Topic: Undercoating Questions

[Midaski]

I recently saw a mention of something I had not seen before, where minis were sprayed with a white undercoat - lightly - and then give a light spray of black undercoat.
I cannot remember where I saw it now, but I think the suggestion was that it helped outline the details of the figure.

It does seem that we focus on the painting and you rarely see any guidance on undercoating.
When I spray I always try to remove all trace of bare metal in all nooks and crannies, but at the same time worry that I put too thick a coat on the figure.

Generally I spray black, but occasionally if I am looking for brighter colours (such as Landsknechts for example) I will use white. I have tried grey but not very confidently, and I ended up dusting it with black as I recall.

Interested to hear any comments or opinions.

[JAK]

Not heard of this but have known people spray black and then dry-brush white to leave black in the shadows.

Cannot see how a black spray would only get in the creases - a black wash over white would though?

I’ve only ever used a white primer so have no experience of either of the above methods. Closest I get to using black is as a pre-coat for metallics.

[GamesPoet]

Hadn't heard of black spray over white spray before.

Although on white spray, like JAK, I've pre-coated with black on areas where metals are painted.

I've used Black, Brown, Gray, and White sprays for priming.  Black creates a darker look to the paints on top, and can be used as black lining, too.  Brown I sometimes use for horses or obtaining a warm color tot he paints on top.  Gray can be darker or lighter and I use them in different situations, and as a way to soften the paint colors.  And White tends to make things brighter, while also providing a background for watered down paints to wash darker pigments into the crevices and create instant shading in one coat.

[Realjuan]

I cannot find a reason to do it this way. Primers are opaque right? If the second primer covers the first layer, then to my understanding the first layer is just taking space and has no visual effect. Else you have to prime over without covering the previous layer. Therefore, I would do the "light" after the proper layer.

If I wanted a lighter undercoat, then I would use grey primer.
If I wanted my raised areas to be lighter than my creases, then full black coat first and then a light spray over all the mini.
If I wanted to make lighter the area where the light is shinning then I would do a spray of white over the black, and only in that area. Or better yet prime one area black and the other white. No double layer.

I cannot paint to save my life so hoping someone with knowledge/experience brings light to this topic.

Some of what JAk says I could see working, and are worth trying out.

[Shadespyre]

I spray pretty much everything with GW Chaos Black, because it's what I've always used and I trust it to give me good coverage and a good finish. If I'm going to paint paler colours, I give a light overspray of white. I find this really does pick out the detail, though I've also dry-brushed white at times, instead.

I used army painter bone spray on the skeletons in my Vampire Counts army, which saves a lot of time but I had a lot of problems with their spray cans to be honest.

[Rogers Kul]

I do it, but in reseverse orden: first black and then white. The thing is to spray white only from obove the model.
By this way, shadow parts of the model will be darker before and after you paint the model, and the main benefits of black imprimation will remain the same (chainmails, for dry brush, unpainted parts...). But at same time the most illuminated parts of the model will be brighter. Ouch, it's difficult to explain it in english!

[ZeroTwentythree]

I do it, but in reseverse orden: first black and then white. The thing is to spray white only from obove the model.
By this way, shadow parts of the model will be darker before and after you paint the model, and the main benefits of black imprimation will remain the same (chainmails, for dry brush, unpainted parts...). But at same time the most illuminated parts of the model will be brighter. Ouch, it's difficult to explain it in english!

That's how I've heard it done by quite a few people, for exactly the reasons you describe. And it makes sense if your paints won't be totally opaque.

(I don't do it that way myself.)

[Midaski]

I think I probably got it the wrong way round then - I think it was mentioned in the same paragraph as 'zenithal' - does that make it clearer?

However it is interesting to discuss different ways - but what about coverage?
If you are using plain Black - do you just 'dust' the model or give it a solid coat?

[Rogers Kul]

Solid coat for black, "dusting coat" for white.
I have some models to undercoat, probably next week. I'll mke some photos to show you.

[Realjuan]

Yes, that makes it clear. In my opinion is a way to give your miniature the effect of the light source coming from x direction without changing how you use the colors on your mini. If you paint your armor X tone of blue, you can do your whole armor without having to worry where you light source would be. The lighter undercoat will come through enough that it will give the effect without you having to much thinking. The opposite would be to undercoat your whole mini with the same primer but then you have to paint keeping in mind where your lightsource is. Maybe do fewer layer, or use lighter blue in some areas, ect. Too much thinking. The best part is that after priming ALL and EVERY color will have the same degree of "light". You dont have to change the tones of color you use for x depending on the location of the miniature.

I would use this for miniatures with a lot of colors and with the idea of a light source. Lizardmen Dioramas?. I do not paint this way, I do not like to paint, base, etc to put my model in a define moment, location in time.

This is my opinion, and how I simplify this technique but I am sure someone else can provide better information.