Author Topic: Gamer thread (Read 812304 times)

Fandir Nightshade · « **Reply #6575 on:** February 20, 2014, 08:56:01 PM »

I disagree strongly. Pretending that in an environment of harsh competition increasing the pressure on game developers by stealing their product and as mentioned by Michael Fitch badmouthing it without even buying the proper product isn´t a problem is just a cheap excuse.

I want to game...and I don´t want to pay.

patsy02 · « **Reply #6576 on:** February 20, 2014, 09:38:27 PM »

I need to specify this - I'm talking about pirating a game before buying it, not instead of buying it. No one who knows better would ever buy an overhyped, deceptive, broken day-one-DLC mess.

In my country we actually have consumer laws for this type of stuff - if a product doesn't function the way it's promised, you get to take it back for a refund. Of course, it's completely unenforceable with digital games. Loads of people tried going through with it after buying SimCity 5, with no success.

Bottom line is, when you deliberately release an unfinished, broken, or bad game, you don't get to complain when people refrain from buying it after they find out how shit it is.

Fandir Nightshade · « **Reply #6577 on:** February 20, 2014, 09:40:38 PM »

Why not waiting a couple of days for a few reviews?

Stealing the game is ....wrong.

patsy02 · « **Reply #6578 on:** February 20, 2014, 10:38:16 PM »

Quality checking isn't theft.

zifnab0 · « **Reply #6579 on:** February 21, 2014, 02:14:28 AM »

Quote from: patsy02 on February 20, 2014, 09:38:27 PM

I need to specify this - I'm talking about pirating a game before buying it, not instead of buying it.

No, you're talking about pirating a game, and then buying it if you decide you like it. Very different.

You could play the game's demo. Or you could wait for a review.

S.O.F · « **Reply #6580 on:** February 21, 2014, 02:23:39 AM »

Quote from: zifnab0 on February 21, 2014, 02:14:28 AM

You could play the game's demo.

Rome 2 had no demo...perhaps for obvious reasons

phillyt · « **Reply #6581 on:** February 21, 2014, 02:29:41 AM »

Although, Rome 2 seemed great for the first 10+ hours, so a demo may not have been able to represent what the game actually was!

S.O.F · « **Reply #6582 on:** February 21, 2014, 02:46:50 AM »

Quote from: PhillyT on February 21, 2014, 02:29:41 AM

Although, Rome 2 seemed great for the first 10+ hours, so a demo may not have been able to represent what the game actually was!

Indeed though if the demo had a siege battle it would have been easy

phillyt · « **Reply #6583 on:** February 21, 2014, 02:47:58 AM »

God... siege battles...

patsy02 · « **Reply #6584 on:** February 21, 2014, 02:52:08 AM »

Quote

Rome 2 seemed great for the first 10+ hours

There are quite a few problems that are noticeable from the start.

Quote from: zifnab0 on February 21, 2014, 02:14:28 AM

No, you're talking about pirating a game, and then buying it if you decide you like it. Very different.

Not very different, just a different way of saying what I said. A demo, if there is one, only gives an accurate impression of the game if it's honest and consistent with the rest of the game. Reviews are subjective. I guess the best thing I can do is watch an extensive Let's Play.

Anyway, I'm gonna keep dodging bullets and saving my money for devs who don't fuck up.

zifnab0 · « **Reply #6585 on:** February 21, 2014, 03:31:38 AM »

Quote from: patsy02 on February 21, 2014, 02:52:08 AM

Not very different, just a different way of saying what I said.

Quite different, in fact.

You don't have the right to steal a car from a car lot before you decide to buy it. You take it for a test drive. If the dealer doesn't offer test drives, why would you be interested in the product?

patsy02 · « **Reply #6586 on:** February 21, 2014, 04:00:15 AM »

1: The car dealer knows he's selling a shit car. He won't let me try it. I find out about this by testing with a version I downloaded in my own home - not by taking anything that he possesses. I don't buy the car because he's essentially scamming me.

2: The car dealer is legit and there's nothing wrong with the car. He won't let me try it. I find out about this by testing with a version I downloaded in my own home - not by taking anything that he possesses. I then buy the car from him.

The whole car analogy is meaningless because the value of a game isn't situated in any physical thing that has to be supplied, manufactured and shipped. The bytes in a game are infinitely reproducible without any cost. Download a game, no one loses anything. The devs and producers however, are denied their income if the person downloads instead of buying.

It's a different, incomparable paradigm.

Finlay · « **Reply #6587 on:** February 21, 2014, 08:05:54 AM »

How many times do you actually buy a game you've pirated though?

And behind you, how much do you think people just say this to justify themselves, but then don't buy it.

zifnab0 · « **Reply #6588 on:** February 21, 2014, 02:02:35 PM »

Quote from: patsy02 on February 21, 2014, 04:00:15 AM

The devs and producers however, are denied their income if the person downloads instead of buying.

Which is exactly what you're doing. You are downloading games instead of buying them. The fact that you do this just to test a game and see if you like it is irrelevant.

