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The General Archive => The Tactica Board => Topic started by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 24, 2012, 02:48:39 PM

Title: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 24, 2012, 02:48:39 PM
Tactical Decision Game 2.4:  The Plot Thickens


***Note-  read the following thread to follow along with the Tactical Decision Game 2 storyline: 
--Tactical Decision Game 2.0:  The Beginning (http://warhammer-empire.com/theforum/index.php?topic=43768.msg741970#msg741970)
--Tactical Decision Game 2.1:  Strategy & Deployment (http://warhammer-empire.com/theforum/index.php?topic=43814.msg743701#msg74370)
--Tactical Decision Game 2.2:  Magic, Magic, Magic (http://warhammer-empire.com/theforum/index.php?topic=43856.msg745342#msg745342)
--Tactical Decision Game 2.3:  To Charge or Not to Charge (http://warhammer-empire.com/theforum/index.php?topic=43862.msg745793#msg745793)


-------------------------------------

Tactical Decision Games are a fun way to think through tough situations that Empire Generals face.  It is all about making tough decisions in tough situations… so the next time you face similar situations-  you are ready for them!  Check out Tactical Decision Game 1:  Empire versus the Ogrebus (http://warhammer-empire.com/theforum/index.php?topic=43557.msg735054#msg735054) if you haven’t seen it yet to get an idea of what a TDG is all out. 

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I was tempted to go back to the Magic phase this time….but with so much movement and action on the field I decided to give you another round of decisions related to movement.  Hopefully your magic users survive Turn 3 so we can revisit them in the future!   :wink:


Team Blue Turn Three

Team B fires up the boiler’s in both its STanks.  Being aggressive despite the wounded tank, both attempt to generate 4 steam points. 

Of course, STank 1 suffers a mishap, rolling a Dangerous Overpressure on the chart.  It has a 33% chance to kill itself, but it rolls a 2 for the number of extra steam points for 2 wounds.  The STank has 1 wound left and is supercharged ready for action!  (Now, if it can just survive the forest!)

STank 2 has no issues.


(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2B3APrep_zps513e06c5.jpg)



What do you want to charge?

What do you want to do with the rest of your movement?

List each unit and what you would do with it.
 

I will total up what the majority opinion is for each unit and post the winning actions for final review before executing the movement phase.

--STank 1 is 7” away from the Executioners.
--STank 2 is 16” away from the Executioners.
--The Reiksguard are 16” away from the Executioners.


Team Green Turn Three

Your Steam Tank generates 4 Steam with no issues.


(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2G3APrep_zps5dc749ca.jpg)



What do you want to charge?

What do you want to do with the rest of your movement?

List each unit and what you would do with it.
 

I will total up what the majority opinion is for each unit and post the winning actions for final review before executing the movement phase.

--The Demis (DG1) can of course charge the Executioners.  They can also move outside the Executioner’s LOS with a reform and move forward.
--The STank is 12” away from the Executioners.
--The Reiksguard are 16” away from the Warrior Bus.
--The ICK are 19” away from the Warrior Bus.
--The vanilla Knights (Kn2) in the east are 17” away from the Harpies (Hp2).
--DG2 can obviously charge the Hydra, but cannot wheel around to hit the Shades.

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 24, 2012, 02:59:42 PM
Hmmm how many spears are left in the metal witches bunker?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zifnab0 on September 24, 2012, 03:04:27 PM
DG1: Move forward to within 1" of the Executioners so they cannot wheel past.

Steam Tank: Rumble towards the Spearmen and blast them with the steam gun.

ICK: Move forward, staying 14" away from the Spearmen bus.  Rearrange characters in the unit so that the Lord cannot be in base contact with either Huss or the BSB.  If Lord is in the center of the Spearmen, move Huss and BSB to the edges of ICK.  If he is on one side or the other, move Huss and BSB to the opposite side of ICK.

Reiksguard: Charge Shades, redirect into Hydra if (when) they flee.

DG2: Charge Hydra.

Kn2: Charge Harpies, redirect to shades (if visible)

Other considerations:
Magic: key spells are 5+ ward on the ICK, flaming attacks on the Reiksguard, and Iceshard the Spearmen.

Shooting: Steam gun on Spearmen, HBVG on the Dark Riders to wipe them out.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 24, 2012, 03:14:13 PM
DG1: Move forward to within 1" of the Executioners so they cannot wheel past.

Steam Tank: Rumble towards the Spearmen and blast them with the steam gun.

ICK: Move forward, staying 14" away from the Spearmen bus.  Rearrange characters in the unit so that the Lord cannot be in base contact with either Huss or the BSB.  If Lord is in the center of the Spearmen, move Huss and BSB to the edges of ICK.  If he is on one side or the other, move Huss and BSB to the opposite side of ICK.

Reiksguard: Charge Shades, redirect into Hydra if (when) they flee.

DG2: Charge Hydra.

Kn2: Charge Harpies, redirect to shades (if visible)

Other considerations:
Magic: key spells are 5+ ward on the ICK, flaming attacks on the Reiksguard, and Iceshard the Spearmen.

Shooting: Steam gun on Spearmen, HBVG on the Dark Riders to wipe them out.

Pretty much this.

Only change would be if the Shades flee Reiksguard then declare charge with Kn1 on fleeing Shades to send them running and then redirect into Harpies (who could bounce right off the board if they flee).

1st Volley gun short range on DR, 2nd Volley gun on Spears.
Title: Sv: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 24, 2012, 04:23:57 PM
updated

(http://s17.postimage.org/ad6qqmvvz/TDG2_B3_APrep_zps513e06c5.jpg) (http://postimage.org/)
photo upload (http://postimage.org/)

knights 1 : charge dark riders, if they run then redirect to shades, if whipeout reform to face shades and centre.

IC charge the harpies if we can stay out of overrun path from the big spear unit, they will wipeout the harpies and reform for charge vs big spear unit.

Knights 2 march pass the big spear unit, wheel to face both the bunker.

Reiksguard march on the hill to face big spear unit (any good ideas to how we avoid the harpies blocking a possible charge?)

Stank one should go left of the executioners with 3d6, get out of charge arc and steam kill 2/3 of them with S4 gun, then kill the rest with impact the following turn.

Stank two 2d6 over hill line up for canon vs front rank of big spear.

left Archer detachment, reform march around shades (being able to reform multiple times) and block their route to great cannon

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 24, 2012, 04:30:43 PM
Hmmm how many spears are left in the metal witches bunker?

I decided to create this Wound & Status Tracker to make sure we are not missing anything.  Of course, if you see any errors let me know.


Team Blue

Grand Master (front right)      Full health
Warrior Priest (next to TGM)   Full health
9 Knights of the Order      9 left

Luthor Huss (front right)      Full health
10 Reiksguard         10 left

Wizard Lord (front right)      Full health.  Used scroll
10 Archers            10 left
5 Archer Det            5 left
5 Archer Det            5 left

5 Knights             5 left

5 Knights             5 left

Great Cannon         2 wounds left

Steam Tank            3 wounds left.  Rusted, -1AS

Steam Tank            Full health


Dreadlord versus Team Blue

Dreadlord  (Gen) (front right)   Full health
Noble  (BSB)    (front left)      Full health
Death Sorc (5th from left)      Full health
47 Warriors              47 left

40 Executioners         24 left 

Supreme Sorceress (front right)   Full health
15 Warriors            11 left
   
12 Shades            9 left

5 Dark Riders         2 left

5 Harpies            5 left
5 Harpies            5 left


Team Green

Luthor Huss (front right)      Full health
Battle Wizard Lord (2nd row)   Full health, used scroll
Captain (BSB) (next to Huss)    Full health
13 Knights of the Inner Circle    13 left.  Rusted.  -1AS

6 Knightly Orders          6 left

Warrior Priest (front right)      Full health
9 Reiksguard Knights       9 left

Helblaster Volley Gun       2 wounds left
Master Engineer          Full health

Helblaster Volley Gun       Full health
Master Engineer         Full health

3 Inner Circle Knights      3 left

3 Inner Circle Knights      3 left.  Rusted, -1AS

Steam Tank            Full health


Dreadlord versus Team Green

Dreadlord  (Gen)          Full health
Noble  (BSB)            Full health
Death Sorc            Full health
Supreme Sorceress (front right)   Full health
47 Warriors              31 

40 Executioners         31 

15 Warriors            3 left
   
12 Shades            12 left

5 Dark Riders         5 left
5 Dark Riders                    5 left

5 Harpies            5 left

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Empire - Ulric on September 24, 2012, 04:46:49 PM
Of course I have a completely different take............ and a rather aggressive one........now is the time to clean up the executioners.

