Topic: Magic the gathering...gathering thread

[Finlay]

Siby, rufus totally Jaced me in one sealed game!

[phillyt]

Jace is awesome.

[Siberius]

Siby, rufus totally Jaced me in one sealed game!

I knew it! It was all a big sham! He probably plays a mirrodon deck secretly by himself too!


As to planeswalkers, I don't mind them in theory, but for me to like them they would need two changes.

Tone down their power levels. Their top abilities are often 'I win' and even their lower ones are versions of spells that might cast 3 or 4 mana to cast. I am not saying make them useless, just useful without being broken.

Make them 1 of each per deck. It makes no sense to me to have 4 of what is essentially a special character. They just become unspecial then and lose all meaning. Sure they might not comr out every time but that is part of being something different!


As it is, I have played against a number if decks that just rely on having 3 or 4 of them out, replace when necessary until one of their top powers trigger. Bam! Game over.

I think the concept is ok though and most of them have terrific art! I would use them if they weren't so overpowered and prolific.

[phillyt]

I don't agree that they are broken.  There top level ability generally should be game winning.  It takes work to keep them alive.

They are very easy to kill.

[rufus sparkfire]

Siby, rufus totally Jaced me in one sealed game!

Yeh, well you used that stupid cat man on me in another sealed game! So shut up! 


I won't even use them in sealed now. I don't care if they are broken or not, they are a bad concept and they dominate the game.

The main reason I don't play people I don't know on GCCG is that they might use planeswalkers. I won't take that chance! I'd rather play EDH against some stupid alara deck full of alara cards I've never seen that are all alara-ish.   

[Siberius]

I don't agree that they are broken.  There top level ability generally should be game winning.  It takes work to keep them alive.

They are very easy to kill.

Some of them are. If you take the right kind of deck. Some of them pump out tokens or make you discard any chance of killing them or only take a couple of turns to hit their win ability. Jace drives me crazy. Once he is out that player spends about 80% of the game time for their turn while you are stuck waiting to get milled to oblivion or whatever other fate they have planned. Some control is ok, total control is boring.

[rufus sparkfire]

Worldwake Jace obviously was broken, since he utterly ruined standard when he was around and eventually had to be banned.

So there.

[phillyt]

I don't agree that they are broken.  There top level ability generally should be game winning.  It takes work to keep them alive.

They are very easy to kill.

Some of them are. If you take the right kind of deck. Some of them pump out tokens or make you discard any chance of killing them or only take a couple of turns to hit their win ability. Jace drives me crazy. Once he is out that player spends about 80% of the game time for their turn while you are stuck waiting to get milled to oblivion or whatever other fate they have planned. Some control is ok, total control is boring.

Total control is so interesting to me, but at tournaments you end up being stared at by the other players as they wait to start the next turn.  And they hate you.

[rufus sparkfire]

The game is meant to be fun for both players! There's no point bothering otherwise.

Well, tournaments excepted, probably. But those don't count.

[phillyt]

But again, half the fun is overcoming a deck.  Just arbitrarily stating whole deck styles are boring isn't fun either.

I have a mirrodin atrifact control deck that beats the hell out of people with creatures, but people would probably call it mostly control.

Just telling people they can only play aggro isn't fair either!

[rufus sparkfire]

Just telling people they can only play aggro isn't fair either!

I'm glad I didn't say that then.

Just arbitrarily stating whole deck styles are boring isn't fun either.

Or that.


I really like counter-burn decks. But I accept that other people don't really want to play against them, so I don't use them much.

[phillyt]

Why don't people like to play counter burn?
Honestly, if you are looking for only decks that everyone likes to play against you will end up essentially looking at aggro decks.  They spam creatures.  People get lots of attacking and blocking in, and people are slowly beat to death.

Some people aren't going to like certain kinds of decks.  As long as a deck is fair and not taking advantage of some obscure or cruel combo, I don't see what the problem is.

[rufus sparkfire]

By 'people,' of course, I mean Finlay and Siby! We just play each other all the time.

If someone makes a deck that no one likes playing against, it doesn't get used any more.


Any deck that involves a lot of library-searching is way more painful on the computer than it is in reality. You just sit there, staring at the screen, waiting for something to happen... or possibly go and make a cup of tea and come back later to see if it's your turn yet.

