Topic: 2k list

[commandant]

Maybe. I didn't play a lot of 8th. It wasn't my favorite edition.

I might have only played 15-20 games

[Zygmund]

In 8th edition I'm pretty sure banners stacked. Which is the only edition I played except for 2 games in 6th before i decided I hated no steadfast and front rank dying , then quit.

In the 8th ed, only the battle standard stacked. Otherwise just one standard per combat. Checked the 8th ed rulebook on this.

IIRC in the 9th age standards stacked. At least in one iteration some years back.

-Zyg

[emcdunna]

I think the grand Master is overcosted by a lot. A bretonian baron isn't even that good but he's better than a grand Master and cheaper.

You are paying a huge (I estimate 40 points) premium for rhe immune to psychology rule and if you don't put him into a big knight unit, it seems pointless

I also don't see how you get any VPs out of the enemy list when you have 500 pts of chaff that they will sweep up for points

[Warlord]

I also don't see how you get any VPs out of the enemy list when you have 500 pts of chaff that they will sweep up for points

The knights aren't chaff. They are combined charging things, and actually fairly hard to counter due to their speed and armour.

[Zygmund]

I also don't see how you get any VPs out of the enemy list when you have 500 pts of chaff that they will sweep up for points

The knights aren't chaff. They are combined charging things, and actually fairly hard to counter due to their speed and armour.

Sounds meta related. Do you ever play against shooting Dwarfs or NG Fanatics spam?

-Zyg

[commandant]

I also don't see how you get any VPs out of the enemy list when you have 500 pts of chaff that they will sweep up for points

The knights aren't chaff. They are combined charging things, and actually fairly hard to counter due to their speed and armour.

Sounds meta related. Do you ever play against shooting Dwarfs or NG Fanatics spam?

-Zyg

I find most things meta dependant though. This list will also suffer against magic missiles and helblasters. Part of the problem is there are few if any wound soaks

[The Peacemaker]

Yep shooting might be a problem. But the move and armour makes up for it. Lose 1-2 units of knights, then combo charge. Even a couple knights left in a unit adds some attacks and close order. ...and juicy flank charges.
Against a very shooty dwarf list that castles in corner I would just sit in my corner too I guess, played more than my fair share of boring games like that. But that's GW games for ya.

Putting the knights in a big unit doesn't add anything. They become harder to move with a wider frontage, same points, rank bonus is meh. Swapping for expensive State troops means they will be shot at for another 2 turns plus a stand and shoot. I'd totally take infantry with Brets men at arms.

As I've been tweaking the list, I too found the Grand Master to be overcosted. A BSB on Griffin with Warbanner and a lance is cheaper and has Fly....
But the GrandMaster is really for the Magic Weapon and his base stats, especially the high Initiative. And 2+save. He does alright. But maybe more basic Demigryphs is better? Or a Cannon + engineer.


 

[Warlord]

Putting the knights in a big unit doesn't add anything. They become harder to move with a wider frontage, same points, rank bonus is meh. Swapping for expensive State troops means they will be shot at for another 2 turns plus a stand and shoot. I'd totally take infantry with Brets men at arms.

Especially considering 2 units of knights adds +2 for Close Order, which can be kept regardless of unit size, compared to a big unit with +1 Close Order and +1 Banner.

[The Peacemaker]

So this is my updated list.
I dropped champions on the demigryphs except for the wizarding hat one. This is because demigryph champs do to much damage and I don't want enemy locking one of my champs in a challenge.
This does place more emphasis on my core knights charging combats with my characters in order to take any challenges. But I think thats ok since I only got 2 characters.

Wizard swapped the mace for ogre blade. It's still decent. Even If I don't roll the doppleganger spell it's still strong on combat.

I got a couple units of knights with stubborn to be good chaff.