Charge then with the Demi-Gryphs and with the Steam Tank. We should kill roughly 14 or 15 of them on average before they get to strike (+ a 1 Point Steam Gunning so maybe another kill or 2 with 2d6 STR 2 Hits) The tank will definitely survive the Return Attacks hopefully fairly unscathed and some Demi-Gryphs should also survive. The end result should be the Tank Cleans up what's left of the Executioners on turn 4 and then turn 5/6 it's off to the Warrior Bunker and the characters.

We may wipe out the unit even quicker if we say move our Wizard out of the IC Knights and over towards this fight to try to support our units in combat with an ice shard blizzard on the Executioners and a harmonic convergence (boosted if we can get both the Steam Tank and the Demi-Gryphs in the bubble. Of course the positioning of the now Solo Wizard would be such that the Arcane Ruins block him getting charged by anything and he will need to keep the unit of harpies in his front LoS to be able to thunderbolt them if needed.

In the Shooting Phase the Hell Blaster will clean up the Dark Riders and the Left Flank should be ours.

The only gamble here is......... the tank is apparently 12 inches away. It might be closer once it pivots towards the Executioners before moving forwards but even then we are looking at maybe 10 inches at best which is still a gamble for 3d6 movement. But I'm a gambling man!

Remember we don't want to get the tank anywhere near the Deadlord as he will eat the Tank for Breakfast. The only way we want the tank in that combat is when we multi charge that unit and the Dreadlord will be in Base Contact with something else so he cannot make way and wail on our tank.

On the Right Flank I would also do things a little differently.

I would start with the Demi-Gryphs charging the Hydra.

The Reiksguard charge the Shades. If they flee redirect into the Hydra (If the Reiksguard can see the Hydra, I don't think they can) Also if the Shades flee the Small Knight unit will charge the shades to make them flee again and then re-direct into the Harpies (If they can see them) If the Shades hold from the original charge the Reiksguard will simply be able to overrun into the Hydra once they win combat and the Small Knight Unit will just charge the Harpies.

ICK: Move forward, staying 14" away from the Spearmen bus.  Rearrange characters in the unit so that the Lord cannot be in base contact with either Huss or the BSB.  If Lord is in the center of the Spearmen, move Huss and BSB to the edges of ICK.  If he is on one side or the other, move Huss and BSB to the opposite side of ICK.

The downside here is that if the harpies have not fled and the Knight Unit fails their charge on them then we risk losing the Hell Blaster to a Harpy Charge, however we may be able to clean them up with a Magic Missile. Either way that Hell Blaster is firing at the Warrior block with all the characters. (Another Gamble!)

The basic outline here is to hopefully wrap up the left flank in the next 2 turns and the right flank this turn. so for turns 5 - 6 we can focus all our attention on the Spear Horde with his characters and clean them up. while whittling down their numbers until the final charge

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zifnab0 on September 24, 2012, 05:00:41 PM
Thoughts?
What about 2 dice to the steam engine and 2 dice to the steam gun?  Use the DG1 to block the Executioners.  It's not as many casualties, but higher odds of succeeding.

If the spearmen dare to move up during the Dark Elves turn, we can ram them with the tank in the side, if not we can charge the Executioners on turn 4.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: grifter on September 24, 2012, 05:04:40 PM
Posted this on the old thread, what do you guys think?
(just updated it with the info HHG gave me).

Only 31 Executioners left. Maybe the STank should go for them in hopes of breaking them, together with the DG1. If that isn´t viable it should move to protect the HB from the Dark Riders (and get in the way of the Executioners) while the DG1 move behind the Exe´s to clean up those three Bunker-survivors and threaten the Spear Elves´ rear. Hellblaster should fire at the Executioners if we don´t charge them, the Dark Riders if we do.

The Reiksguard should charge the Shades. Or they could move towards the Spear Elves to cover the ICK. ICK could either charge the Harpies or
if that doesn´t seem viable to you guys, I propose moving them forward and slightly to the left to protect the Hellblaster and threaten a charge on the next turn if the Spear Elves don´t charge us first (and there hopefully shouldn´t be that many left after another round of shooting/magic  :closed-eyes:).
We want to charge the Hydra with the DG2 (and possibly the Reiksguard, if the Shades run). Kn2 march around the forest to threaten the Hydras flank/the Spear Elves rear.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Dnic on September 24, 2012, 05:28:11 PM
I like Empire - Ulric´s plan, with one exception. Instead of attacking the EXE this turn, with our DG1, i will move the DG1 out of EXE´s LOS, and place them for a flank charge next turn.
This way, will it not be so bad if the steam tank fail the charge.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 24, 2012, 05:32:29 PM
Thoughts?
What about 2 dice to the steam engine and 2 dice to the steam gun?  Use the DG1 to block the Executioners.  It's not as many casualties, but higher odds of succeeding.

If the spearmen dare to move up during the Dark Elves turn, we can ram them with the tank in the side, if not we can charge the Executioners on turn 4.

Well I'd be fine positioing the STank to block Riders and Steam the Execs along with 3 Arty short range + 3 Arty long range while the DG1 swing around to threaten center or rear of surviving Execs.  The forces out east should be fine.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 24, 2012, 06:41:54 PM
Come on team blue input please!

Well thanks for the lineup ...I think the old rusty bucket of a stank also is down to one wound now.

I guess we should use this turn to demonstrate why we chose an all cav list ....mobility.

Running the stank into the executioners risks a lot without any great yield....the stank has to take a dangerous terrain test and even if it makes it there will be enough executioners left to kill it so we would crash into the unit kill a lot of them ....and die.

I have another idea....how about we clear all the possible chaff away (Harpies, dark riders) then we redeploy our stanks and our reiksguard towards the center and increase the pressure on the dark elves....we should also pool all missle fire and magic missles into the metal witch bunker.

there are 11 spears left one flock of doom could kill one or two models,  so if we could make a flanking cannon shot we should force another look out sir roll.......if she makes it they should be reduced to 4 or 5 models pour in the archers should bring another one down then both stanks make use of their steam guns no look out sir should result in one very dead witch. Three cannonballs concentrated on the unit....the steam tanks also might get something with their repeater guns and if we are a bit lucky next turn the spears in the center face the ic knights, the reiksguard two stanks and two units of knights....yes we will lose the cannon to the shades...but who cares if we get the biggest prize the General....with bsb, and death witch and the spear horde.


That is what I would do....the executioners would be stranded in the corner of the battlefield not able to help out until the game is pretty much decided....if we have enough ressrouces left after turn 4 we might chase them down in turns 5 and 6.

something like this

(http://i839.photobucket.com/albums/zz318/morpheuskom/TDG2B3APrep_zpsf2b070bc.jpg)

Redeploy redeploy redeploy

 
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 24, 2012, 06:59:33 PM


Running the stank into the executioners risks a lot without any great yield....the stank has to take a dangerous terrain test and even if it makes it there will be enough executioners left to kill it so we would crash into the unit kill a lot of them ....and die.

It has 6 steam points, how about using going on the flank of the executioner and use 3 points on the steam gun, a flame template should hit almost all of them with S4, and then we run 'em down next turn = lots of Vpoints and we dont jeopadize it.?

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 24, 2012, 07:14:04 PM
But in the center we will be in trouble if we don´t concentrate on it...the executioners won´t pose any threat if we leave them alone.....also if the stank rolls low and stays in the charge arc...he is dead meat.

He can have a max of 5 steam points..so driving with 3 and cannon balling with 1 or 2.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Empire - Ulric on September 24, 2012, 07:24:18 PM
Quote
Dreadlord versus Team Green

Dreadlord  (Gen)          Full health
Noble  (BSB)            Full health
Death Sorc            Full health
Supreme Sorceress (front right)   Full health
47 Warriors              31

40 Executioners         31

15 Warriors            3 left
   
12 Shades            9 left

5 Dark Riders         2 left

5 Harpies            5 left

I believe Dreadlord should have 2 units of Dark Riders left still, both with 5 models left. Also the shades should still be at 12 models. (I'm pretty sure we didn't do jack to any of them)
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 24, 2012, 07:31:19 PM
But in the center we will be in trouble if we don´t concentrate on it...the executioners won´t pose any threat if we leave them alone.....also if the stank rolls low and stays in the charge arc...he is dead meat.

