Author Topic: TEG5: Empire Tactical Thread (Read 66675 times)

George · « **Reply #50 on:** August 13, 2013, 04:18:54 AM »

Happy to help if you want Noght.
I had offered to step up if no one else was interested....but as I ran the Ogres in the the last TEG I was going to let someone else have a go.
I have talked a mate (Playonwords) into joining the thread to help out as he runs cav armies and I haven't really run an empire army in ages.... I'm also an infantry not cav player

How about you take control for now and just let us know when you want us to jump in and take over the decision making.
I'm sure all in the thread will have plenty of ideas as well so you won't be short on support.

Holy Hand Grenade · « **Reply #51 on:** August 13, 2013, 04:20:34 AM »

Quote from: Playonwords on August 13, 2013, 12:02:29 AM

George has just invited me to join the Empire team, if thats ok with all you guys. I have some experience with all cav empire armies, though that Foxtrot list isnt at all what id pick - looks like itd be really fun to play however.

George's word is good enough for me!

We will do a dual General of Noght and George.

Playonwords, you can be a Lieutenant along with anyone else Noght or George wants. Of course- all team member input is encouraged and needed!

Don't let the list scare you away- it is going to take some strategy to pull off- but I have given the list a try a couple of times, once against a dual Frostheart HE list, and it has never let me down yet. You have to get creative, but that is what TEGs are all about.

HHG

Playonwords · « **Reply #52 on:** August 13, 2013, 07:13:00 AM »

Im happy with that. Now im keen to get started. I can see im going to waste a lot of time following this - but in a good way of course.

George · « **Reply #53 on:** August 13, 2013, 08:20:03 AM »

To get this thing up and running I think we play with HHGs list as is so we don't get too bogged down with tweaking.
That said I have no objections to any changes people can agree on quickly.

Having been involved in the last TEG I know it flows better if decisions made quickly and as such some get made before everyone can provide input. My advice for all people who want to have input is to try and think ahead.
Basically try to discuss what you think the elves are going to do in their turn and how you would react. Also planning out our entire turn with what ifs based on how the dice may fall. This way when they here is a decision to be made we have already discussed our options and everyone gets to have input.

Noght · « **Reply #54 on:** August 13, 2013, 10:51:29 AM »

Quote from: Holy Hand Grenade on August 13, 2013, 04:20:34 AM

Quote from: Playonwords on August 13, 2013, 12:02:29 AM
George has just invited me to join the Empire team, if thats ok with all you guys. I have some experience with all cav empire armies, though that Foxtrot list isnt at all what id pick - looks like itd be really fun to play however.

George's word is good enough for me!

We will do a dual General of Noght and George.

Playonwords, you can be a Lieutenant along with anyone else Noght or George wants. Of course- all team member input is encouraged and needed!

Don't let the list scare you away- it is going to take some strategy to pull off- but I have given the list a try a couple of times, once against a dual Frostheart HE list, and it has never let me down yet. You have to get creative, but that is what TEGs are all about.

HHG

Works for me.

Lord Solar Plexus · « **Reply #55 on:** August 13, 2013, 10:56:50 AM »

Agree with George. I'm happy to see you and Noght at the helm; if I can help a bit steering us clear of trouble, I will provide input. Let's keep the list as is.

Welcome, playonwords! Good to have you on board, too!

Foxtrot will be a real challenge to play if they actually show up with double FP's, and I fear the chance is high. All I see capable of killing one is a lonely cannon. A Captasus has a slim chance if he's buffed with +3 T and more attacks but that's hard to get through. That leaves a massive combo charge for static res and max attacks...not that we can bring all that much combat res to bear...but perhaps we just get lucky.

Holy Hand Grenade · « **Reply #56 on:** August 13, 2013, 11:32:11 AM »

I took down one Frostie with a Stank round and charge and took down the other with a unit of 3 Captasus with a Wildform on the charge.

My opponent was worried about Savage Beasts, so I got one of my Wildforms off....

After you see their list, I will post some of what I have done with the list- then it is all up to you!

I will post the scenario, terrain and lists tomorrow- and then we will start deployment!

