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Author Topic: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help  (Read 4861 times)

Offline Crimsonsphinx

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #25 on: November 09, 2011, 05:12:42 PM »
Two vipres have fixed prow shuricannons and the other has a twin shuricatapult.  None of my tanks have fixed variable weapon mounts so the back guns so I can put whatever I like on them.

In practice I tend to field two with pairs of shuricannons and the third with a scat and the twin shuricatapult.

I usually take guide and fortune.  Id rather hit first than rerolling a tiny amount of hits to wound.
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Offline Feanor Fire Heart

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #26 on: November 09, 2011, 05:41:07 PM »
fair enough  :::cheers:::

Did you mention how the DE plays?  What with all the high strength and toughness of the marines and the GK I would think that reapers would help, or you could go the old guard method and just load up on as many shots as possible using statistics to whittle them down.

I am guessing the marines player is Vanilla, how does he play?  shooty? whirlwinds?  If I was a marine player I would probably take 1 or 2 whirlwinds but I dont know what type of player he is.
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Offline Crimsonsphinx

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #27 on: November 10, 2011, 11:18:44 AM »
The marine player loves his tactical marines.  He will more than likely field 3 squads of tacticals, 2 rhinos and a captain and probably terminators or a ironclad dreadnaught if he can fit them in.  Maybe something else.  He doesn't own a whirlwind and doesn't represent, so I think we are safe.

Ive redone my list to roughly this:

Farseer, guide/fortune, 3d6 pyschic runes, spirit stones
in dark reaper squad, 5, exarch with ELM [i think im going with this] fast shot

10 guardians, scatter laser in wave serpent with twin shuricannon led by warlock, singing spear, conceal
10 dire avengers, exarch, pweapon/shimmer shield in wave serpent with twin brightlance
3 jetbikes, shuricannon
3 jetbikes, shuricannon
3 warwalkers two shuricannons each, scouting
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Offline Feanor Fire Heart

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #28 on: November 10, 2011, 04:11:35 PM »
is the DE player using anti-armor?  seems a little light on your side.
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Offline Crimsonsphinx

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #29 on: November 10, 2011, 04:43:26 PM »
He is supposedly bringing several dark lances and a jet plane thing that has anti armour missiles.
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Offline Feanor Fire Heart

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #30 on: November 10, 2011, 05:19:58 PM »
thats fine then, just rememeber to play as a team and not as individuals.  help each other out.  Even if they are soul sucking monsters from the webway
  :biggriin:

I think if you are sticking with anti-infantry you list looks good.  I like that the jetbikes are in small squads and allows you to shoot and run away. May be helpful against those GKs
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Offline Crimsonsphinx

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #31 on: November 10, 2011, 05:31:26 PM »
Im debating the fast shot EML against a crack shot tempest launcher. 

The missile launcher isnt ideal but it gives me a reasonable anti tank on the high bs of the exarch.  If I dropped this, I would be lacking heavily in anti tank.  I suppose I could upgrade the other wave serpent to have a twin bright lance as well, if I can find the points?

Sound reasonable?
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Offline Feanor Fire Heart

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #32 on: November 10, 2011, 05:53:35 PM »
I like the tempest launcher and brightlance falcon option. :::cheers:::
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Offline Delthos

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #33 on: November 10, 2011, 08:21:48 PM »

Farseer, guide/fortune, 3d6 pyschic runes, spirit stones
in dark reaper squad, 5, exarch with ELM [i think im going with this] fast shot


I'd think the guide/doom combo would be better. I don't remember the points costs as it's been far too long since I played. Guide ensures almost all their shots hit, and then doom helps ensure the squad you shoot at gets killed. Dark Reapers are one of my favorite units. I almost never played a game without them.
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Offline Feanor Fire Heart

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #34 on: November 10, 2011, 08:52:42 PM »
are you able to cast fortune and guide on units outside your army like your DE ally?
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Offline Delthos

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #35 on: November 10, 2011, 10:27:29 PM »
I don't know about the current edition/army book, but in previous editions you couldn't.
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Offline Feanor Fire Heart

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #36 on: November 11, 2011, 01:06:36 AM »
pathfinders might be a good idea too there crimson
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Offline Crimsonsphinx

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #37 on: November 11, 2011, 11:30:57 AM »
Path finders are too expensive in this points value I think.  Here is what I am now going with.