He can have a max of 5 steam points..so driving with 3 and cannon balling with 1 or 2.

Forgot the maximal of 5 steam point. The executioner represents about 500 points, but I agree that we need to take down the metal witch if we are to survive. I think we could make the left archer detachement go around the shades blocking the charge of the great canon.

With 5 steam points, we can roll 2d6 for engine, use one for the canon and two for a steamgun shot of the harpies + the repeater pistol  = panic test for that harpy unit.
 
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 24, 2012, 07:32:45 PM
Great point about the shades!

I guess we should take the whole 3d6 on the engine to get away from the executioners I think even 1 steam point on the gun will be enough and steam gun and pistol on the harpies.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 24, 2012, 07:44:31 PM
Quote
Dreadlord versus Team Green

Dreadlord  (Gen)          Full health
Noble  (BSB)            Full health
Death Sorc            Full health
Supreme Sorceress (front right)   Full health
47 Warriors              31

40 Executioners         31

15 Warriors            3 left
   
12 Shades            9 left

5 Dark Riders         2 left

5 Harpies            5 left

I believe Dreadlord should have 2 units of Dark Riders left still, both with 5 models left. Also the shades should still be at 12 models. (I'm pretty sure we didn't do jack to any of them)

Yep, that is from a cut and paste job from the Blue Team. Easy to miss stuff.  I will modify the post.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 24, 2012, 07:55:00 PM
Great point about the shades!

I guess we should take the whole 3d6 on the engine to get away from the executioners I think even 1 steam point on the gun will be enough and steam gun and pistol on the harpies.


You're right about the harpies, 3 shots from the pistol should take down one harpy and the steam should take 1-2 = panic.

We need to make sure our knights dont get in the overrun path of the spears. I cant really figure if we make this more likely by moving the archers infront of them to the right as you suggest.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 24, 2012, 08:12:13 PM
Or we could Stank the DR (execs wont be able to charge volleys thus way), shoot Execs with HBVGs, position the DG1 around the Execs for center support or rear charge....
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zakalwe on September 24, 2012, 08:31:31 PM
Pretty much agree with what has been said so far.

If we don't kill the harpies, shuffling the ICK over a bit should block them from charging the hellblasters for a turn. ! in woood would be out of LOS, i think the far one is too far away.

If the reiksguard are forced to stumble forward, because the shades flee, how would we redress the centre and taking on the bus?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 24, 2012, 09:07:34 PM
Or we could Stank the DR (execs wont be able to charge volleys thus way), shoot Execs with HBVGs, position the DG1 around the Execs for center support or rear charge....

Or we could just pound the Execs with the STank while they are unbuffed and we are unhexed.  Position the DGs assuming a successful steadfast test for a flank/rear charge.  Maybe we can Iceshard them also....
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Bildskoene Bengtsson on September 24, 2012, 09:15:24 PM
I'm all for the plan Fandir proposed. Putting preassure on that witch is essential and the execs can wait. Hopefully the woods will strangle some more if they choose to take that rout. Losing the Cannon is acceptable and possibly even good for us since that'll mean that one of dreadlords chaff units is out of the way while all our major units are looking to charge his Spearmen.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 24, 2012, 09:17:26 PM
I think windelovs idea of sacrificing the 5 left archers to give the cannon another round of shooting has some merits.....it would decrease our chances to reduce the unit below 5 though.

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Bildskoene Bengtsson on September 24, 2012, 09:23:26 PM
I would much rather lose our Cannon AND have a chance to kill the witch than be safe with the cannon and not kill the witch. There is also a chance that Dreadlord will relocate the Shades to block the ICK (is that even possible by the way?) rather than go for the cannon.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 24, 2012, 09:25:50 PM
Good points...so everything ON TARGET!

The witch....must burn. If we allocate enough effort into it and she should die...I don´t really see how he will deal with the stanks.  Also I think this turn she is far enough away that either he makes no charges with the big spear block and moves the witch over...and next turn all hell will break loose with stanks and knights everywhere or we have another turn of cannonballs to the face.



Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 24, 2012, 09:37:02 PM
My concern is that the executioners aren't as out of the game as they look.
They could have a reasonable attempt at a charge on a STank....probably needing an 8 or 9 to make it. (i would be happy ti give them a 10 on the dice as a safe range....but its hard to control due to the random movement.

Also if we reduce the bunker in size but fail to get the mage this turn she could very well jump ship to the main spear unit if they choose to reform rather than charge our archers.

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 24, 2012, 09:43:12 PM
So HHG....can you tell us a bit about ranges...how likely is it that the stank puts 15 inches between the executioners and himself and still aims his big gun for the witch?


Plan b could be to park the reiksguard before the executioners. They are no longer in horde and we would strike before them Luthor could decimate their numbers with his mighty hammer.......

I would prefer moving the reiksguard over to the center too though.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 24, 2012, 09:45:16 PM
i think I like fandir's movement plan and shooting priority, but with the STank on 1 wound I prefer the positioning from Zac, but planning to shoot the harpies with the engineer and followup with the steam gun if required....otherwise the steam gun can target teh executioners.
The main priority for me with this play is to get rid of the only redirector that will stop us charging as we want in the next turn.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 24, 2012, 09:56:51 PM
I think the reiksguard will have a hard time coming by the stank so another idea could be to place them on the hill facing the excecutioners in a way that the rear two or three ranks will touch the woods so they won´t be steadfast...they charge up the hill...maybe make it if they make it they have 14 attacks at ws of 5 so hitting on 3+ 11 hits re rolls 13 hits wounding on 2+ 11 wounds save on 4+ 6 wounds

Knights strike back luthor makes his I kill you all move +d3 to everything and should sort out 3-4 models hitting on 3+ wounding on 2+ on 2-5 attacks

all reiksguard go before the executioners hitting on 4+ wounding on 3+ 6+ save so 10 attacks  7-8 hits 5-6 wounds horsies another 6 attacks.....well we should grind them down they fail their CR and we kill em......problem will arise should they hold or decapitate Luthor or any other funky stuff.....if we can avoid them...we should.
 
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Grazhnakk on September 24, 2012, 10:12:58 PM

Yup, def. avoid the executioners w/the Reiksguard. They're deadly even to heavy cav. More importantly, if we're committed to this redeploy, then we need to just do the redeploy. The Reiksguard are too important to be left to clean up the executioners. Even so, we should bring a unit of archers around to redirect the executioners - we have two turns to get the archers into position, so we should be fine there.

Have we thought about grapeshot for the cannon vs. shades? If they're in range, pepper 'em good!
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Friar Metick on September 24, 2012, 11:10:53 PM
I like the idea of ganging up on the Exe unit with DGk1's and the steam tank. Take out the DR1's with the HVG(s) depending if one of them flubs its shots. If one HVG takes out the DR1's shoot the other one at the Spr unit.  :eusa_clap:

Plan A - I'd follow what many of you said charge DGK2's into hydra, charge shades with RKG's redirect to hydra if they flee. Use the Kn2's to charge fleeing shades, redirect into harpies. If this redirect charge fails angle ICk so wizard has LOS to harpies and hit them with magic.

