that clear cut? Should they be able/allowed to just assume that this is how we interpret this, just because this is how it's always been?

Clear your minds of all knowledge of Warhammer before AoS for a minute, as AoS to a large degree already prompts us to do, and review the rules and apply logic and implication. Imagine you are reading your first miniature wargame ruleset. In computer programming (yes, this is why I am such a pedantic) we often talk about instances. So, for each instance of damage allocation x, allocate according to ruleset y.

In short: for each x do y.

In the above example, how am I not acting according to the procedures blueprinted by GW?

Note: I have not actually played the game for 13 years, so I have no stake in this. I just love this game too much to let it go completely  :engel:

Crypt Horrors: Models heal 1 wound each, each Hero phase. One would assume that this is an ability that's better than "unit recovers one wound". Again; how can it be so, if there's never more than a single wound to receive from this?

The key question I think, is this: when, precisely, are there "no more wounds left to be allocated"? Because every time this triggers, the restriction no longer applies. It says very clearly that you should do x until y.

Offline Discoking

  • Members
  • Posts: 54
Re: Allocating wounds
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2015, 09:06:56 PM »
if the crypt horrors were in combat with 2 units(x and y) and x attacks the horrors and does 2 wounds,owner of crypt horrors puts 2 wounds on 1 crypt horror.Unit y attacks and does 3 wounds on horrors,owner of crypt horrors puts those 3 wounds on another horror. Thats how I read it

Offline grobidrengi

  • Members
  • Posts: 27
Re: Allocating wounds
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2015, 09:22:05 PM »
Exactly my reading, as written. Which means that according to your example, no Crypt Horrors died, even with 5 wounds being inflicted in total (they are 4 wounds each). This is a big change from previous editions (which should be disregarded anyway), which is the point I am trying to make. Maybe this has been addressed already, but so far my lurking has not seen this point been made.

Offline Discoking

  • Members
  • Posts: 54
Re: Allocating wounds
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2015, 09:42:52 PM »
Glad you pointed that out,my blood knights just got even better :D

Offline grobidrengi

  • Members
  • Posts: 27
Re: Allocating wounds
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2015, 09:58:00 PM »
Glad you pointed that out,my blood knights just got even better :D

Blood knights however, resurrect a slain model, not a number of wounds per model. I believe it could be beneficial, at least for the first model, to go down, rather than distributing the wounds across several models, as you get it back with all wounds in your next hero phase. Not sure though...

But, given this reading of the rules, what about Varghulfs? A unit may be any number. A Varghulf, as in a Varghulf model, may heal D3 wounds in any turn in which it slew a model. This would mean that you are forced to calculate damage one Varghulf model at a time, how else will you know whether an individual Varghulf slew a model or not? You cannot simply claim that because your three Varghulfs slew a total of three models, that each of them gets D3 wounds healed. AND, since you are doing attacks individually, how would this apply to the Warsphinx's ability to halve received wounds? It clearly suffers from having to do the halving of wounds in multiple instances due to rounding up...

Offline Discoking

  • Members
  • Posts: 54
Re: Allocating wounds
« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2015, 10:34:45 PM »
But their ability is:Models from this unit heal 1 wound at the end of the combat phase if the unit slew any models during that phase.

So If they are attacked by multiple sources they could have say loose a model and have 1 knight on 1 wound and 1 knight on 2 wounds...end of combat and assuming they killed something 2 would get a wound back and the following hero phase1 slain knight is returned :D

Offline grobidrengi

  • Members
  • Posts: 27
Re: Allocating wounds
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2015, 06:44:38 AM »
You're right, I picked up on the standard only  :eusa_wall:

The Blood knights don't even run into the same problem as the Varghulfs, as each model heals a wound if the unit kills anything  :-)

So yeah, your Blood knights should benefit from such a reading of the rules.