Fandir Nightshade · « **Reply #6589 on:** February 21, 2014, 02:05:23 PM »

I wonder how people would react if their boss at the end of the month denies them their wages ....nahhhh I think your performance wasn´t good enough so I decided to not pay you....have a nice day.

patsy02 · « **Reply #6590 on:** February 21, 2014, 05:04:13 PM »

Quote

I wonder how people would react if their boss at the end of the month denies them their wages ....nahhhh I think your performance wasn't good enough so I decided to not pay you....have a nice day.

The worker has then lost a month of salary, which is directly related to how much work he's put in. The video game producer on the other hand, hasn't lost anything if a game is downloaded. These two can't be compared because one download doesn't necessarily mean one sale.

Quote from: Finlay on February 21, 2014, 08:05:54 AM

And behind you, how much do you think people just say this to justify themselves, but then don't buy it.

Loads. Which isn't great. But I think the majority of people are willing to to pay for themselves if the product is worth it.

Quote

Which is exactly what you're doing. You are downloading games instead of buying them.

I'm really not though. If I can't pirate a £20-50 single player game before buying it, I just won't buy it at all. I can't speak for anyone else though.

I'm not going to deny that it's a grey area, and maybe it's my stingy student instincts kicking in, but I'd rather not risk flushing my money down the toilet on the next Aliens: Colonial Marines or SimCity.

S.O.F · « **Reply #6591 on:** February 21, 2014, 07:19:38 PM »

Quote from: patsy02 on February 21, 2014, 05:04:13 PM

Quote from: Finlay on February 21, 2014, 08:05:54 AM
And behind you, how much do you think people just say this to justify themselves, but then don't buy it.
Loads. Which isn't great. But I think the majority of people are willing to to pay for themselves if the product is worth it.

Which in essence is something like CD Projekt RED's philosophy in game making, make a worthwhile game and people will pay for it and further don't burden folks with DRM and dodgy DLC practices which antagonize the real customer (which is what drives otherwise honest folks to piracy).

The problems of the games industry are multitudinous these days and it is rather hard to judge many games coming out whether they warrant ones dollars or not. Demo's have gone, pre-release gameplay/screens are doctored if not outright faked, features are listed and then never delivered, most 'major' games 'journalism' outlets reviews are simply bought, and even if you go in with good faith and are sold shit most places you can no longer be refunded. I mean this is not entirely the fault of 'big bad games companies' in many ways gamers have been complacent and allowed these things to happen (pre-ordering or not calling out on disc DLC as bullshit).

Finlay · « **Reply #6592 on:** February 21, 2014, 08:43:33 PM »

Pirating is wrong and the lies people tell themselves, and others, to justify it are bullshit

Fidelis von Sigmaringen · « **Reply #6593 on:** February 21, 2014, 08:50:26 PM »

There is no need for piracy anyway - just patience. Wait a couple of years, until you'll get the game for 10 Euro or so. It is cheap, (most of) the bugs are fixed, and you'll know what you are getting. That is what I do.

harv · « **Reply #6594 on:** February 21, 2014, 09:00:18 PM »

Quote from: Fidelis von Sigmaringen on February 21, 2014, 08:50:26 PM

There is no need for piracy anyway - just patience. Wait a couple of years, until you'll get the game for 10 Euro or so. It is cheap, (most of) the bugs are fixed, and you'll know what you are getting. That is what I do.

Exactly what I do, what with large Steam Sales at least 4 times a year and things like Humble Bundle it's possible to pick up most games for a quarter of the original price or less. In many ways it's better to wait, cheaper price and games will be bundled with all the DLC in GOTY editions and most bugs would have been squashed. I have so much to play already it's easy to wait a year or so for titles to drop in price. There are obvious exceptions to the rule but it works well enough.

For example Aliens: Colonial Marines, why did people pre-order it, a short wait and it dropped to about £3 in the last steam sale. It's easier to justify £3 on a terrible game than £30.

Fidelis von Sigmaringen · « **Reply #6595 on:** February 21, 2014, 09:05:15 PM »

All good things come to those who wait. For Oblivion (with Add-ons), I had to wait almost four years, though. And Morrowind was better.

Brad · « **Reply #6596 on:** February 25, 2014, 12:32:22 AM »

Sorry to drag the topic waaaay back to Dark Souls, but I just discovered the best way to kill Fat and Skinny is with magic. Oolacile Ivory Catalyst so none of your stats even matter (just make sure you have enough stamina to block and/or dodge) and spam soul arrows (if you have Int > 27 use your standard sorcerer catalyst). With a bit of care they won't even be able to touch you.

phillyt · « **Reply #6597 on:** February 25, 2014, 01:19:49 AM »

Morrowind was amazing.

t12161991 · « **Reply #6598 on:** February 25, 2014, 05:42:50 PM »

Thoughts on the train-wreck of the new Thief game? I've been hearing some horror stories.

Mogsam · « **Reply #6599 on:** February 25, 2014, 06:08:50 PM »

I've bought several piece of shite games lately and will no longer buy them full price or at all.

Don't blame patsy. £40 is far too much to spend on a half assed release like Rome.

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Author Topic: Gamer thread (Read 812304 times)