But, looking at HHG's layout, I don't think the RKG's have line of sight to the hydra and I have a plan B. So my plan B on the east flank would be to Charge the hydra with the Dgk2's. I think this will open up a lane to the shades for KN2's to charge their flank. If they flee they will go toward the Spr unit. At that point redirect Kn2's to the harpies and then charge the shades with the RKG's and force them to flee through the Spr and DR2 units. I would not redirect the RKG's into the Spr unit - let them fail the charge and move forward a max of 6" toward them. I feel this will prevent the RKG's from having a failed charge on the shades and then exposing their flank to a charge by the Spr unit. I think dreadlord would do this and then move his DR2 unit up to redirect our ICK unit so they can't help the RKG unit. If the kn2's fail their redirect into the harpies described in this plan B then follow the plan A above for the Ick's to get line of sight to the harpies in the remaining moves part of movement phase.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: mottdon on September 24, 2012, 11:15:35 PM
I agree with the re-deployment to the center.  I also agree that all fire needs to be directed to the metal witch's bunker.  I'm not as concerned about the executioners catching up with our forces in time to save the rest of his army.  Once they do, we should be able to have finished up the rest of his army and concentrate on them.  I also am not as concerned with losing our cannon.  If he wants to take units out of the main fight, fine by me.  I would also really like to see the Reiksgard focus on the center and stay away from the executioners.  We need to combine our army's units in order to crush his big blocks.  Focusing fire on the bunker should take care of it.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 24, 2012, 11:47:34 PM
Ok, I think team green is pretty much in agreement.  My thoughts are pretty similar:

Charges:
1. Demi's into hydra
2. Reiksguard into shades, redirect if possible (looks unlikely)
3. Vanilla knights into harpies, redirect into shades if that's an option
4. Stank into executioners, hopefully making it

Moves:
If stank makes charge, Demi's move forward and then wheel in executioner flank to set up a flank charge. If the stank falls a couple inches short, is there the option to wheel the Demi's so that the executioners would have to wheel nearly 90 degrees to charge them, where the stank makes it an illegal charge and vice versa for the stank? I think this is the case if the stank rolls a 10 or 11

Ick, don't care much about moving them as long as we're in range for our spells. I like the harmonic convergence bubble and the comet back behind the spear bus to force them forward and make the dark riders and those 3 random warriors move. So hopefully we get 8-9 dice so we can get them both cast and then maybe iceshard on the executioners if we have one or two dice left if the stank is in combat.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 24, 2012, 11:59:36 PM
Hey HHG!  Can the Reiksguard see the Hydra? :icon_biggrin:
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 25, 2012, 12:48:41 AM
Team Green-  the Reiksguard cannot see the Hydra and charge it-  it is not in its LOS. 


So HHG....can you tell us a bit about ranges...how likely is it that the stank puts 15 inches between the executioners and himself and still aims his big gun for the witch?

Unfortunately, I think George has a point.  Since I am helping out Dreadlord, I was hoping you wouldn't see it.

The arrow below is 15" from the Executioners.  Not that I want to give you advice or anything...but I think you would be much better served moving that STank a full 3d6 straight towards the Sorc bunker...instead of trying to get cute and attempt to do too many things at once.  The Execs will be up your butt before you can adjust your codpiece!   :-)


(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2B3ARng.jpg)

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 25, 2012, 12:54:26 AM
BTW-  great posts on TDG 2.4!

People are thinking hard, coming up with great ideas, and I see people getting ideas from other's ideas generating new ideas...!

Awesome stuff.  :::cheers:::
HHG

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 25, 2012, 01:08:32 AM
At friar, I dont see how the charge declaration of the Demi's I to the hydra will open up a lane to the shades. You declare all charges before you move them, so the knights won't be able to see them through the Demis.

I think it is important to charge the harpies first with the vanilla knights, then redirect to the shades if possible, just in ase they fail their redirect   The harpies have a better chance of going off of the board, and are a bigger nuisance to us in this game.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 25, 2012, 01:09:41 AM
Team Green-  the Reiksguard cannot see the Hydra and charge it-  it is not in its LOS.

Well heck.  Time to reconsider. 

DGs charge Hydra.
Kn1 charge Shades flank.
IF Shades flee Kn1 THEN declare charge with Reikguard vs Shades.  We might be able to run them down out of LOS of Spears.

IF we can't see Shades with KN1 then we have to bring the STank over to cover the failed Reiksguard charge.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zifnab0 on September 25, 2012, 01:25:47 AM
Team Green-  the Reiksguard cannot see the Hydra and charge it-  it is not in its LOS.
Can Kn2 see the shades?

If so, I agree with Kn2 charge shades, redirect to harpies.
Reiksguard charge shades
DG2 charge Hydra.

Seems we're mostly in agreement on what to do out east, but the west is still in flux.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Friar Metick on September 25, 2012, 01:35:22 AM
At friar, I dont see how the charge declaration of the Demi's I to the hydra will open up a lane to the shades. You declare all charges before you move them, so the knights won't be able to see them through the Demis.

I think it is important to charge the harpies first with the vanilla knights, then redirect to the shades if possible, just in ase they fail their redirect   The harpies have a better chance of going off of the board, and are a bigger nuisance to us in this game.
I see your point, in our area we play it as declare a charge - opponent gives their charge reaction, execute it then move on to the next charge. With this sequence the Dgk2's could charge first to open up a lane for the kn2's to charge the shades as long as they have line of sight (meaning you are right we have to be sure when the DGK2's charge off the hill they would be below the kn2's enough to see the shades).

One other advantage to these charges we will also get +1 combat res for the Dgk2's and kn2's for charging down hill.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Ads on September 25, 2012, 01:58:33 AM
FYI fandir, you can have more than 5 steam points. The stank is on 6 because it generated 4 plus 2 from the misfire reducing it from 3 wounds to 1. The limitation of 5 is only at the initial generation of steam points. So you could still 3d6 move and 3 points into steam gun or cannon
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: MrAbyssal on September 25, 2012, 02:13:00 AM
I'm going to go with the Fandir/Windelov plan, but have the good Steam Tank skim around the edge of that forest. I like the Reiksguard redeploying away from the Executioners. We should try and leave them stranded for a turn.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 25, 2012, 02:31:05 AM
I feel like we will lose the STank with 1 wound next turn.
The best use I see for him is to delay the executioners if possible. I'm still advocating aiming for the gap bewteen the harpies and executioners so it can't be charged. This means either the executioners spend a turn reforming to face it or Dreadlord relies on the metal mage to blow it up....which means less spells at the intact parts of our army.

STank 2 should be able to pick an angle to be outside of 14inch from the executioners and reiksgaurd will have an awkward movement to do the same.

Another crazy idea to redeploy the reiksguard would be to offer up a charge for the executioners aat a long didtance and flee from the charge. I'd be aiming for a flee angle that aims us at the side of the spears. so we can't be charged  or overrun into. This would then slow the executioners down to a 6" move max.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Friar Metick on September 25, 2012, 02:36:37 AM
Noght says: IF we can't see Shades with KN1 then we have to bring the STank over to cover the failed Reiksguard charge.

True dat, another good option. Then I would choose to reform the DGK1's in the west to slip past the Exe unit and head toward the 3 remaining/hiding spearmen to flush them out and threaten the Spr unit.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 25, 2012, 02:47:26 AM
Team Green-  the Reiksguard cannot see the Hydra and charge it-  it is not in its LOS.
Can Kn2 see the shades?

Man, I would love to say yes for you...but none of their models are hanging out over either side and they are down below the hill.

So the Kn does not have LOS to the Shades.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Friar Metick on September 25, 2012, 02:57:20 AM
Team Green-  the Reiksguard cannot see the Hydra and charge it-  it is not in its LOS.
Can Kn2 see the shades?

Man, I would love to say yes for you...but none of their models are hanging out over either side and they are down below the hill.

So the Kn does not have LOS to the Shades.

Dang it, you sure we don't have a tall in the saddle guy that see them.  :-D Oh well, looks like we have to charge the Rkg into the shades, if they flee hopefully they panic the hydra too(hydra looks to be out of the gen/bsb ldrshp bubble). Then we may be able to chase both units off the table (or catch one or both) with the Dgk2's and kn2's. Then redirect the kn2's into the harpies.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 25, 2012, 03:15:07 AM
Team Green-  the Reiksguard cannot see the Hydra and charge it-  it is not in its LOS.
Can Kn2 see the shades?

Man, I would love to say yes for you...but none of their models are hanging out over either side and they are down below the hill.

So the Kn does not have LOS to the Shades.

You're killing me Smalls.  :icon_smile:

Well, IF the Reiksguard charge Shades who flee will the DGs or Kn1 see them as they run over the hill?

NVM, looked at Pic, never on the hill....

Well we can hope the Hydra panics and then declare charges in order.

We need to decide after charges where to commit the STank.  We may be forced to fight the unbuffed Execs right now, hope the Reiksguard survive and flank charge with IC.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 25, 2012, 04:16:43 AM
Well I say commit the stank into the executioners. That's the matchup we wanted for it. If it doesn't make it, we get to steam gun, and it will hold up for a turn to let the Demis charge into the flank. If it makes the charge, the executioners will be taking a break test. On a failed charge there could be the potential for a failed panic test as well.

We will have the right side cleared up by the top of our 4. If the spears charge the reiksguard, we can flee with them and rally on our 4 to get them into the fray on 5 or 6. Or we can hold with them, they should survive for a counter. Are they in range of the BSB? That will be fine too. We're in good shape right now. What we need is to get into combat this turn with unbuffed elves while we can.

