home

Author Topic: newbie here. How do Cannons work?  (Read 561 times)

Offline cpt.Piggy

  • Posts: 9
    • View Profile
newbie here. How do Cannons work?
« on: February 19, 2017, 06:49:51 PM »
Hi all

I new to the Gaming aspect. got around 70 troops and an Empire Cannon.

I been visiting my local Games workshop / Warhammer store (very friendly people), where i will most probably be playing my first games.
it seems to be all AoS over there so will probably be playing that.

while i paint my General, i been reading up on rules / warscrolls.
(I really like my hand-Gunners, so was quite pleased to see buffs from *steady aim* / *handgun volley* / *hold line*  :roll: )

I was looking into how cannon works and i cant figure out the way it works. in what way is damage inflicted?

does it fire solid or explosive shot

i once heard somthing about aiming cannon, and rolling dice to determine where/how it bounces, distance etc.
are they outdated rules?

then there are those round templates for determining 'area of effect' for explosive rounds.
are they used in AoS?

if a solid shot, does it plough through enemy ranks?

i think i understand the way to determine regular combat / shooting phase (hit/wound/save/rend etc) and how to warscroll is used in that,
but looking at Cannon warscroll:

-range: 40"
-attacks: (there is just a star there, no numbers?)
-hit / wound / rend: i think i understand
-damage: D6 (not sure what that means?)

how is shooting single target (enemy hero / beast) calculated vs shooting a large unit of lots of infantry?


(sorry for bloated post, probably could have done 2 line question  :icon_eek: )


Offline Artobans Ghost

  • Posts: 929
    • View Profile
Re: newbie here. How do Cannons work?
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2017, 08:52:08 PM »
The warscroll shows a star for attacks which means you look to see how many crew are alive and well. If there are 3 than you have a move of 4" and 2 attacks needing 4+ to hit and each hit is @ d6 wounds. As people will do there best to kill your crew the effectiveness decreases till 0 crew 0 attacks.
As far as I know you pick a target and if you are in range and sight, you pray to the dice gods.
The real masters of AOS are stealthnightsteg, Baron Von Klatz and oxcycuter. May someone land a sky bolt thru me if I missed any pertinent players. No insult intended 😸
Mathi Alfblut Feb 4,2017
Simple, You gut the bastard with your sword, the viking way.
Questions?

Mathi Alfblut Dec 9,2017
Get a binge of Yule ale, roasted boar and some proper axes and we will ALL be happy again!

Offline StealthKnightSteg

  • Posts: 3835
  • Squishing Squickhoppers since 1999
    • https://www.facebook.com/vincent.goede
    • View Profile
    • My wargaming blog
Re: newbie here. How do Cannons work?
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2017, 11:04:49 PM »
Welcome here!

As Artobans Ghost clearly states I'm the head honcho here *cough*  :ph34r:

The Empire cannon is only in AoS in the so called Compendium Warscrolls, they aren't updated into the current line, but the Dwarf cannon is. Anyway the Empire cannon can still be used through those compendium warscrolls. So now that's out of the way..
PS: Both the Empire Cannon and Dwarf Cannon bar the range are similar.

It only has one main attack type as it's named on the warscroll: Cannon Ball, there is another but it's listed as a special ability.
Aiming, and bounces is from the past edition (Warhammer 8th) so forget those. Same with the templates, maybe there is one used somewhere in AoS as a rarity, but certainly not for a cannon at least.

So how does a cannon in AoS work?
First any warscroll with a * somewhere in the profile then it will be mentioned in a "unit damage table. Monsters and Artillery have them.
So the Cannon has * as move and on the Attacks and as Artoban said it has to do with the amount of crew members are around. With full (3) crew around:
you target any single model (hero or monster type is also a unit) or a unit (group of models) within the range in the profile.
at full crew you do 2 attacks on 4+ to hit (so 2 dice)
then any hits on a 2+ to wound
then if you do wound
your opponent can save with his Save stat at a -2 modifier
then if he fails 1 or even 2 of those then you can throw another dice (the d6 damage) and see how much (damage)wounds he takes, which he might save any of them again if he has any special saves.
So you could do nothing (fail your to hits / to wounds, he makes his saves) or if your dice gods are with you a maximum of 12 damage or you could then roll a 1 for your damage.. dice gods are fickle :)
Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.

"Computer games don't affect kids; I mean if Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic music." -- Kristian Wilson, Nintendo, Inc, 1989

Offline cpt.Piggy

  • Posts: 9
    • View Profile
Re: newbie here. How do Cannons work?
« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2017, 10:48:52 PM »
ah ok thanks for explanation. still a tad confused on shooting at enemy unit (group of enemies).

will only 2 models in the unit be up for a possible hit?

or is the mount of models hit determined by dice roll?

or is the amount of models killed from that unit determined by the d6 damage roll?

