Topic: Thigh Armour Plates - Hagen please help

[Midaski]

Found this thread from the past, which has been referred to occasionally since.

I am very interested in making a mould for the leg plates one gets with the Soldiers sprue - [ONE pair per FOUR legs ].

Hagen seems to be the expert.
http://www.warhammer-empire.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2555&highlight=moulds

A few questions.

You take the plate - apply a thin coat of 'washing up liquid' or 'Salal (should that be 'salaD') Oil'.

Do you water down the washing up liquid? Are there any other general household 'liquids' one can use?

Press the plate into your greenstuff.

Do you leave it there, until the GS hardens, or prise it out straight away?
I was worried about disturbing the mould?

Once you have your hardened mould, I assume you then apply a thin coat of the oil or washing up liquid to the mould, and then press in your fresh greenstuff?

Again do you leave the new GS to harden in the mould, the oil coat stopping it sticking to the mould?

I have in mind to make a little frame, which would allow me to make these plates in batches, say 10 at a time.
I have a little 'wallpaper edge roller' - probably 40mm wide - and if I could size the frame right, the roller would do my levelling for me, and 'press' the mould.
However I would like to practise first, and hope Hagen or someone else who has done this successfully, can give me the benefits of their experience.
If I can get this to work ,there already seem to be other opportunities. Hagen also refers to other 'bits' he does this way.
One of my first threads on this site was about 'accessories' for models.
I would have to see about things like quivers/pouches/daggers etc.

Thanks in anticipation.

[FR1DAY]

A very good question, i'd like to know as well.

[rufus sparkfire]

Maybe Hagen could write an article for the site about this? Or is it actually illegal?

[Midaski]

Maybe Hagen could write an article for the site about this? Or is it actually illegal?

Well, as GW will allow only their models, OR fully scratch built stuff in their events, I would be tempted to say it's a combination of those two elements.
Scratch building copies of their components/design?

Mind you if it's a good mould, and painted up on a model, would they be able to tell the difference?

It's a logistical nightmare, because of the ratio on the sprue you would never have enough plates.

[General Helstrom]

It's technically illegal, I think, to make copies of GW material - including bits. However, a White Dwarf some time ago included a hobby tip on making a Purity Scroll roller around a pencil, whih also used an original GW bit to make the mould - so I think it's pretty safe. And as you said, I doubt anyone could tell the difference.

[Midaski]

@ Gen. H.
I hope we're not in denial here.

I seem to recall you were an exponent of this.

Hagen could put in a disclaimer - "This is how it could be done, but obviously you will not do it".

[Imrael]

There was a long (long long long) thread on this on druchii.net.  Apparently, the US online magazine had an article on how to make your own small pieces by moulding from GW ones, which obviously suggests GW wouldnt actually object to small scale non-commercial uses.  I dont think the thread reached a conclusion.
http://www.druchii.net/viewtopic.php?t=30837&highlight=mould

[Kaz]

It's technically illegal, I think, to make copies of GW material - including bits. However, a White Dwarf some time ago included a hobby tip on making a Purity Scroll roller around a pencil, whih also used an original GW bit to make the mould - so I think it's pretty safe. And as you said, I doubt anyone could tell the difference.

Actually no, it's not illegal, as long as you do it for youself. If you care to do it, you can actually legally make all your figures yourself. But as soon as you start giving them away or earning money of them.. then it becomes illegal

[Hagen_von_Loewenstein]

Well, let's see what I can do for you, me lad.

You take the plate - apply a thin coat of 'washing up liquid' or 'Salal (should that be 'salaD') Oil'.

Do you water down the washing up liquid? Are there any other general household 'liquids' one can use?

You can generally use any kind of detergent. Some people prefer to water the washing liquid down, but I don't. Chances are that the GS you'll be pressing into the mould later on will stick to the mould if it's TOO watered down. Just before of making it foam.

Press the plate into your greenstuff.

Do you leave it there, until the GS hardens, or prise it out straight away?
I was worried about disturbing the mould?

You can do both, but I'd recommend leaving it in there for at least one or two hours, till the GS STARTS to harden out.

Once you have your hardened mould, I assume you then apply a thin coat of the oil or washing up liquid to the mould, and then press in your fresh greenstuff?

That's just it.

Again do you leave the new GS to harden in the mould, the oil coat stopping it sticking to the mould?

That depends on what you actually plan to do with it. If you want to use it in exactly the same shape and kind it's originally used, leave it till it's hard. However, if you want e.g. to aplly a symbol to a curved surface (like horse barding like I did with my Reiksguard etc.), better just leave it in there for about an hour, then carefully take it out (it's not hardened out yet and one could still screw it up badly now) and apply it to the corresponding surface.

The "other bitz" I was referring to... well, basically, you can do this with every part that only has one modelled side (or only NEEDS one). I did Thigh plates this way, but also pistol-holsters, many symbols from various sprues and models, bucklers, I once even tried double-handed swords that way, they weren't exactly bad, but it showed the limitation of this method, because it was more or less luck to have BOTH sides look well. That's why I only recomend it for parts with only one modelled side.

As for the legal stuff: I think Kaz is perfectly right here. If you officials get the legal stuff worked out and decide that it's ok, just drop me a line and I will see what I can do about an article.

[Midaski]

Danke Hagen:

I shall give it a go.
One afterthought - I bought something called 'MIiliput' a while ago. It is similar 2 component putty to Greenstuff.
However I find it a bit stickier and messier. Any experience of it?

I did wonder whether to use that for the initial mould, and then greenstuff for my 'new' plates.

PS. I think Kaz has nailed it - if it's for personal use it would be ok.

[Kernschatten]

One afterthought - I bought something called 'MIiliput' a while ago. It is similar 2 component putty to Greenstuff.
However I find it a bit stickier and messier. Any experience of it?

http://www.bananaking.net/cento/workshop/conv_green.htm

Milliput is a two-part epoxy putty that behaves very differently from Green Stuff. It is actually fairly water soluble when wet (like modelling clay) but very hard when cured. It can be filed and sanded easily, but is quite brittle, making it not very durable. Some sculptors actually use a 50/50 mix of Green Stuff and Milliput to get a compromise between the hardness and durability of the two mediums. Milliput actually comes in a few grades, including Superfine (white), Standard (yellow-grey), and course (terracota). I have used Superfine White, but the Standard Yellow-Grey will work just as well for most figure applications (at almost half the cost of Superfine White). Obviously, Milliput is a hard putty.

http://www.thewarp.net/war/theforge/greenstuff.html

http://www.drunkdwarves.com/pages/artttgttccasting.html

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/1listSculpting/