This is our turn to pull ahead, we can't give their wizard too much freedom to be offensive with their spell selection this turn.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 25, 2012, 04:44:19 AM

Well, IF the Reiksguard charge Shades who flee will the DGs or Kn1 see them as they run over the hill?

This plan was posted early on and I think it is definitely doable:

If the Reik charge, the Shades would flee towards the south- which is immediately executed when declaring a Flee reaction. 

Next, the Kn could declare a charge against the Shades, because at this point they would now be able to see the Shades, forcing them to Flee again away from the Knights towards the board edge.

If the Kn make a Leadership test, they could then re-direct to the Harpies.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 25, 2012, 05:00:40 AM
And I'm saying in this situation you'd still want to declare the charge against the harpies first, then if they flee, you redirect to the shades. We can't have the harpies out there as a second redirector for our 4th turn.

If I was the dark elf player, I would hold with the harpies and hope for a failed charge, because they'll be so useful next turn.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 25, 2012, 05:11:44 AM
just a thought for team green
When the Demi's charge the Hydra will a pursuit or overrun cause it to hit the shades?
Title: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 25, 2012, 05:50:03 AM
I feel like we will lose the STank with 1 wound next turn.
The best use I see for him is to delay the executioners if possible. I'm still advocating aiming for the gap bewteen the harpies and executioners so it can't be charged. This means either the executioners spend a turn reforming to face it or Dreadlord relies on the metal mage to blow it up....which means less spells at the intact parts of our army.

STank 2 should be able to pick an angle to be outside of 14inch from the executioners and reiksgaurd will have an awkward movement to do the same.

Another crazy idea to redeploy the reiksguard would be to offer up a charge for the executioners aat a long didtance and flee from the charge. I'd be aiming for a flee angle that aims us at the side of the spears. so we can't be charged  or overrun into. This would then slow the executioners down to a 6" move max

There are few things that can kill the steamtank: misfire of the canon and spells and the DE player has plenty of more tempting targets currently. The harpies isnt realy a threat although they may lock it down for a turn. What fandir is advocating is a all or nothing attack on the metal sorc., and i think its the right thing to do even though i initially suggested otherwise. The executioners will not become a bigger threat over time and we should concentrate our forces on the centre.

.[/color]
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 25, 2012, 06:00:29 AM

There are few things that can kill the steamtank: misfire of the canon and spells and the DE player has plenty of more tempting targets currently. The harpies isnt realy a threat although they may lock it down for a turn. What fandir is advocating is a all or nothing attack on the metal sorc., and i think its the right thing to do even though i initially suggested otherwise. The executioners will not become a bigger threat over time and we should concentrate our forces on the centre.

My concern with the harpies is their ability to screw up our charges turn 4. With the harpies out of the way we could end up being able to charge the spears on turn 4 with both large blocks of knights and the steam tank while using the small knight unit to keep the executioners from having any more impact on the game.
I have concerns that we will just end up locked in one massive combat in the middle in which the executioners will be deciding factor in about turn 5 or 6.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Bildskoene Bengtsson on September 25, 2012, 06:25:21 AM
I feel like we will lose the STank with 1 wound next turn.
The best use I see for him is to delay the executioners if possible. I'm still advocating aiming for the gap bewteen the harpies and executioners so it can't be charged. This means either the executioners spend a turn reforming to face it or Dreadlord relies on the metal mage to blow it up....which means less spells at the intact parts of our army.

STank 2 should be able to pick an angle to be outside of 14inch from the executioners and reiksgaurd will have an awkward movement to do the same.

Another crazy idea to redeploy the reiksguard would be to offer up a charge for the executioners aat a long didtance and flee from the charge. I'd be aiming for a flee angle that aims us at the side of the spears. so we can't be charged  or overrun into. This would then slow the executioners down to a 6" move max

There are few things that can kill the steamtank: misfire of the canon and spells and the DE player has plenty of more tempting targets currently. The harpies isnt realy a threat although they may lock it down for a turn. What fandir is advocating is a all or nothing attack on the metal sorc., and i think its the right thing to do even though i initially suggested otherwise. The executioners will not become a bigger threat over time and we should concentrate our forces on the centre.

.[/color]

I really have to agree with windelov here. Everything has to go to the center if we want to put preassure on the metal-witch. Even a 1 wound STank is a problem for Dreadlord and if he choose to kill it with a spell then something else lives. The execs will arrive to late if we go for a Turn 4 Charge with everything. And as mentioned the STank is supposed to clear of the harpies if possible.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 25, 2012, 06:41:39 AM
I think both stanks could manage to shoot their repeater pistols at the harpies killing one or two of them a panic check is all we need.

IF the wounded ol rusty (STank 1 with one wound) isn´t likely to get away from the exectutioners if it lines up to kill the witch we should consider moving it to line up a shot at the spear horde with the cannon ball going through the first rank forcing look out sir on the dreadlord, the bsb and the death mage all without any wardsaves, Dreadlord was rather lucky on his leadership tests if I have learned one thing in warhammer, it is that the dice even out through a game you just have to force enough rolls and at some point everyone runs out of luck.

So what we could do

Stank one move with 3 dice towards the spear horde in a way that the harpies remain within 12 inch 1-2 dice cannon shot repeater pistol on harpies.

Stank two move with 3 dice towards the metal witch 1-2 dic cannon shot if possible repeater pistol on harpies.

Reiksguard moves over the hill not touching the woods if possible trying to stay at least 14 inches away from the executioners.

Archer detachments move to shoot at the metal sorc bunker the right one tries to block the spear hoard in a way that makes an overrun to the ick impossible and would bring the spear horde closer to the stanks if he choses to overrun.

Knight 1 on the left charges the dark riders

Knight 2 on the right moves into a position to support an attack on the spear hoard OR in need redeploys to intercept the executioners from being a threat in turn 5

big archer group moves into a position to fire their arrows into the metal witches unit.

We concentrate what we have on her unit flock of doom .

Cannon and stank 2 will try to shoot the metal sorcs bunker...cannon 1 should make the start trying to get rid of the first rank of her bunker possibly killing all five targets and forcing a look out sir roll then the archers let fly and hopefully kill the last one or two models we need for the unit to be depleted enough to grant no more look out sir. With a little luck..(nothing unreasonable here...failing a look out sir roll is a 16 % itself...as is a misfire  :ph34r:) we should be able to bring the witch down...if not we have good chances to put enough pressure on the darklord to make the next turn very interesting at least.  
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 25, 2012, 06:53:23 AM
okay...you've convinced me
having the small knight unit in position to deflect the executioners was the clincher....but damn I hope we panic those harpies or kill the mage.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 25, 2012, 07:05:04 AM
It is all about stacking chances....if we don´t kill the harpies and don´t kill the metal witch....the fight still isn´t over but we have to figure out new stuff next turn depending on how the dreadlord reacts and in turn puts pressure on us....it is always important keeping the heat up especially in tournament games as people start to make mistakes and lose the game to those....

This is the reason I think most gunlines lose in tournaments as they have only one way to put on pressure and often have a hard time to react on it they sit....and wait...and hope to kill enough of the enemy to survive the close combat.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 25, 2012, 07:37:18 AM
using the archers to block the shades should not affect our use of the canon, we can simply line them up just blocking the right side of the front, just barely blocking their path.. they should still be able to shoot at the wizard bunker  although with long range instead of short (hitting on 6 instead of 5+). The shades will most likely charge us next turn but our canon lives and may fire yet another turn

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 25, 2012, 07:54:49 AM
George Bengtson....what is your call on the archer detachment? we lose five S3 shots but gain our cannon for another turn.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Bildskoene Bengtsson on September 25, 2012, 08:24:33 AM
George Bengtson....what is your call on the archer detachment? we lose five S3 shots but gain our cannon for another turn.

If we'll be able to kill enough of the bunker without those 5 shots, then yes I'm all for saving our cannon. If not then I say sacrifice the cannon. Isn't there also a slight risk that the cannon will panic from the slaughtered archers?

We should also decide what we want to use the cannon for next turn. Sniping a character and hoping for a 1? The extra shot must be put to good use if we choose that path.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 25, 2012, 09:34:18 AM
George Bengtson....what is your call on the archer detachment? we lose five S3 shots but gain our cannon for another turn.

If we'll be able to kill enough of the bunker without those 5 shots, then yes I'm all for saving our cannon. If not then I say sacrifice the cannon. Isn't there also a slight risk that the cannon will panic from the slaughtered archers?

