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Author Topic: Whats wrong with the magic?  (Read 7515 times)

Offline rufus sparkfire

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #25 on: April 12, 2008, 08:42:59 AM »
Dice generation and usage should remain the same as current (I think it works reasonably well).

Don't you think it's a huge and inexplicable disconnect from the fluff though?
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Offline Amulus

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #26 on: April 12, 2008, 08:44:33 AM »
Dice generation and usage should remain the same as current (I think it works reasonably well).

Don't you think it's a huge and inexplicable disconnect from the fluff though?

how so rufus?
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Offline rufus sparkfire

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #27 on: April 12, 2008, 08:47:51 AM »
The whole 'winds of magic' vs 'personal magical batteries' thing. I'd rather see the total number of dice available to each player randomly generated each turn, regardless of how many wizards are present - a dice version of the old card system.
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Offline Siberius

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #28 on: April 12, 2008, 01:03:22 PM »
I'd like that Rufus... the chance that some turns you will get a nice gust and whack out a couple of devastating spells whereas other turns you get a pitiful breeze and are stuck trying desperately to cast your lowest level spell. It'd make hte magic phase more... exciting. Right now it seems to me that assuming wizards don't die, the magic phase of any particular battle sits into a routine after the first turn or two just waiting to see if this turn you manage to roll high enough because the other guy already knows where he is going to use his dispel dice.

I don't like that even if you go magic light you need to have a little mage kitted out with dispels either. But then maybe that is good as it means people are more liable to bring a balanced list... they can't just ignore magic... I don't know...
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Offline Warlord

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #29 on: April 12, 2008, 03:22:13 PM »
I agree... to a degree.

I believe that the winds of magic in general should change per turn on the battlefield, but more per battle.

So, I guess in essence to symbolise this, both players should roll a D6. Whoever rolls highest gets to add or remove D3 dice from the common pool (of power and dispel).

Of you so wish, this could be applied every turn - however for the most part I don't believe they would shift THAT often (and never qute understood the fluff for it being that breezy)

Of course there are other ways to could be done, however right now its late and I can't think of any...
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Offline Crimsonsphinx

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #30 on: April 12, 2008, 03:35:41 PM »
Bring back winds of magic cards  :-D  I loved those days!  That was far more in tune with how magic in warhammer is actually supposed to happen.

If that is not going to happen, then I would prefer wizards of all lores to automatically know the base spell, regardless of level, and perhaps only have 4 spells total, where each level progressively learns up thier own chart.  That makes sense from an educational perspective.

In warhammer fantasy roleplay, you get spells based on how you build your wizard.  Perhaps that is an option, so that you can buy the spells that you require like in 40k.  I still would have the base spell fixed, provided all lores at least had fairly equivelent base spells, or at least ones that didn't suck 90% of the time.
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Offline Siberius

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #31 on: April 13, 2008, 03:01:58 AM »
I kinda liked the cards but I don't miss them at all...

I like that all you need is the book now. Course a little more variety wouldn't hurt  :-P
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Offline Tyrant

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #32 on: April 16, 2008, 03:17:13 AM »
I confess I never understood why the spell selection was random. It makes it hard to include a wizard in tactics. Take the Lore of Metal, for example. It's got some pretty interesting spells that can mess with the enemy stats for a turn, but with a level 1 or 2 wizard I could easily miss all those spells in my rolls and come up with only magic missiles.

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Offline Amulus

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #33 on: April 16, 2008, 03:54:32 AM »
"Hey Gold Wizard, turn their freakishly huge battle axes to lead while we rush them."
"Sorry, I can only pour hot silver on them today. Come back tomorrow, maybe I can help then."

muhahahaha funny!

Can someone enlighten me on how the system worked with magic cards?
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Offline Johan Willhelm

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #34 on: April 16, 2008, 10:10:01 AM »
After playing with thelast two incarnations of the card based system I kinda like the current dice system . .  I agree that there should be perhaps more variation on the power dice contributed by the winds of magic eg as someone suggested earlier D3 dice available but it works pretty well as it is I reckon . . .

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Offline Crimsonsphinx

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #35 on: April 17, 2008, 07:10:23 AM »
If I remember correctly, you rolled two dice and thats how many cards were given out, starting by dealing to the person whos magic phase it was.  Each player then took it in turns to cast and dispel starting with the player whos turn it was.

All dispelling was done on randomly dealt cards, with high elfs able to use power cards as dispel, and dark elfs dispel cards as power.  There was also miscasts and irresistables in there too.  If you had higher level mages, the enemy was on a base 5+ to dispel, equal it was 4+ and if your wizard dispelling was higher than theirs it was a 3+.  By spending extra power cards, both sides could move the dispel number up or down by fortifying their offence or defence.

At the end of the magic phase, you could keep one card per wizard in your army, plus any extra you were able to keep with magic items.
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Offline phillyt

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #36 on: April 17, 2008, 11:18:27 AM »
I like the current dice system over tha cards but I think neither addresses the fundamental flaw in our system:  People need to either totally load up on magic or not take it at all.  Medium amounts of magic rarely have any effect on the game, which is silly since magic is one of the prime phases in the turn.  It is too easy to take a defensive wizard and shut down low to middle power magic phases.  Then you have the super power magics that do great alot of the time but still falter from the miscasts. 

Magic is just too inconsistant.

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Offline Nicholas Bies

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Re: Whats wrong with the magic?
« Reply #37 on: April 17, 2008, 11:39:45 AM »

Hmm I'd say both players should roll a die at the beginning of the game. Whoever wins means the winds are blowing stronger for a LORE of their choice. He can also deside which lore is blowing weakest.

Each wizard using that lore has +1 to cast (so roll a 5 = 6). The weakest lore has -1 to cast (so roll a 6=5) All other Lores are casting normal.

This creates a benefit to the winds while not being crazy like taking power and disepl dice.

Personally i view PD and DD not as the winds but the actual strength of the wizard him/herself and his ability to manipulate the winds. If the winds are difficult to cast it doesn't equate to him being weaker but to his need to put more energy and power into his spells.

As for spells. I'd kind of like them to be bought like 40k Psyhic powers. Or allow lv 1s to choose a 4-6+ to cast spell. Lv 2s allowed to choose 2 4-8+ to cast spells. Lv 3 allowed to choose 3 4-10+ to cast spells and lv 4s allowed to choose 4 4-12+ to cast spells. All from the same lore.

It diminish's the randomness and allows you to take spell combinations- it doesn't mean we need to change the Magic Lores too drastically either.

Also it allows magic characters to still know all 6 spells from a lore.
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