HHG

Lord Solar Plexus · « **Reply #57 on:** August 13, 2013, 01:05:28 PM »

Yeah, there are a few possibilities (just not a unit of Captasi, that's not allowed). I'm just worried he'll kill one first and 6 S7 attacks will only cause a wound if his ward isn't boosted. Nevermind, I'm probably worrying too much.

Noght · « **Reply #58 on:** August 13, 2013, 01:18:28 PM »

I'd like to get the BSB off a Peg and into a unit of Knights to support the DGs and other Knights. Do we need the 2nd Battle Wizard? Minor tweaks might be nice.

Lord Solar Plexus · « **Reply #59 on:** August 13, 2013, 02:12:30 PM »

You're the CiC, do as you please. I would keep the changes to a minimum though. Remember, the second wizard gives a second Wyldform - very very useful in this list.

Holy Hand Grenade · « **Reply #60 on:** August 13, 2013, 02:59:47 PM »

What prevents the Capts from forming their own unit? Characters can form their own units in 8th.

Also, the BSB can join a Demi unit- we don't have to take him off the Peg.

Plus, as long as our big Demi unit has 5 in it, all the Peg riders will get look out sir rolls near it.

Fidelis von Sigmaringen · « **Reply #61 on:** August 13, 2013, 03:15:10 PM »

BRB p. 97:

Unless otherwise stated, a character cannot join a unit of monsters (too much danger of being stood on), a unit of flyers (too many ill-disciplined wings buffeting the sky), a unit of chariots (too much danger of being run over), a unit of swarms (too much chance of being eaten) or a war machine (too much danger of being obliterated).

Holy Hand Grenade · « **Reply #62 on:** August 13, 2013, 03:37:57 PM »

Hmm. I guess I am used to Lizzies and their Skink Chiefs- but I see that you are right.

This does take away one of our options against the Frosthearts.

We could always add another STank- I originally was trying to avoid the easy option.

I did some quick tweaks on army builder- we can add STank by dropping the 5 Demi's to 4, dropping one Captasus, and switching the Lvl 4 Mage to a horse for better protection.

This will give us two cannon and the Str 10 beast nuke, if we roll it.

If interested, I will post the complete list once I am done traveling today. Please post your opinion- keep the original or add the STank?

Noght · « **Reply #63 on:** August 13, 2013, 04:26:00 PM »

Quote from: Lord Solar Plexus on August 13, 2013, 02:12:30 PM

You're the CiC, do as you please. I would keep the changes to a minimum though. Remember, the second wizard gives a second Wyldform - very very useful in this list.

Minor tweaks is all. You are right on that, I'll chat with George.

Quote from: Holy Hand Grenade on August 13, 2013, 03:37:57 PM

Please post your opinion- keep the original or add the STank?

Essentially unchanged.

grifter · « **Reply #64 on:** August 13, 2013, 07:25:30 PM »

Quote from: Fidelis von Sigmaringen on August 13, 2013, 03:15:10 PM

BRB p. 97:

Unless otherwise stated, a character cannot join a unit of monsters (too much danger of being stood on), a unit of flyers (too many ill-disciplined wings buffeting the sky), a unit of chariots (too much danger of being run over), a unit of swarms (too much chance of being eaten) or a war machine (too much danger of being obliterated).

The Captasus wouldn´t be joining a unit of flyers though. They´d be forming a unit of characters mounted on flyers. Completely different thing. Captasi-unit is definitly a possibility.

Noght · « **Reply #65 on:** August 13, 2013, 07:43:34 PM »

Quote from: grifter on August 13, 2013, 07:25:30 PM

Quote from: Fidelis von Sigmaringen on August 13, 2013, 03:15:10 PM
BRB p. 97:

Unless otherwise stated, a character cannot join a unit of monsters (too much danger of being stood on), a unit of flyers (too many ill-disciplined wings buffeting the sky), a unit of chariots (too much danger of being run over), a unit of swarms (too much chance of being eaten) or a war machine (too much danger of being obliterated).