We should also decide what we want to use the cannon for next turn. Sniping a character and hoping for a 1? The extra shot must be put to good use if we choose that path.

I think we will be able to shoot, just at long instead of half range, so at 6+ instead of 5+
Also if we roll high with the 6 steam point tank, we might get in range of the big spear unit with the steam gun,

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Bildskoene Bengtsson on September 25, 2012, 09:41:16 AM

I think we will be able to shoot, just at long instead of half range, so at 6+ instead of 5+


I know but 6+ instead of 5+ basicly means zero dead in the bunker instead of one. Question is do we need that extra dead spearman or not?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 25, 2012, 09:44:02 AM
Also some will have reductions from cover due to the shades and the ruins.....lets just assume those 5 shots won´t count for much.

I think every single dead spear in the unit counts.



 Also we have to consider this if the spear horde charges to clear out the archer detachment 2 the witch can´t join the unit. So more likely should the witch survive she will join the big ass horde of spears making one nice big juicy all eggs in one basket now dreadlord really would have to get rid of the stanks to still win the day so he has to rely on magic if searing doom (big version) goes off one stank should be done ( I guess he would try to kill the cursed stank and kill ol rusty with spirit leech) if he goes for big he will most likely provoke a miscast yet another chance for the witch to die and also to take along several spears with her.  
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 25, 2012, 09:50:03 AM
I think give the shades the cannon...it keeps them a turn away from the action....ie can't block our charges
We're going to win big by getting the spears or lose big....the cannons points aren't likely to matter too much
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 25, 2012, 10:04:14 AM
Oh well, you're proberly right, let the cannon die :dry:
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zakalwe on September 25, 2012, 10:05:34 AM
I am +1 for moving the Stank towards the executioners, and moving the demi's round. I would be tempted to save the Steam gun for the Dark riders, this plus engineer pistol could clear them. Meaning we get 2 HBVG's at the spears.
DGK2 into Hydra is a given. Hope we knock some wounds off before the breath weapon hits .

Would it be an option just to hold with the reiksguard, blocking harpy Los atm. Charge Harpies with KN2, meaning if they flee we have knight 2 supporting reiks should the spears risk a long charge.

If we do charge with the reiksguard and we stumble forward. there is a fair chance our champion will hold his own in a challenge against anything other than the dreadlord. Holding his spears in place should they charge.

Shuffle the ICK over a bit and angle to allow a Thunderbolt on the DR and block Harpy LOS to nearest Hellblaster should it all go pete tong.

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 25, 2012, 10:25:49 AM
If we roll high for movement of the Stank1 (12+ "), we might consider pointing the steam gun at the big spearunit, although it's hard to see from the maps I would guess we would be able to hit about 10 including a character or two

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 25, 2012, 11:11:06 AM
And I'm saying in this situation you'd still want to declare the charge against the harpies first, then if they flee, you redirect to the shades. We can't have the harpies out there as a second redirector for our 4th turn.

If I was the dark elf player, I would hold with the harpies and hope for a failed charge, because they'll be so useful next turn.

If the Harpies hold (and they will hoping for 9 or less) then we can't declare a charge on the fleeing Shades.  So we have to declare Kn1 on Shades and hope to make the LD8 test redirect?

We could send the STank at the Riders, if we make it they die, if not Steam them.  Either way the STank is in the way.  Unload all Volleys on the Execs.  Reposition DG1 for flank or rear charge on Execs or center. 

Flee with Reiksguard when Spears charge.  Move IC's up a bit per Zif's plan, though I'd stay 15" away.

Iceshard the Execs and hope they blow a panic test or Terror test so they can't charge the STank.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zifnab0 on September 25, 2012, 11:39:13 AM
Reposting the modified plan from before:

DG1: Move forward to within 1" of the Executioners so they cannot wheel past. Move out of Executioner front arc, position for a flank/rear charge against Executioners next turn.

Steam Tank: Rumble 2 steam points towards the Spearmen Dark Riders and blast them with the steam gun.

ICK: Move forward, staying 14 15" away from the Spearmen bus.  Rearrange characters in the unit so that the Lord cannot be in base contact with either Huss or the BSB.  If Lord is in the center of the Spearmen, move Huss and BSB to the edges of ICK.  If he is on one side or the other, move Huss and BSB to the opposite side of ICK.

Reiksguard: Charge Shades, redirect into Hydra if (when) they flee.

DG2: Charge Hydra.

Kn2: Charge Harpies, redirect to shades (if visible) Charge (now visible) fleeing shades, redirect into harpies.

Other considerations:
Magic: key spells are 5+ ward on the ICK, flaming attacks on the Reiksguard, and Iceshard the Spearmen.

Shooting: Steam gun on Spearmen, HBVG on the Dark Riders Spearmen to wipe them out.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Friar Metick on September 25, 2012, 11:59:02 AM
Reposting the modified plan from before:

DG1: Move forward to within 1" of the Executioners so they cannot wheel past. Move out of Executioner front arc, position for a flank/rear charge against Executioners next turn.

Steam Tank: Rumble 2 steam points towards the Spearmen Dark Riders and blast them with the steam gun.

ICK: Move forward, staying 14 15" away from the Spearmen bus.  Rearrange characters in the unit so that the Lord cannot be in base contact with either Huss or the BSB.  If Lord is in the center of the Spearmen, move Huss and BSB to the edges of ICK.  If he is on one side or the other, move Huss and BSB to the opposite side of ICK.

Reiksguard: Charge Shades, redirect into Hydra if (when) they flee.

DG2: Charge Hydra.

Kn2: Charge Harpies, redirect to shades (if visible) Charge (now visible) fleeing shades, redirect into harpies.

Other considerations:
Magic: key spells are 5+ ward on the ICK, flaming attacks on the Reiksguard, and Iceshard the Spearmen.

Shooting: Steam gun on Spearmen, HBVG on the Dark Riders Spearmen to wipe them out.

You have my vote. Hopefully the DGK2's will be charging a fleeing hydra.  :-)   :::cheers:::   :eusa_clap:
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 25, 2012, 12:07:39 PM
Reposting the modified plan from before:

DG1: Move forward to within 1" of the Executioners so they cannot wheel past. Move out of Executioner front arc, position for a flank/rear charge against Executioners next turn.

Steam Tank: Rumble 2 steam points towards the Spearmen Dark Riders and blast them with the steam gun.

ICK: Move forward, staying 14 15" away from the Spearmen bus.  Rearrange characters in the unit so that the Lord cannot be in base contact with either Huss or the BSB.  If Lord is in the center of the Spearmen, move Huss and BSB to the edges of ICK.  If he is on one side or the other, move Huss and BSB to the opposite side of ICK.

Reiksguard: Charge Shades, redirect into Hydra if (when) they flee.

DG2: Charge Hydra.

Kn2: Charge Harpies, redirect to shades (if visible) Charge (now visible) fleeing shades, redirect into harpies.

Other considerations:
Magic: key spells are 5+ ward on the ICK, flaming attacks on the Reiksguard, and Iceshard the Spearmen.

Shooting: Steam gun on Spearmen, HBVG on the Dark Riders Spearmen to wipe them out.

You have my vote. Hopefully the DGK2's will be charging a fleeing hydra.  :-)   :::cheers:::   :eusa_clap:

I concur.  Just wondering about what's the benefit of 5 str 3 steam blast vs just plowing into the Riders with D6 + 3d3 grind?  Unless we're afraid we won't make the distance?  Engineer has 3 shots with Repeater Pistol also?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zifnab0 on September 25, 2012, 12:26:50 PM
I concur.  Just wondering about what's the benefit of 5 str 3 steam blast vs just plowing into the Riders with D6 + 3d3 grind?  Unless we're afraid we won't make the distance?  Engineer has 3 shots with Repeater Pistol also?

Distance.  We're more than 12" away from the Dark Riders.  If we put all 3 dice into the steam engine we've got a low chance of hitting the riders, leaving only 1 dice for the steam gun.  2 dice gives us a decent position and the steam gun is big enough to hit all of the riders.

Second, if we run into the Dark Riders the Executioners will hit our flank.  If we don't go straight at them we can present the front of the tank.

HHG: What's your position on the Executioners reforming after combat to present their rear to the steam tank and their front to the DG?  Legal or not?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zakalwe on September 25, 2012, 12:27:12 PM
If we plow into the DR and kill them all, what is to stop the executioners from flank charging the STank.   Would both HBVG shoot the executioners, to aid the flank. if not steam tank will suffer/ could even die if it got hit in the flank by 3 ranks of executioners.