Farseer with witchblade, runes of enemy take psy tests on 3d6, spirit stones [gives me 2 casts a turn] fortune [reroll saves power] guide [reroll to hit power]
attached to dark reapers

3 jetbikes, one with shurican cannon
3 jetbikes, one wiht shurican cannon
10 guardians, brightlance, warlock with singing spear and conceal [5+ coversave power]  in wave serpent with twinlinked brightlance
10 dire avengers. exarch power weapon/shimmer shield [5+ invun save in CC] in wave serpent with twinlinked brightlance

3 warwalkers with 2 shurican cannons scouting
5 dark reapers, exarch reaper launcher,  crack shot

I beleive that comes to 1249
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Offline Delthos

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #38 on: November 11, 2011, 01:48:53 PM »
I've not looked at the rules, but can guardians put their weapons platform in a Wave Serpent now?
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Offline Crimsonsphinx

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #39 on: November 11, 2011, 01:51:54 PM »
The weapon platform is a token.  It is not a model, so I beleive they can.
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Offline Feanor Fire Heart

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #40 on: November 11, 2011, 06:05:35 PM »
since your transports have brightlances why not give the guardians scatterlasers or something more shooty against infantry?
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Offline Delthos

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #41 on: November 11, 2011, 06:43:55 PM »
I'm suspecting he wants the heavy firepower it provides more. He's already got 6 shuriken cannons from the War Walkers, two Shuriken Cannons on Jetbikes, the Guardians, plus the Dark Reapers and the Dire Avengers. I'm thinking he has enough infantry killing capability. With only two Bright Lances, he doesn't really have any armor busting power. Sure two twin-linked ones are good, but a third one is better.
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Offline Feanor Fire Heart

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #42 on: November 11, 2011, 06:44:47 PM »
I thought the DE player was going heavy anti-armor?
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Offline Delthos

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #43 on: November 11, 2011, 07:39:34 PM »
Good point, I forgot he was playing an allied game. In that case I'd definitely drop the Brightlances and go with troop killing weapons. That is of course unless you are playing WYSIWYG and you can't switch out your weapons easily.
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Offline Feanor Fire Heart

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #44 on: November 13, 2011, 02:35:01 PM »
crimson dont forget to post how it went!
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Offline Crimsonsphinx

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #45 on: November 28, 2011, 02:48:43 PM »
Sorry, been on leave, not been online  :-D

The Eldar/Dark eldar vs Marines/GKs went really badly for the eldar.  Mostly due to insane amounts of cheating from the GK player [all of which was supposedly checked by our ref who wasnt playing for what that was worth]

We ended up playing dawn of war and the 1 objective in each deployment zone [unsure what thats called]

I deployed a wave serpent with my guardians in it, while my ally deployed a squad of warriors and his succubus to defend our objective.  The marine player deployed a tactical squad on their objective, and a scout squad just in range of our objective so he could ping us pointlessly with sniper rifles.

Turn 1 not much happened, I beleive a grand total of 1 model on our side died and noone on theirs due to our poor ranged weapons.  Turn 2 is when all the grey knights turned up.

A storm raven holding 2 seperate 5 man terminator squads, and a brotherhood champion [all in all 21 slots worth of models in 3 units!] were dropped off right in our deployment zone.  I questioned this and it was checked by our independent ref who was clearly blind]

This issue was then further compounded by the marine player deep striking his own terminators!  We faced 15 terminators, with precisely 4 bright/dark lances, and a bunch of rapid fire guns and two whole power weapons in our lists.

