Topic: Von Wissenhoff's Expeditionary, my first 2000 pt list

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I know, I don't usually do this, but I decided to ask for comments on my first shot at 2000 pts.

I've been playing the army at 1000 for a while and bolstering it up with Kislevites, but I think I can afford at least one 2000 pt. all-Imperial outfit. It's not going to be the most battle efficient, perhaps, and I am breaking my rule of no magic items, but I am limited by the models I have.

This is the preliminary version...the pistoliers and the uhlans aren't all done yet, and the pikemen are just being converted from spearmen right now.


1. Von Wissenhoff’s Own (513 pts)
Oberst Alexanders Von Wissenhoff (Captain), FPA, Sword of Justice, Enchanted Shield (93 pts) [General]
Kriegsmagus Vohlund Fledermaus Lvl.1 Shadows, Dispel Scroll x2 (110 pts)
23 Swordsmen, Full Command (186)
10 Halberdier det. (60 pts)
8 Archer det. (64 pts)

2. Von Wissenhoff’s Demipikes (447 pts)
Hauptmann Sigmund Ehrenwald (Captain), AoMI, Halberd (84 pts)
Kriegsmagus Ingemar Himmelszeichen Lvl.2 Heavens, RoP (140 pts)
18 Pikemen, heavy armour, Full Command (223 pts)

3. Ehrenwald’s Own Marksmen (228 pts)
14 Handgunners, champion, repeater handgun (132 pts)
6 Crossbow det. (48 pts)
6 Crossbow det. (48 pts)

4. Von Wissenhoff’s Artillery (250 pts)
Great Cannon (100 pts)
2 Mortars (150 pts)

5. Mountain Pine Brothers
5 Knights, Banner, Music, War Banner (152 pts)

6. Mountain Pine Novices
5 Knights (105 pts)

7. Wurzen First Uhlans
6 DOW Light Cav, Spears, Shields, Music (91 pts)

8. Oberst’s Own Dragoons
6 Pistoliers, champion, Repeater Pistol (161 pts)

9. Wurzen Jaeger Regiment
5 Huntsmen (50 pts)

1997 pts

I want to know how playable this list will be. If it's weak, oh well, I'm somewhat used to a defeat here or there. Still, I'd like to make something workable out of what I have.

Thanks in advance.

[cisse]

First of all: at 2000 points, you want an elector count. His extra point of leadership is really really helpful.

I see you' ve left places in your infantry regiments for your wizards. I wouldn't place them in there, a clever opponent will direct all his attacks at them and kill them (the sort of stuff I do with my pegasus captain, actually: make a suicidal charge, target the wizard, kill him and don't bother about losing combat-you'll outrun them probably).

Pikes are nice, but best in large units. Maybe add some more, to get a unit of say, 25, and drop the heavy armour-but that's a question of whatever you like best, more guys or slightly better protection.

Your unit of handgunners, combined with its detachments, will take up a LOT of spave in your battle line, since you'll want to deploy them in a single line to be able to fire. I'd drop one of the detachments, and take a unit of 10 with a detachment of 5 only.

The points cost of your knights is wrong; it should be 164 and 115. I'd give the captain (who is with the pikes) barded warhorse, full plate, lance and shield and have him join the first unit of knights. You have some very mobile units, and if one of them hits a bit harder, it would do better I think. Oh, and the points cost of your pistoliers is off too-should be 131 points.

Nice list, actually-allthough you have only one infantry unit with detachments, so it could be a bit ricky to play. Maybe try an oblique attack, that's what I would try with this kind of army.


good luck!

[RGB]

Yeah, I just noticed the costs were off. Wasn't at my most sober when I posted that.  

Thanks for the suggestions! I'll see what I can do then. As I said, previously I've played an infantry list at 1000 points, and this is a bit of a step up for me.

Cheers.

[Heinrich_the_Grim]

i think the idea of having pikemen and put your wizards in them!, since you will always strike first with them then you will easily be able to divert attacks against models who went on suicidal missions and kill them before they even touch the wizards!

[FrancisC05]

I like the way you wrote out the list. Id go for cannons over morters unless your playing a lot of horde armies. Id have 2 cannons and a hell blaster right now.

