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Author Topic: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia  (Read 17859 times)

Offline Mathi Alfblut

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #25 on: January 19, 2017, 08:49:25 PM »
They can make the fluff as good as they can. If it tells a shit tale it will be shit no matter the skill of the author.

Will we see The galaxy burn in the fires of Chaos and then devoured by The Nids? Highly probable.

The we step forward some thousand years so GW gets a clean slate. Remember GW removed the Space Marine statue outside HQ and put a Sigmarine there instead? A sign of things too come I believe.

In Dan Abnetts "Legion" the Cabal basically say that If the Emperor "won" against Horus the effects of Chaos finally breaking free will be overwhelming. But there was some hope for the Galaxy as a whole to recover If mankind was utterly destroyed then. Because the destruction of one of the most numerous species would hit back on Chaos itself.

And is that not a funny thing? GW have lived mostly on a steady diet of Space Marines. Everyone have some!
Now imagine the Imperium whiped out totally in a violent fury practically obliterating the species of Man.

But in steps Sigmar! Later on he launches his Stormcast to retake what once was from a much weaker Chaos.
But now Tau have moved on. More high tech than ever! But the big suprise is a new and expanding Aeldari empire. Using the exodite worlds as their base for retaking their galaxy. 10000 more years of preparations is nothing for them.



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Offline valmir

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #26 on: January 19, 2017, 10:06:11 PM »
They won't completely screw up the game.  40k is worth too much money and GW is doing absolutely fantastic financially now.  They won't kick over the apple cart.

This has been my working theory. Basically, that there is no compelling reason to shake sh....things up, because 40k is the breadwinner. But I do have a certain level of fear that GW's internals are suggesting that they lose a certain number of players to simpler games, or that there is a prohibitive barrier to entry, etc...

Which is not to suggest that I'm averse to a shake-up or a simplification. The 40k rules are tough to get one's head around (I'm still terrible), and there is an almost perverse emphasis on knowing the rules that belong to each individual codex/expansion. I do think it would be of benefit to the game if it were possible to be remotely competitive (not in the sense of "tournament-competitive", but rather in the sense of being able to play a tactically-solid game) without having to have memorised your opponent's codex (or, as is increasingly common, codices...).

This is a dumb-ass example, because honestly I should have known better, but the first game of the first 40k tournament I played in, I had no idea what a Grav Centurion was. Therefore, I had no idea how it was going to fu...mess me up, or how to counter it. I don't count this as a mega-beef, because the Grav rule is in the book. It's more that if you haven't faced it before, you have no intuitive sense of what it "means".

And this is the thing - the main problem with 40k is that you need to have played a bunch of 40k to be able to play it properly. And I don't know how to solve that "issue", but I certainly don't trust GW to be able to do it well...
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Offline phillyt

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #27 on: January 19, 2017, 10:53:19 PM »
And this is the thing - the main problem with 40k is that you need to have played a bunch of 40k to be able to play it properly. And I don't know how to solve that "issue", but I certainly don't trust GW to be able to do it well...

I think they are using the specialty games like Space Hulk, the Assassin game, and others to serve as a gateway for new players.  It will be interesting to see if they can simplify a little while keeping the strategy.  I believe they can.

Mathi:  They won't let Chaos crush the galaxy.  I hold out hope that they will use this as an excuse to kill the Emperor and we see what comes next.

My desire is for Chaos to get a foot hold and the stakes to rise, the primarchs come back, and the Emperor moves to the next level.
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Offline Mathi Alfblut

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #28 on: January 20, 2017, 07:59:20 AM »
Me and my sons loyalist vs loyalist conflict will go from unusal But happens to totally unrealistic! Any surviving Imperium remants will be on constant war footing and totally united against a mortal threat.

I like the way things are. They are good because there is plenty of scope for two loyalist worlds to be at war with each other.
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Offline Xathrodox86

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #29 on: January 20, 2017, 09:17:05 AM »
No one believed that Chaos would triumph during the End Times, and yet...
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Offline Sig

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #30 on: January 20, 2017, 09:29:38 AM »
The Emperor has significant divine power in this book - moving him to the next level is possible. He is without a doubt already a god, or god in waiting.