Offline Artobans Ghost

  • Posts: 929
    • View Profile
Re: newbie here. How do Cannons work?
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2017, 01:25:34 AM »
The amount of damaged dished out from the d6 or d6's is the wounds the unit suffers and rolls for saves if it can. You start with one model and if it has multiple wounds you have to keep removing them from that model and them move on to the next. No spreading out the pain so to speak.
Mathi Alfblut Feb 4,2017
Simple, You gut the bastard with your sword, the viking way.
Questions?

Mathi Alfblut Dec 9,2017
Get a binge of Yule ale, roasted boar and some proper axes and we will ALL be happy again!

Offline Oxycutor

  • Posts: 1748
    • View Profile
Re: newbie here. How do Cannons work?
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2017, 11:04:32 AM »
Hello cpt.Piggy, and welcome.

When you make attacks in Age of Sigmar it's the same method whether it's in the shooting phase or combat, at least for any normal attacks.  Some unit's warscrolls have other abilities that can be used in the shooting or combat phase and cause damage, but those rules are explained on the warscolls)

So, you need to be clear of the distinction between a UNIT and a MODEL for a lot of this.

A unit can be a single model, or a number of models, it's explained on the warscrolls, heroes are single model units, as are monsters.  War machines, generally have a unit of the machine, and a unit of the crew, so two units, that work in tandem. 

When making an attack, each MODEL in a UNIT can make an attack at an enemy UNIT that is within range of their weapon.  MODELs with more than one attack, an target different UNITs with each attack on their profile, so you can have a unit split shooting or combat attacks against UNITs, but also individual MODELs can split attacks against different target UNITs

With a cannon, it has * for the attacks, which means you need to refer to the other table, and it will show that if there is a crew unit of 3 or models within 1", then it can make 2 attacks in the shooting phase

Supposing you decide to split your fire, with one of those targeting a Hero, which is a UNIT of one MODEL, and the other shot against a UNIT of troops.   You can target any enemy UNIT within range of the weapon, and that you have line of sight to, this is get down and look from the model to the target to see if you can see it, use a laser pointer, or common sense.  There is no facing or direction you need to target, so you can shoot in any direction. 

When splitting fire or any normal attacks, you declare which target each dice you are going to roll is for, before you roll the dice, so you can't change your mind after rolling some of the attacks, if you're especially lucky or unlucky.  You have to judge the right amount of attacks to get the job done.  Most of the time, all of the models in a unit you'll target against the same enemy unit anyway.

Ok, so you fire one shot at the hero, and roll a 4 or more, so you hit, and the same against the unit of troops.

Then you roll to see if you cause a wound, again you roll a 2 or more for both attacks.

Now the hero might have a good save, 3+ but with -2 rend, that will mean they now have to in effect save on a 5+.  What it actually means is a roll of a 5 get's -2 added and therefore the result is a 3, which is a save.   Anyway, suppose they roll a 4, so that becomes a 2, and they therefore fail the armour save.   That means that the hero who was attacked with 1 attack will take D6 damage, you roll a 4, therefore they take 4 wounds.   At this point, some heroes, or other abilities might say they can ignore wounds on a roll of more, but those are rarer special types of ignoring wounds.  It's not the same as a save, that is the roll which is subject to rend, and comes after the to wound roll.  Anyway, in this case the hero doesn't have any special save, so he loses 4 wounds.

Against the UNIT of troops they have say a 5+ save on their profile, with -2 rend, and no other effects in play, no matter what they roll, they can't make the save.   Only one dice would have been rolled for the save, and it would fail, so you then apply the damage, which is D6 again.  and suppose you roll a 3.  That means 3 wounds are caused to the target UNIT.   If each model in the target unit has 1 wound, then 3 models would be slain, if each model had 2 wounds, 1 would be slain, and 1 would take a single wound.  Once you allocate a wound to a MODEL in the UNIT, any further damage caused to the unit would be applied to an already wounded model until it was slain, before any wounds are applied to a new model

The player who controls the unit taking damage chooses which MODELs in the UNIT that took damage to be removed.  They don't even have to be in line of sight of the attack, or in range, just they have to be from the same UNIT.

Offline cpt.Piggy

  • Posts: 9
    • View Profile
Re: newbie here. How do Cannons work?
« Reply #6 on: February 22, 2017, 02:44:20 PM »
Brilliant, thanks chaps, crystal clear.

I looking forward to my first game. AoS seems like a nice introduction to the table top scene.

Offline Baron von Klatz

  • Posts: 1488
  • warhammer> All other works of mankind
    • View Profile
Re: newbie here. How do Cannons work?
« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2017, 04:59:06 PM »
Indeed it is, the amount of people I've seen braving the frontier of tabletop thanks to AoS is amazing. :smile2:

Best of luck on your first game! Glory to Sigmar and mankind!
"No battle is ever meaningless for all life is merely death post-poned"
-elector count of the Empire.