Hell doing the maths, average says we will stick around.

What are we going to shoot the HBVG's at I think it would be preferable to shoot both at one target, exec's or spears.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 25, 2012, 12:33:30 PM
If we plow into the DR and kill them all, what is to stop the executioners from flank charging the STank.   Would both HBVG shoot the executioners, to aid the flank. if not steam tank will suffer/ could even die if it got hit in the flank by 3 ranks of executioners.

Hell doing the maths, average says we will stick around.

What are we going to shoot the HBVG's at I think it would be preferable to shoot both at one target, exec's or spears.

Agree with Zif, no reason to rumble into Riders.  Shoot both Volley Guns into Spears.  9 wounds is a panic, though we could do more than that...
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zakalwe on September 25, 2012, 12:34:44 PM
 Looking at the map, if we pivot and steam towards and move 2 dice aiming at the gap between DR and exec's we can get all 5 DR with Steam gun and only allow the executioners an awkward frontal charge.
I believe we could do this without modifying the HBVG's hit chances on the execs.

depending on how magic phase goes, yes boosted convergence and iceshard on the executioners. Perhaps even another comet between the spears and small bunker, if we have the dice.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 25, 2012, 12:40:55 PM

 iceshard on the executioners.

Plus 6 Arty dice = 8 wounds, panic check on 7.  If they make that the Terror on 7 to charge STank?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 25, 2012, 12:52:44 PM
We figured out that you don´t have to take terror checks from randomly moving targets.

(checked the english brb and there is no mentioning excepting terror and random move)
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zifnab0 on September 25, 2012, 12:58:23 PM
We figured out that you don´t have to take terror checks from randomly moving targets.
But if the Executioners charge the Steam Tank, they have to test, right?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 25, 2012, 12:58:50 PM
We figured out that you don´t have to take terror checks from randomly moving targets.
But if the Executioners charge the Steam Tank, they have to test, right?

Correct.

Hmmm.  Not sure.  Can't find it in the book.  Old rule?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 25, 2012, 01:37:36 PM
I think both stanks could manage to shoot their repeater pistols at the harpies killing one or two of them a panic check is all we need.

The Steam Gun has a 360 degree arc of fire, but the Engineer has to shoot out of the forward firing arch with his repeater pistol.  In this situation, I think both tanks are going to be facing to the west and the Harpies are going to be out of the LOS.

HHG: What's your position on the Executioners reforming after combat to present their rear to the steam tank and their front to the DG?  Legal or not?[/color]

I have read threads in the past on this.  I think the jury is still out on how legal it is if you have a command group.  So-  to avoid any issues-  it is not legal in this tournament.

We figured out that you don´t have to take terror checks from randomly moving targets.
But if the Executioners charge the Steam Tank, they have to test, right?

Correct.

Hmmm.  Not sure.  Can't find it in the book.  Old rule?

Terror only comes into play when the Terror unit charges a target-  not when a unit charges the Terror unit.  In this case, the Executioners will only have to pass a Fear test during the combat phase.

-----------------------------------------

Team Leaders-  we will give this one more day for day for input/tweaks.  By the end of today/early tomorrow give me a thumbs-up when you think you have finally settled on a plan.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: grifter on September 25, 2012, 01:43:47 PM
If we plow into the DR and kill them all, what is to stop the executioners from flank charging the STank.   Would both HBVG shoot the executioners, to aid the flank. if not steam tank will suffer/ could even die if it got hit in the flank by 3 ranks of executioners.

Hell doing the maths, average says we will stick around.

What are we going to shoot the HBVG's at I think it would be preferable to shoot both at one target, exec's or spears.

Agree with Zif, no reason to rumble into Riders.  Shoot both Volley Guns into Spears.  9 wounds is a panic, though we could do more than that...

I feel like the flank needs our immediate attention more then the center, so I would shoot the Executioners. They just scare me a lot more then the Spearmen who might not see combat on their next turn, thus allowing us another round of shooting against them. And how big is the chance of them actually running away with the Lord and the BSB in there?

Agree on not charging the Riders with the STank though. Even if we don´t panic/obliterate them this turn, the 1-2 models left won´t be much of a threat even to a Hellblaster anymore.
Harmonic Convergence on the DG2 and Blizzard on the Executioners would be my wishes for the magic phase. Plus Thunderbolt on the Harpies if they´re not engaged/didn´t flee...hopefully one of those will get through at least.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 25, 2012, 01:46:51 PM
See another thing learned.....cRAZY!

So HHG did I get it right that you advised against the fleeing of the stank because you thought that we only would use 2 dice on the move? It is for both stanks 3 dice for moving and one for cannonballing and maybe one for steam punking.....stupid rule about the front ark and repeater if you ask me. Well could be I am used to the old rules.  
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zifnab0 on September 25, 2012, 01:53:41 PM
I feel like the flank needs our immediate attention more then the center, so I would shoot the Executioners.
Iceshard and shoot the Executioners.  8 wounds and they test at -1 Ld, although they're probably in range of the General and BSB.

I wish we could shoot DR2.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 25, 2012, 02:03:24 PM
I feel like the flank needs our immediate attention more then the center, so I would shoot the Executioners.
Iceshard and shoot the Executioners.  8 wounds and they test at -1 Ld, although they're probably in range of the General and BSB.

I wish we could shoot DR2.

Well if we get Iceshard off, the fear will be at 7 LD, if they fail then 6's to hit.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Empire - Ulric on September 25, 2012, 02:19:04 PM

I just want to point out that we do not, under any circumstances want the Executioners getting a charge off on our Stank. There are simply too many of them left at this point. They will do some serious damage to it if not kill it Also remember this the Steam Tank does most of it's killing on the Turn it charges, that extra d6 impact hits makes a world of difference.

We have the advantage on the left right now and now is the time to press it. Ram the tank into the Executioners while we still can before we the Metal Mage melts/hexes our tank or starts buffing the executioners.

We can maneuver the DG's around for a flank charge next turn if you guys want, but the tank absolutely must get into combat this turn (this is why I wanted to move it forward last turn so a charge was almost a certainty)

So..... updated plan.

DG1: Move forward to within 1" of the Executioners so they cannot wheel past. Move out of Executioner front arc, position for a flank/rear charge against Executioners next turn.

Steam Tank: Use 3 dice to move, attempt to charge Executioners..

ICK: Move forward, staying 15" away from the Spearmen bus.  Rearrange characters in the unit so that the Lord cannot be in base contact with either Huss or the BSB.  If Lord is in the center of the Spearmen, move Huss and BSB to the edges of ICK.  If he is on one side or the other, move Huss and BSB to the opposite side of ICK.

Reiksguard: Charge Shades, set up overrun into Hydra if they don't flee

DG2: Charge Hydra.

Kn2: Charge Harpies, if they flee redirect into shades (if visible)

Other considerations:

Magic: Key Spells are Convergence on the Tank, Comet to the side of the Spearmen (we want to force them to move forward) Everything else depends on what happens in the movement phase.

Shooting: Steam gun on Executioners, HBVG on the Dark Riders, other Volley Gun on the Spearmen with all the characters.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 25, 2012, 02:27:56 PM
See another thing learned.....cRAZY!

So HHG did I get it right that you advised against the fleeing of the stank because you thought that we only would use 2 dice on the move?

I was advising against moving the STank closer to the Harpies to try and get off a gun shot in addition to the cannon-  only because the Executioners have a decent charge range and by doing this you are only bringing them back into the fight quicker.

I was going to suggest the STank 1 shot against the front row full of characters in the Warrior horde because it seems like the best use of the shot...but then I remembered I have to remain somewhat impartial (even though I want Empire to win)!  It appears you thought of it as well, anyway.   :wink:
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: grifter on September 25, 2012, 03:19:59 PM

I just want to point out that we do not, under any circumstances want the Executioners getting a charge off on our Stank. There are simply too many of them left at this point. They will do some serious damage to it if not kill it Also remember this the Steam Tank does most of it's killing on the Turn it charges, that extra d6 impact hits makes a world of difference.

We have the advantage on the left right now and now is the time to press it. Ram the tank into the Executioners while we still can before we the Metal Mage melts/hexes our tank or starts buffing the executioners.

We can maneuver the DG's around for a flank charge next turn if you guys want, but the tank absolutely must get into combat this turn (this is why I wanted to move it forward last turn so a charge was almost a certainty)

So..... updated plan.