I don't think they're going to scrap Space Marines, Mathi. The lost licensing opportunities alone are staggering. But a new mark of power armour, very different to the current? I could see that.

Offline Artobans Ghost

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #31 on: January 20, 2017, 12:10:21 PM »
Don't the Grey Knights have  a book or special container that is if all else fails use this. Maybe the knights sacrifice themselves to resserect the Emporer much the same as he was created in the beginning by a ritual combining a group of shamans. My knowledge of this is sparse but I think I heard this from a diehard player years ago. There Guilliman in stasis but somehow slowly regenerating and lion el in the centre of the rock and maybe Russ following the Wulfen from the warp -  that's 3 of the big names waiting to return. And maybe Vulkin who is unkillable but I'm not sure where he is. 
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Offline phillyt

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #32 on: January 20, 2017, 12:12:44 PM »
Yes, they have the Terminus Decree.  Nobody knows what it really is though.

Mathi:  The Imperium is already totally in a war footing situation.  I think the arrival of the Primarchs might end up pushing the Imperium further apart.  There are elements within the Imperium that don't want to have the Primarchs around.
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Offline Gankom

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #33 on: January 20, 2017, 04:13:57 PM »
Not to mention its a big galaxy with a lot of tension. Perhaps there's a planetary governor who wants to take advantage of all this mess to try and annex a nearby world. Perhaps a group of loyalist marines get spooked and think an Imperial Guard army is a bit to chaotic for their taste and has to be purged without waiting for confirmation.

There's always going to be plenty of story telling possibilities for loyalists vs loyalists no matter what happens. Plus I'm with Philly about the primarchs. If any come back its just going to cause more division. If multiple come back, they might be fighting each other as well.

Offline Darknight

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #34 on: January 20, 2017, 07:42:38 PM »
I see no reason why they won't have 30K, 40K, and 41K as three separate settings, all playable with fundamentally the same rules.

They also support Horus Heresy (and are doing so in plastic now). I could easily see them saying the standard setting is 41K after the Emperor dies or whatever, but you can use the rules and armies to represent games BEFORE the fall of Terra or whatever.
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Offline Mathi Alfblut

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #35 on: January 20, 2017, 09:30:28 PM »
Note that Russ will only come back for The Wolf time. The final battle. Ragnarok. There will be nothing left. We are probably looking at a new setting at least a thousand years from the precent.

Since AoS was such a huge succes why would GW not repeat it? If it made the dwindling fantasy come back, imagine what it would do for a succesful branch like 40K?

A game with less minis, along the lines of Kill team.

A game were Get Started boxes will give you an Army and not just a decent start. Then let Forge world handle the nostalgia.

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Offline GamesPoet

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #36 on: January 20, 2017, 10:45:29 PM »
How much has AoS really been a success?  Oh, wait, maybe that for a different thread. :icon_lol:

Russ might return, if GW changes the fluff, and we all know they never do that. :icon_wink:

Get Started boxes could happen without any changes to fluff.
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Offline Mathi Alfblut

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #37 on: January 21, 2017, 03:08:34 PM »
There are strong indications Russ WILL return. And if GW do not want to have a true End time scenario they will have to rewrite his fluff because it is very much a Ragnarok fluff. Hence, if Russ comes back. It is for the final showdown that will end in doom. Just as Ragnarok. Nothing wrong with that for the Sons of Russ, since they are just as happy to fight to the death as long  as it is done with honour. A bit of an Orky view there. And a VERY viking one.

But if Robotue gets back, well, that is different.

Is there any primarch that have a more King Arthur style history? That according to fluff will "Save the Imperium" or "Save mankind"?
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Offline Artobans Ghost

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #38 on: January 21, 2017, 05:17:28 PM »
There are strong indications Russ WILL return. And if GW do not want to have a true End time scenario they will have to rewrite his fluff because it is very much a Ragnarok fluff. Hence, if Russ comes back. It is for the final showdown that will end in doom. Just as Ragnarok. Nothing wrong with that for the Sons of Russ, since they are just as happy to fight to the death as long  as it is done with honour. A bit of an Orky view there. And a VERY viking one.