Stank has pigeon bombs because I got extra points. I could take it out if I need something else.

he Empire of Man - Demigryph - [2000pts]
# Main Force [2000pts]
## Characters [655pts]

Captain of the Empire [240pts]: Hand Weapon, Lance, Griffon, Serrated Maw, Wicked Claws, Full Plate Armour, Battle Standard Bearer, War Banner, Charmed Shield

Wizard Lord [415pts]: Hand Weapon, Wizard Level 4, Illusion, Imperial Griffon, Heavy Armour, Serrated Maw, Wicked Claws, General, Ogre Blade, The White Cloak

## Core [504pts]
2x Empire Knights [102pts]: Stubborn
• 4x Empire Knight [22pts]: Barded Warhorse, Barding, Hand Weapon, Hand Weapon, Heavy Armour, Shield, Lance
• 1x Preceptor [6pts]

3x Empire Knights [100pts]:
• 4x Empire Knight [22pts]: Barded Warhorse, Barding, Hand Weapon, Hand Weapon, Heavy Armour, Shield, Lance
• 1x Preceptor [6pts]
• 1x Musician [6pts]

## Special [556pts]
Demigryph Knights [178pts]:
• 2x Demigryph Knight [63pts]: Demigryph, Barding, Hand Weapon, Wicked Claws, Hand Weapon, Shield, Full Plate Armour, Lance
• 1x Demigryph Preceptor [52pts]: Wizarding Hat

3x Demigryph Knights [126pts]:
• 2x Demigryph Knight [63pts]: Demigryph, Barding, Hand Weapon, Wicked Claws, Hand Weapon, Shield, Full Plate Armour, Lance

## Rare [285pts]
Empire Steam Tanks [285pts]:
• 1x Steam Tank [285pts]: Engineer Commander, Pigeon Bombs, Steam Cannon, Steam Gun

[commandant]

Is that the armour of being able to cast magic?

[Athiuen]

Putting the knights in a big unit doesn't add anything. They become harder to move with a wider frontage, same points, rank bonus is meh. Swapping for expensive State troops means they will be shot at for another 2 turns plus a stand and shoot. I'd totally take infantry with Brets men at arms.

Especially considering 2 units of knights adds +2 for Close Order, which can be kept regardless of unit size, compared to a big unit with +1 Close Order and +1 Banner.

Drilled completely removes the pain of big knight units. You can quickly redress to marching column or super wide before moving, charging, giving ground, everything! It was great in my last game.

[commandant]

Also you need 5 Unit Strength to claim the Closed Order which is 3 knights.   Any of those units losing 2 knights means that they can't get closed order.   I would feel you want to put some of those unit up to 5-6 knights instead of the four

[The Peacemaker]

Is that the armour of being able to cast magic?

The heavy armour is from the griffin. ...new recruits formatting is odd.

Drilled completely removes the pain of big knight units. You can quickly redress to marching column or super wide before moving, charging, giving ground, everything! It was great in my last game.

I was thinking of taking a bigger knight unit because of the drilled rule. But there still isn't much need too. I don't have any characters on non-large targets that can hide next to the unit. The extra unit strength doesn't do anything when i can just charge a second unit in. The cost of drilled means I take less knights overall.
All a bigger unit gives is slightly more staying power for close order bonus, and maybe a decent unit to add a banner too.
I might try it in future games though if it looks like the meta might need it.

[Footpatrol2]

Didn't see the 2nd page

[Grendel083]

Stank has pigeon bombs because I got extra points.

I want to see a pigeon coop modelled onto a Steam Tank.

[Clymer]

Drilled completely removes the pain of big knight units. You can quickly redress to marching column or super wide before moving, charging, giving ground, everything! It was great in my last game.

Drilled is so good on knights of all sizes... and it's cheap as chips at just +1 point per model. Yes, big units of knights get really maneuverable. Also a conga line of 5 knights can get behind enemy lines and hunt warmachines on turn 2. They are really exceptional... I overlooked them for far too long.