[Jester]

agreed....cannons are good.

[FR1DAY]

can't put empire characters in DOW units. swap them for a larger unit of spears without shield but with a CC det.

[RGB]

1. I hate my spearmen, although it's not anything rational, so pikemen they stay. The other captain will join the reserve knights unit.

2. Thanks for the rule clarification. I should have really double-checked before posting. I managed to get so many things wrong it's time to start feeling ashamed.

3. I could get 2 cannons, that's no problem. I have lots of cannons/mortars assembled, but only 3 crews, see? The mortar list and the cannon list are alternate to each other, that's all.

4. I'm limited by lack of models, slow painting and lots of university work/other commitments. Can't/don't want to make huge infantry regiments except by modifying what I already have.

5. My usual opponents are my WE captained by my live-in, a smallish O&G that I assembled but somebody else painted and plays, a rather shooty but still overall battallion style Empire army from somewhere that's not Ostland (no knights - but has pistoliers, DOW light cav, HBVG, 3 cannons, lots of infantry in neat blocks and lines with soft hats on), and a no-slann, no-monster, low-character, skink-and-saurus-heavy Lizardmen outfit. Mortars are worth taking against all of the above.

That was the rationale behind the list....for everyone that's contributed, thanks lots! I'm going to modify it and re-post it shortly.

[Jester]

that LM list sounds rough to face...Saurus are a pain and a half. Looking forward to seeing the new list.

[RGB]

The LM are the only ones I've not beaten yet. The WE are a distant second now that I've got knights.

[RGB]

Version 2:

[Mortar Version]

1. Von Wissenhoff’s Own (479 pts)
Oberst Alexanders Von Wissenhoff (EC), Dawn Armour, Sword of Battle, Shield (153 pts) [General]
23 Swordsmen, Full Command (186)
Second Company 10 Halberdier det. (60 pts)
Wurzen Freikorps 8 Archer det. (64 pts)

2.  League of Adventurous Gentlemen
Kriegsmagus Vohlund Fledermaus Lvl.1 Shadows, Dispel Scroll (85 pts)
Kriegsmagus Ingemar Himmelszeichen Lvl.2 Heavens, RoP (140 pts)

3. Von Wissenhoff’s Demipikes (265 pts)
24 Pikemen, light armour, Full Command

4. Ehrenwald’s Own Marksmen (140 pts)
10 Handgunners, champion, repeater handgun (100 pts)
Third Company 5 Crossbow det. (40 pts)

5. Von Wissenhoff’s Artillery (250 pts)
Kislev Cannon Great Cannon (100 pts)
The Barking Dogs 2 Mortars (150 pts)

6. Mountain Pine Brothers (242 pts)
5 Knights, Banner, Music, War Banner (164 pts)
Hauptmann Sigmund Ehrenwald (Captain), Horse, Barding, Shield, Lance, FPA (78 pts)

7. Mountain Pine Novices
5 Knights (115 pts)

8. Wurzen First Uhlans
6 DOW Light Cav, Spears, Shields, Music (91 pts)

9. Oberst’s Own Dragoons
6 Pistoliers, champion, Repeater Pistol (161 pts)

10. Wurzen Jaegerkorps
5 Huntsmen (50 pts)

2002 pts

[Cannon Version]

1. Von Wissenhoff’s Own (504 pts)
Oberst Alexanders Von Wissenhoff (EC), Dawn Armour, Sword of Battle, Shield (153 pts) [General]
23 Swordsmen, Full Command (186) War Banner (25 pts)
Second Company 10 Halberdier det. (60 pts)
Wurzen Freikorps 8 Archer det. (64 pts)

2.  League of Adventurous Gentlemen
Kriegsmagus Vohlund Fledermaus Lvl.1 Shadows, Dispel Scroll (85 pts)
Kriegsmagus Ingemar Himmelszeichen Lvl.2 Heavens, RoP (140 pts)

3. Von Wissenhoff’s Demipikes (265 pts)
24 Pikemen, light armour, Full Command

4. Ehrenwald’s Own Marksmen (140 pts)
10 Handgunners, champion, repeater handgun (100 pts)
Third Company 5 Crossbow det. (40 pts)