Hating counterspells is pretty common, I think. That's why we're stuck with rubbish like 'cancel' these days! And also why there's no decent blue card draw spell in standard.

[Finlay]

Counterspells are lame.
I hate on the programme casting something, then having to wait to see if it is cancelled.

Planeswalkers are wack as hell.

[phillyt]

By 'people,' of course, I mean Finlay and Siby! We just play each other all the time.

Good point!

If someone makes a deck that no one likes playing against, it doesn't get used any more.


Any deck that involves a lot of library-searching is way more painful on the computer than it is in reality. You just sit there, staring at the screen, waiting for something to happen... or possibly go and make a cup of tea and come back later to see if it's your turn yet.

Ah, yeah I can see where that can be a pain in the butt.

Hating counterspells is pretty common, I think. That's why we're stuck with rubbish like 'cancel' these days! And also why there's no decent blue card draw spell in standard.

True  They rarely put a good draw card with a legitimate card advantage in core sets.  And people hate to be coutnered, though I I think like counter spells when they get to drop one!  Counter decks, and most control decks, walk a fine line between trying to set up a win condition and stymieing someone else win condition.

[towishimp]

While what playstyles make for fun games is a matter of preference, there does seem to be pretty good evidence that some styles ARE more unfun to more people.  For instance:

Counterspells are lame.
I hate on the programme casting something, then having to wait to see if it is cancelled.

Wizards agrees with Finlay and millions of others who feel the same, and thus we have the weak counterspells of today, rather than the insane ones of years past.  Also note the greater attention to making sure combo decks don't dominate.  Basically, Wizards pushes creature decks because they're more interactive and more what they feel their game is supposed to be about -- battling with armies of summoned creatures.  I, for one, am happy that they're guiding the game in such a way...and they must be doing something right, because the game just keep growing.

[Novogord]

I really like counter-burn decks. But I accept that other people don't really want to play against them, so I don't use them much.

I know burn decks, I love to play that type. But what is counter burn?

[rufus sparkfire]

Presumably people don't like land destruction either, since it basically never happens these days.

I know burn decks, I love to play that type. But what is counter burn?

Red/blue counterspells and burn spells. 

[phillyt]

Are you sure Magic is bigger than ever?  Last I knew it had peaked though is still very popular.

[rufus sparkfire]

I think Innistrad was a big success? Someone said that before... probably towishimp actually.

[Siberius]

I don't mind counter sometimes. I think it is the way it is often coupled with deck searching. You end up feeling like you aren't taking part in the game.

My illusion deck was half counters and half illusions. Worked very nice usually, but horribly fragile.

I often think about making a land killing deck but it is always too expensive. 


Made a pauper elephant rhino deck yesterday but had to go to bed before I could test it vs rufus.

My 5 colour deck kinda worked. It is going to be horribly unreliable and it really has no focussed plan, but I am pleased it didn't get thrashed to nothing like I thought it might...

[phillyt]

I think Innistrad was a big success? Someone said that before... probably towishimp actually.

Whoops just looked at the sales figures.  Yeah the 2011 year was a record breaker for Hasbro!

[Karl Voss of Averland]

Philly, all your decks should include at least one copy of this card:

http://www.mtgfanatic.com/store/magic/viewcard.aspx?i=mtg-ms-028132

Even if you have no red mana.

[rufus sparkfire]

Duel Decks Sorin vs Tibalt decklists. Hmmmm.

http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/feature/237b


Black/white vs... black/red. Too much black! Sorin's deck is quite ghosty though, which I like.

Doesn't look as much fun as Izzet vs Golgari.


Hey, why did these exist? One for each black combination only. Some sort of theme in whichever set it was?



That's good for an uncommon land, surely!

[towishimp]

Hey, why did these exist? One for each black combination only. Some sort of theme in whichever set it was?



That's good for an uncommon land, surely!

They were in Torment, part of Odyssey block, where the second 2 sets were 1 "good" set (white and green over-represented) and 1 "evil" set (black overly represented).  Torment was the evil set, so they printed the tainted lands to make it easier to spash the other colors into your black decks.