Author Topic: getting into 40k (Read 6285 times)

Blindseer03 · « **on:** November 08, 2011, 02:19:15 AM »

hi everyone, i have a question concerning starting 40k. a friend and i are planning on giving 40k a try. Im a longtime fantasy empire player but we're wanting to try something different. I've been putting off stating 40k for about a year hoping the necrons would get an update and finally they have. i havent had a chance to get the codex yet so i dont know the stats or tricks for the units. my question is what is a small bare bones starting army for someone new to the game that can get my friend and i acquainted with the rules. I would prefer as small as possible just to make sure i dont spend a bunch of money on something we wont enjoy and also so we dont get in over our heads with a bunch of new rules. It doesnt have to be a winning army or even good, i can work on that after i have the rules down. Thanks for the help

GamesPoet · « **Reply #1 on:** November 08, 2011, 02:42:45 AM »

Are you talking 500, 750, 1,000 points?

Blindseer03 · « **Reply #2 on:** November 08, 2011, 03:18:21 AM »

i guess a 500, i dont know if theres even a minimum points allowed for a game. just an army that you think would be good to help me learn the basics for everything.

Aldaris · « **Reply #3 on:** November 08, 2011, 09:15:44 AM »

How about this for 500?

*************** 1 HQ ***************

Overlord (goes with Immortals. Has very good armor and a strong cc weapon)
- Warscythe
- Sempiternal Weave
- - - > 115

Royal Court
+ - Harbinger of the Storm (he flies with the Warriors in the Ark)
- - - > 25

*************** 2 Troops ***************

9 Necron Warriors
+ - Ghost Ark
- - - > 232

5 Immortals
- Tesla Carbines
- - - > 85

*************** 1 Fast Attack ***************

3 Scarabs
- - - > 45

502 Points

This isn't too heavy on the wallet - you'll need an Overlord Model, one Cryptek Model, one box of Warriors (3 Scarab bases are in the same box), one box of Immortals, one Ghost Ark.

That should be fun to play, gives you some variation of units and is reasonably strong.

Hope that helps!

Crimsonsphinx · « **Reply #4 on:** November 08, 2011, 11:50:25 AM »

Alternatively, you could just buy 2 boxes of tactical marines and a marine captain model. That is also fairly cheap, a good start to any marine army of any flavour [apart from spacewolves/blacktemplars I guess]

The advantage of marines is you know you WILL get a new codex every single edition, and it will be well supported in terms of new models, as they are GWs big money earning list. Also they are incredibly forgiving in rules terms, with good armour, good access to weapons, easy to assemble and paint.

All this from me, and I don't even have a marine army, although I do have chaos marines. I just beleive they are the best starting army for everyone.

GamesPoet · « **Reply #5 on:** November 08, 2011, 12:37:49 PM »

The Assault on Black Reach starter set even has a mini rule book. Besides some space marines, it also provides some orks, so you get two different teams in the 500 point range for you and an opponent.

Aldaris · « **Reply #6 on:** November 08, 2011, 01:01:59 PM »

Telling him to get Marines when he asked for Necron advice might be a bit off-topic, gentlemen.

Although it is true, almost every 40K player will get some flavor of Marines at some point, and Black Reach is indeed a good deal.

Crimsonsphinx · « **Reply #7 on:** November 08, 2011, 01:55:15 PM »

Hi Aldaris,

I know he asked for Necrons, I thought that advice was covered quite well by you, so I thought I would add some alternative information.
Necrons will in all probability go best part of a decade with this book, Marines will get a new one every 3 or so years.

Blindseer03 · « **Reply #8 on:** November 08, 2011, 04:03:49 PM »

Thank you very much for the advice, that sounds like a great starting list and will probably be what i get. Are transports an important part of an army? I must have skipped over that part in the rulebook somehow. Also are destroyers crap now, I would hate to see them left on the wayside. i've adored those models from the first time i saw the army, as well as the wraith models. God i pray the new ones dont have feet.

as for the marines, that is the army my friend had decided on, he was torn between regular marines or blood angels, and also imperial guard. i really didnt want to have the same army as him. besides that, i fell in love with the necron models and also dont like being the army that everyone and their grandma seems to play, atleast not as my starting army.

once i have this starter army bought and ready and the rules down, what would you suggest i get to fill it out?
Thanks again

Aldaris · « **Reply #9 on:** November 08, 2011, 04:17:09 PM »

I'll tell you when I have some games under my belt myself with the 'Crons. While I do have experience with 40K as a whole, I'm only starting them myself.

And Destroyers certainly still seem usable.

Regarding transports, not every army needs them (I feel Necrons will be able to do fine without them, but Imight be wrong), but they have gotten immensely popular in 5th edition for several reasons: one, the vehicle damage rules were changed compared to 4th edition, making vehicles tougher and mitigating damage to passengers when a transport went up in flames and two, the game changed from the simple "kill as much as you can" of earlier editions to an objective based game, giving mobile and well protected troops choices a key role in winning battles.