5. Von Wissenhoff’s Artillery (200 pts)
The Sisters 2 Great Cannon (100 pts)

6. Mountain Pine Brothers (242 pts)
5 Knights, Banner, Music, Steel Banner (164 pts)
Hauptmann Sigmund Ehrenwald (Captain), Horse, Barding, Shield, Lance, FPA (78 pts)

7. Mountain Pine Novices
5 Knights (115 pts)

8. Wurzen First Uhlans
6 DOW Light Cav, Spears, Shields, Music (91 pts)

9. Oberst’s Own Dragoons
6 Pistoliers, champion, Repeater Pistol (161 pts)

10. Wurzen Jaegerkorps
5 Huntsmen (50 pts)

2002 pts

This army is planned to be used in an oblique advance fashion.

Deployment:

Uhlans – Pikemen – Artillery – Gunners – Knights w/Captain – von Wissenhoff’s own – Vanilla Knights – Pistoliers.

Pistoliers and Vanilla knights advance ahead to threaten flanks, swordsmen march also, using archers as screen.
Gunners and artillery weaken the flank that I intend to attack, being positioned at a nice diagonal.
The big knights unit either protects the gunners or moves up to pincer whoever the advancing units are trying to engage.
Pikes hold the flank and only march up as needed. Uhlans are fast so they can get wherever I require them.
Jagers marchblock the artillery-laden flank.

Brief backstory:
- von Wissenhoff is from the south of the Empire, in service to the Graf of Ostland. His expeditionary force assisted the Kislevites in repelling the most recent invasion (with mixed success, judging by the way I play). A state pikemen regiment was formed by him using the money given by the Graf, because he’s used to pikemen. Same thing with swords, pistoliers and crossbows, who are also regulars in this case, instead of being drawn from the militia as in most other Ostlander forces.
- Ehrenwald is an Ostland nobleman, with Wurzen being one of the towns that used to belong to his family in its heyday. It doesn’t now. Why? Don’t ask.
- Wurzen maintains a large standing militia because armies going into Kislev or Ostermark often recruit there. It’s Uhlans are a point of pride.
- The wizards really are adventurous gentlemen. Upper class and looking forward to living in the rough for a change…except the Expedition has gone on far longer than they planned, so living in the rough has become humdrum. Still, gentelmen's honour prevents them from backing out of this litle pickle.
- The great cannon is Kislev-city-cast, to replace the one the battalion lost. That particular point is not reflected in the rules, except that in practice it blows up more often than a cannon should. Must be the Kislevite quality.
- Mountain Pine are a small Sigmarite order, affiliated with the Silver Mountain knights in Hochland. They’re in this for glory.

Real reasons for small, fat-heavy, squishy army:

- No time, little money, sick of 500-to-1000-pt battles. Disenchanted with infantry masses as longbows don’t care about tactics as long as you’re T3, AS5+. Have/can make the above-mentioned models (except the light cavalry that I’m still working on).

Please comment before I commit myself    

[Jester]

VERY nice.

biggest thing. Repeater handgun... look at the price of it w/ a marksman upgrade... look at the price of 3 handgunners

take the 3 handgunners.

[RGB]

Hm.

But it takes less deployment space. But then, i do have more handgunners than 10. Hmm.

3 handgunners it is. Although I heard Ostlanders do lie fancy weapons.

[cisse]

9. Oberst’s Own Dragoons
6 Pistoliers, champion, Repeater Pistol (161 pts)

6 pistoliers are 114 points, marksman with repeater pistol 17 points if I remember correctly... You've just saved 30 points!

[RGB]

Badong.

I'll get me more archers then! Wohoo.

[cisse]

What about dropping  one archer and get the L2 upgrade for the first battle wizard?

Oh, and I like the mortar version better.

[RGB]

Right. That would make it exactly 2000 pts as well, no?

I like the mortar version better too, since that was the originl plan.

[cisse]

I think that'd make it 1999 points (2002-8-30+35).
And there's just something fun about placing two large templates over enemy units-sure, they might scatter; sure, the enemy may be tough or have a high armour save, but odds are some will die.

[Jester]

2 morters are pretty accurate... look at the average scatter per... try it sometime, usually you end up covering 80-90% of a unit.