The terminator gang bludgeoned all our defending troops [ 2 squads of dark elder warriors, succubus, guardians, 2 jetbike squads and my late to arrive dire avengers who had heroically charged in in an attempt to power weapon some of them down.

At the end of the game, we had two wave serpents driving around, and that was it.  We nearly managed a draw, but I couldn’t park my 2nd wave serpent close enough to contest their objective being held by a devastator squad and a tactical marine unit.

The only unit on our side that did well was my dark reaper exarch.  It appears the tempest launcher is obscenely decent.  He managed to single handed kill an entire squad of tactical marines, as well as kill off a techmarine with a orbital strike relay in one shot. 
« Last Edit: November 28, 2011, 02:52:48 PM by Crimsonsphinx »
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Offline rufus sparkfire

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #46 on: November 28, 2011, 03:24:23 PM »
A storm raven holding 2 seperate 5 man terminator squads, and a brotherhood champion [all in all 21 slots worth of models in 3 units!] were dropped off right in our deployment zone.  I questioned this and it was checked by our independent ref who was clearly blind]

What the hell!

Five terminators, a champion and a dreadnought, yes. Not two squads of terminators!


And someone checked that? Did they look in the rule book?



Anyway, how did it get to your deployment zone? If it deepstruck the passengers can't get out.
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Offline Crimsonsphinx

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #47 on: November 28, 2011, 03:35:23 PM »
It came on turn 2, full speed 24 inches and then because grey knights are a special snowflake Wardex they can still apparantly jump out and shoot, which gets them even further as the front of the model is quite a lot further forwards than the base!  We had troops in front and around our objective in cover, so we had moved relatively close.  He didnt assault the first turn but shot us up with psybolt ammo guns and then assaulted us on the 3rd turn.  We had managed to kill 1 whole grey knight in the turn they couldnt assault  :-(

The guy checked the book and it said it can hold 12 models.  Didnt bother to apply the terminators count as two, or indeed you can only have 1 unit inside any transport, the optional dreadnaught is yet another rule this storm raven ignores.  Given how many rules it ignores entirely, it seemed plausable that it could hold so many troops.....

At the time we were too busy trying to kill the things it had dropped to worry about the cheating, especially after our ref had okayed it.

We did kill 12 of the 15 terminators by the end of the game, its just they had destroyed nearly everything we had.  He could have just deep struck his terminators, and that would have been legal and to be fair not greatly different, except one of his squads did hit terrain and would have died if it was deep striking.

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Offline rufus sparkfire

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #48 on: November 28, 2011, 03:43:13 PM »
It came on turn 2, full speed 24 inches and then because grey knights are a special snowflake Wardex they can still apparantly jump out and shoot,

They can deepstrike onto any point the stormraven has passed over while moving (using the normal deepstrike rules). They can't get out in front of it! Exactly the same as blood angels in a stormraven, or guard in a valkyrie.

Cheat-tastic!


Also:

Quote
as the front of the model is quite a lot further forwards than the base!

You measure from the base, not the model. Also in the rules!


It actually makes me a bit angry that the so-called 'ref' was so useless! Even though it was nothing to do with me!
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Offline Crimsonsphinx

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Re: 2V2 battle, Eldar list help
« Reply #49 on: November 28, 2011, 03:49:06 PM »
Yeah it did us too!
We got hold of the GK book after the game, as he left it by mistake, so we had a proper chance to read it. 

So it deepstrikes stuff out the back presumably, like the valk?  I am familiar with that rule, although I tend not to jump out with guardsmen, they are a bit too squishy! 

Hmm, he gained around 6 inches of movement measuring from the front of his stormraven, and putting them 2 inches in front.  We had never played against one, and as I said our ref had checked and said it was correct! 

We always play games with refs, to theoretically stop cheating.  Most commonly people "misinterpret" scatter dice directions and how many models are covered by templates.  Also to decide if a dice is cocked and should be rerolled.
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