But if Robotue gets back, well, that is different.

Is there any primarch that have a more King Arthur style history? That according to fluff will "Save the Imperium" or "Save mankind"?

Thanks Mathi for the clarification. I like that Viking sentiment very much. The Wolves style is right up my alley.
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Offline phillyt

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #39 on: January 21, 2017, 07:42:15 PM »
I don't think they will go that far with 40k because unlike Fantasy, they aren't struggling to sell piles of models. 

Russ could return and it could be the Ragnarok style war, it just doesn't necessarily mean that it would be a total end but potentially a new beginning.
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Offline Mathi Alfblut

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #40 on: January 21, 2017, 10:03:38 PM »
For it to be Ragnarök, it MUST be a total ending. The destruction of the Gods.
Sigmarverse is very True to a Ragnarök. It is both a total End AND a new Beginning.

A way of Ragnarök that is possible is for example that The Imperium burns in the fires of War. Chaos Charles but The eldars are now in a comeback mode. Necrons also go for Chaos. And the Nids and Orkz.
But in the reaches of the East, a pocket of mankind survives thanks to Robotue Guilliman and Ulthramar. And Tau. That I could give you as a Total End and new beginning.
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Offline Gankom

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #41 on: January 22, 2017, 12:38:09 AM »
I think it's far more likely they'll have primarchs return and Ragnarok to start, then pause it again there. It seems like they don't want to end the setting, they just want to move it a few more minutes forward.

Offline phillyt

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #42 on: January 23, 2017, 11:54:44 AM »
An end to the way of things is in many ways a Ragnarok.  It doesn't need to be the literal end, just a metaphorical end.

And end of the old ways.  An end to the 10,000 years of stagnation.  The Eldar are uniting, Ynnead is returning.  Slaanesh looks like she will be consumed from the appearance of the model.  I think the primarchs return and something happens to the emperor.
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Offline Xathrodox86

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #43 on: January 23, 2017, 12:08:37 PM »
An end to the way of things is in many ways a Ragnarok.  It doesn't need to be the literal end, just a metaphorical end.

And end of the old ways.  An end to the 10,000 years of stagnation.  The Eldar are uniting, Ynnead is returning.  Slaanesh looks like she will be consumed from the appearance of the model.  I think the primarchs return and something happens to the emperor.

Ol' Empy will probably get whacked and then restored, over a certain period of time, of course.
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Offline FR1DAY

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #44 on: January 23, 2017, 12:57:22 PM »
The Aeldari killing Slaanesh will also get around those issues of adult content associated with it. Also explain why there are no models on the horizon for it.
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Offline rufus sparkfire

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #45 on: January 23, 2017, 01:16:11 PM »
The Aeldari killing Slaanesh will also get around those issues of adult content associated with it. Also explain why there are no models on the horizon for it.

Sex is adult content, but killing people totally isn't.  :icon_razz:
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Offline Xathrodox86

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #46 on: January 23, 2017, 02:09:45 PM »
The Aeldari killing Slaanesh will also get around those issues of adult content associated with it. Also explain why there are no models on the horizon for it.

Sex is adult content, but killing people totally isn't.  :icon_razz:

I know, right? Typical GW BS logic... :icon_rolleyes:
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Offline Gankom

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #47 on: January 23, 2017, 04:48:34 PM »
I don't think Slanny is going to get whacked or absorbed, probably just weakened.

Offline phillyt

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #48 on: January 23, 2017, 10:43:04 PM »
Why does Ynnead look like she is half Slaanesh though?  Thats the reason I think there is some legitimacy to it.
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Offline Sig

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Re: Gathering Storm - Fall of Cadia
« Reply #49 on: January 24, 2017, 03:37:28 AM »
Yeah, if he absorbs Eldar souls, maybe he absorbs those bound to Slaanesh too. That might be how he kills her, by weakening her that way.