Blindseer03 · « **Reply #10 on:** November 08, 2011, 04:34:26 PM »

the reason i asked was when my friend and i start out, we probably wont use objectives, just kill each others armies in a short game to test out the units and rules, but will go to objectives after we feel comfortable. i would hate with such a small points game for him to get a lucky shot off on a transport and kill most of my army, but since the rules have changed to help that not happen i can see the usefulness and feel alittle more at ease.

Crimsonsphinx · « **Reply #11 on:** November 08, 2011, 04:40:52 PM »

Hi Blindseer03,

Transports usually are the safest place for soldiers to be. Even if they blow up, the damage dealt to the people is fairly low, unless your men inside are say guardsmen. Most toughness 4 units with good save units, like Necrons or marines would be unlucky to even lose a single model.

I cant comment specifically on the Necrons, I haven't read the new book, but their transport appears to have incredibly high armour, due to the force field [this is taken from WD, I am sure someone on here can confirm if this is true]

I say this as someone who is a definite fan of transports though. The Necron one is open topped, so all the Necrons should be able to fire out of it, while taking no damage back in return. Sounds a good thing to me.

Blindseer03 · « **Reply #12 on:** November 08, 2011, 04:48:22 PM »

well that does sound good

If i didnt take a transport (which now i'm pretty sure i will) i was thinking an annihilation barge, to help me learn the rules for vehicles and shooting with them, but im not sure how it would fit into a small game or how well it would perform

Aldaris · « **Reply #13 on:** November 08, 2011, 04:57:11 PM »

A transport is a vehicle too, and the Ghost Ark is armed pretty well for a glorified flying bus.

One of the reasons I was suggesting the list above: A shooty troops choice (with rapid fire weapons and a guy who shoots Haywire grenades attached) in an oppen-topped vehicle, a unit of beasts (who are also swarms), and a Marines-y unit on foot which can shoot (with assault weapons) and has a fairly fighty character attached.

Very educational!

Blindseer03 · « **Reply #14 on:** November 08, 2011, 04:59:54 PM »

oh i didnt even know the ghost ark was armed, i thought it relied on the troops inside to shoot. well thats a whole different story then. ghost ark it is.

Aldaris · « **Reply #15 on:** November 08, 2011, 05:12:17 PM »

The Ghost Ark has 5 Gauss Flayers on each Broadside, so basically the same as if 5 Warriors were shooting from there. And both broadsides can target independently (which vehicle weapons normally cannot do).

Blindseer03 · « **Reply #16 on:** November 08, 2011, 05:17:51 PM »

concerning the broadside arrays, is there a point in the front where both firing arcs meet? and can all the troops inside shot out while the ark is firing?or is it limited? im liking this ghost ark more and more.

Aldaris · « **Reply #17 on:** November 08, 2011, 05:21:37 PM »

You'd have to check LOS on the actual model, but I think unless your target is very wide you won't be able to shoot both broadsides at it.

The Ghost Ark is open topped, meaning every passenger can shoot out as long as it doesn't move faster than combat speed, along with its guns. But I think for detailed rules about vehicles, shooting, transports and all the other good stuff I would recommend reading the rulebook.

And yes, the Ark is very good, but you pay for it too. It's about three times as expensive as a space marine Rhino.

Crimsonsphinx · « **Reply #18 on:** November 08, 2011, 05:40:08 PM »

For its abilities Aldaris, that sounds more than reasonable. I was expecting points around the cost of a Leman Russ to be honest!

Aldaris · « **Reply #19 on:** November 08, 2011, 06:09:20 PM »

That would have been way too expensive, but the 115 it actually costs are fine. Now, if only Immortals could ride in one... *sniffle*

phillyt · « **Reply #20 on:** November 08, 2011, 08:59:39 PM »

I think the ark is barely pointed correctly. The fact that only warriors and characters can ride in it, the fact that only warriors can be repaired, and the poor armor value makes it a good point cost, but only just.

I actually like destroyers quite a lot.

Finlay · « **Reply #21 on:** November 09, 2011, 12:27:28 AM »

Quote from: PhillyT on November 08, 2011, 08:59:39 PM

I think the ark is barely pointed correctly. The fact that only warriors and characters can ride in it, the fact that only warriors can be repaired, and the poor armor value makes it a good point cost, but only just.

I actually like destroyers quite a lot.

Poor armor value?

massively negated by quantum shielding.

phillyt · « **Reply #22 on:** November 09, 2011, 12:29:52 AM »

Even then it is only one point over a chimera. Once that goes down it is at rhino level!

Finlay · « **Reply #23 on:** November 09, 2011, 12:34:26 AM »

3 better side armour than a chimera.

one less front than a leman russ, and the same side armour and rear armour as a leman russ, and in fact one more rear armour than half the russes (unless I am mistaken in the av 11 all round)

How is it not well armoured, for a transport? when it has the same total armour value as half the russes, and one less than the bigger russes.

It is a lot of points, but quantum shielding is good.

phillyt · « **Reply #24 on:** November 09, 2011, 12:36:06 AM »

Compare it to your hated Devilfish though. 35 points more, two less transport capacity, limited to only a single model type for transport, and open topped.

115 is exactly what it should cost.

News:

Author Topic: getting into 40k (Read 6285 times)