The Captasus wouldn´t be joining a unit of flyers though. They´d be forming a unit of characters mounted on flyers. Completely different thing. Captasi-unit is definitly a possibility.

Nope. Can't join flyers. I wouldn't do that anyway.

Fidelis von Sigmaringen · « **Reply #66 on:** August 13, 2013, 07:52:41 PM »

A unit of flyers is short for a unit that has the Fly special rule. A Captasus is both a character and a unit that has the Fly special rule. It therefore cannot join another unit with the Fly special rule - in this case, another Captasus.

George · « **Reply #67 on:** August 13, 2013, 09:24:27 PM »

Personally i didn't think that the captasus could make a unit either.

I am tempted to keep the BSB on the Peg....I have been meaning to test this out at some point as I love having a Captasus in the army, but I am often struggling on points to fit him in and this would be one way to make it work. I feel we get the benefit of having him where we need at teh right time....or if we choose to charge him into somethign he carries the extra combat res. ...assuming you get a flank charge off he already has 3 static res and with his AS will not take too many hits back. This means he could often break even tougher opponents. That may even be enough to chase off a frosty if we get lucky!

I would also keep the L2 on beasts. This ensures we also get Amber spear which is our 2nd Cannon and double wildform is a huge threat. Even flock will seriously hurt any small elite units of elves.

Fidelis von Sigmaringen · « **Reply #68 on:** August 13, 2013, 09:33:49 PM »

+ 3 CR? I must be missing something - I count only two (Flank Attack and BSB).

Noght · « **Reply #69 on:** August 13, 2013, 09:39:41 PM »

Quote from: Fidelis von Sigmaringen on August 13, 2013, 09:33:49 PM

+ 3 CR? I must be missing something - I count only two (Flank Attack and BSB).

Charge.

Fidelis von Sigmaringen · « **Reply #70 on:** August 13, 2013, 10:01:58 PM »

Ah yes, I was assuming that his Flank Attack would be in support of another charge. I myself would certainly refrain from having my BSB charge alone into CC - he is much too valuable for that.

George · « **Reply #71 on:** August 13, 2013, 11:27:15 PM »

Nothing is too valueable

If the BSB is the right tool in the right place then that's what I'd use....the key is making his sacrifice worth it.

Also having played against Sammy's list which this one is based on he was happy to run it without the BSB. The idea is nothing is too valuable to lose and as the army was often spreadout the BSB wouldn't be where he wanted it.
I think the BSB is important and being on the peg lets us get to the right places. In this list we have slightly more valuable units where his reroll will be handy....but I think we can do fine without him if we decide to use him aggressively.

Holy Hand Grenade · « **Reply #72 on:** August 13, 2013, 11:36:06 PM »

Seems like everyone is happy with the list as is.

At the very least, take off the Ironcurse Icon from the one Captasus since they can't run together...I recommend putting the Gleaming Pennant on the big Demi group since they have a Standard.

Easy day.

Playonwords · « **Reply #73 on:** August 13, 2013, 11:37:42 PM »

Whether or not to add a second stank and make the changes talked about, i wanted to ask: Do these games allow things like railroading? (as well as a whole host of other questionable tactics like skirmisher contraction, double-flee, conga-line into buildings etc?). Im not too fussed either way, as long as both sides are agreed.

The only reason i mention is that a stank can easily be railroaded to have virtually no influence on the game. High elves have access to eagles and cheap reavers which can do this VERY well. Having 1 stank neutralised might be salvagable - having 2 would not be.

An alternative to this would be to get another ordinary cannon. Its a cheaper solution (allowing us to keep most of our other options) and still works very well in an otherwise all-cavalry army.

Ive never tried a BSB on peg before, but as George said in theory it works well. Id give it a go.

George · « **Reply #74 on:** August 14, 2013, 12:06:12 AM »

Without bogging this thread down in discussion on what questionable tactics are acceptable, as everyone's views are different. I only make plays I would be happy to use in a tourney setting myself and won't complain if something I'd chose not to do is used against me.
For what its worth I believe the double flee is a legitimate tactic.

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Author Topic: TEG5: Empire Tactical Thread (Read 66675 times)