DG1: Move forward to within 1" of the Executioners so they cannot wheel past. Move out of Executioner front arc, position for a flank/rear charge against Executioners next turn.

Steam Tank: Use 3 dice to move, attempt to charge Executioners..

That was my original thinking as well, but two HBVG right into the Executioners´ faces are damn tempting as well. I´m fine with either option, charge the STank into them or position it in front of them and kill the DR with it while blasting the Exec´s.

ICK: Move forward, staying 15" away from the Spearmen bus.  Rearrange characters in the unit so that the Lord cannot be in base contact with either Huss or the BSB.  If Lord is in the center of the Spearmen, move Huss and BSB to the edges of ICK.  If he is on one side or the other, move Huss and BSB to the opposite side of ICK.

Reiksguard: Charge Shades, set up overrun into Hydra if they don't flee

DG2: Charge Hydra.

Kn2: Charge Harpies, if they flee redirect into shades (if visible)

I think we´re pretty much all in agreement here?

Other considerations:

Magic: Key Spells are Convergence on the Tank, Comet to the side of the Spearmen (we want to force them to move forward) Everything else depends on what happens in the movement phase.

Shooting: Steam gun on Executioners, HBVG on the Dark Riders, other Volley Gun on the Spearmen with all the characters.

I´d like the Convergence on the DG2 as well as on the STank. Tough choice, but in the end I don´t think the Dreadlord will let either one through so it won´t matter.
I like the Comet idea though, let´s see how many dice we get to work with.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 26, 2012, 12:58:46 AM


I think I agree with Ulric, but I not sure how you meant to move the Demis.  I was thinking about wheeling them so the executioners would have to wheel towards the board edge to charge them if the stank doesn't make it. If the stank makes it, the executioners will feels some pain, but will hold on their rerollable 10, probably 22 remaining.

If the stank doesn't make it, the executioners have to charge the Demis, but the stank might be in the way, so they can't close the door. Locally, we call this the eagle cock block (nought you know what I'm talking about).

Either way, the executioners areheld up for at least one turn and will need magical support to take out the tank.
I wish I knew how to paste a picture in from an iPad so people could see what I'm thinking....

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 26, 2012, 01:11:36 AM
Okay TDG'ers...a little summary.

Here is how I see Blue wanting to move.  Let me know if anything needs to be changed.  The silver arrows are the direction the STanks will be heading.


(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2B3APoss.jpg)



Green is divided again on the left flank.  Below are two graphs that I think depict the two courses of action.  Green needs to vote on them and let me know if anything needs to be tweaked on them.  The east Knights are charging the Shades and then the Harpies.

Course of Action 1

(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2G3APoss.jpg)


Course of Action 2

(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2G3APoss2.jpg)


Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 26, 2012, 01:16:50 AM

If the stank doesn't make it, the executioners have to charge the Demis, but the stank might be in the way, so they can't close the door. Locally, we call this the eagle c**k block (nought you know what I'm talking about).

I wasn't sure the Empire Forum was ready for the DECB (Double Eagle C**k Block).  Essentially it's STank option 1 and DG1 option 2 movement.  Horde has to charge front arc, but it's unable to close door on either unit and maximize means no charge.  But it's EVIL.  Of course it would be perfect right here.  :icon_wink:

Option 1.  Silly question?  Should we Steam template the 20 mm Exec bases and just shoot the Riders?

BTW.  If he flank charges the Reiksguard, we hold.  Challenge with champ and WP make way (to back rank) so the Spears aren't in BtB with rank and file.  Ward save prayer would be swell.  That means the Dreadlord has to kill the WP, he might not even be in contact if we are lucky.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zifnab0 on September 26, 2012, 01:21:43 AM
Option 1.

I say 2 dice move and 2 dice steam gun on the Executioners.  The odds of rolling 12+ on 2d6 is too low for my tastes (~16%).
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Friar Metick on September 26, 2012, 01:49:36 AM
I vote for course of action 1.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 26, 2012, 01:56:46 AM

Here is how I see Blue wanting to move.  Let me know if anything needs to be changed.  The silver arrows are the direction the STanks will be heading.


i really don't like the look of the right flank this myself.

The steam tank i propose to sit between the harpies and executions (steaming the harpies) is the one that would shoot the spears so I don't feel it adds to our plan to get the metal mage.

The reiksguard I think need to enter the forest so they are able to charge the spear block next turn if we want. The small knights need to position them selves to be used to redirect either the spears or executioners depending on whether we charge the spears or not next turn. that said I like tha postion as it ties Dreadlord's charcters at he front if he overruns which lets the ICK hit the flank (guessing dreadlord wouldn't charge the archers let alone overrun in his turn though).

Also the 10 archers are likely hitting on 7s (moved, long range, hard cover) so this position only helps get off flock of doom, though we could shoot at the shades with the aid of the detachment next to the ruins if it faces the other way....best we could hope for is 3 dead and a failed panic check though)
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 26, 2012, 02:17:57 AM

If the stank doesn't make it, the executioners have to charge the Demis, but the stank might be in the way, so they can't close the door. Locally, we call this the eagle c**k block (nought you know what I'm talking about).

I wasn't sure the Empire Forum was ready for the DECB (Double Eagle C**k Block).  Essentially it's STank option 1 and DG1 option 2 movement.  Horde has to charge front arc, but it's unable to close door on either unit and maximize means no charge.  But it's EVIL.  Of course it would be perfect right here.  :icon_wink:

Option 1.  Silly question?  Should we Steam template the 20 mm Exec bases and just shoot the Riders?

BTW.  If he flank charges the Reiksguard, we hold.  Challenge with champ and WP make way (to back rank) so the Spears aren't in BtB with rank and file.  Ward save prayer would be swell.  That means the Dreadlord has to kill the WP, he might not even be in contact if we are lucky.

I thought we were sharing  :biggriin:
The ECB is evil, and is a total abuse of the rules, but not anymore than sticking a death Mage in with a ld10 character, or a dark elf wizard with power of darkness and a sacrificial dagger. So I say use it. You don't bring a knife to a gun fight.

If we decide on option one, I would rather steam gun the executioners. If we roll a 6-8, I bet we'd hit 20-22 executioners, leading to 8 unsaved wounds. The one hell blaster can finish off the dark riders. [/color]
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zifnab0 on September 26, 2012, 02:21:54 AM
I wasn't sure the Empire Forum was ready for the DECB (Double Eagle C**k Block).  Essentially it's STank option 1 and DG1 option 2 movement.  Horde has to charge front arc, but it's unable to close door on either unit and maximize means no charge.  But it's EVIL.  Of course it would be perfect right here.  :icon_wink:
Sounds good.  Lets do that.

I was thinking that the Executioners couldn't pivot past the DR, so if we parked the steam tank in front of them he'd be unable to charge the Executioners into the steam tank.  That would likely put us in the exact same position next turn - unable to combo-charge his Executioners.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 26, 2012, 02:31:22 AM
So Harshey, Zif and I all vote for Option 1.5, Tank option 1 and Demigryphs option 2.  ONLY if the Tank gets in front of the Horde.  Otherwise all Option 1.

BTW Zif, the Riders won't be there after this turn.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Grazhnakk on September 26, 2012, 02:48:37 AM

We need to keep the executioners out of the fight. I agree with the all-in on the sorceress, but the wounds those executioners can throw in on a fight can turn the tide away from us... we need something to send them away for a couple of turns. KN2 is the best candidate, IMO... stank 1 with one wound left  isn't much of a worry and we need stank 2. I'd rather not throw the reiksguard into it, but it's an option as well.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 26, 2012, 03:10:22 AM

If the stank doesn't make it, the executioners have to charge the Demis, but the stank might be in the way, so they can't close the door. Locally, we call this the eagle cock block (nought you know what I'm talking about).


Doesn't the target unit have to close the door if the charging unit is unable to?
It would only be an impossible charge if neither unit could close the door.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 26, 2012, 03:16:50 AM

If the stank doesn't make it, the executioners have to charge the Demis, but the stank might be in the way, so they can't close the door. Locally, we call this the eagle cock block (nought you know what I'm talking about).


Doesn't the target unit have to close the door if the charging unit is unable to?
It would only be an impossible charge if neither unit could close the door.

Nope.  If you have the front arc you have to charge and close the door.  If two units are both in a Hordes front arc (hence the double eagle reference) they prevent the Horde from closing the door.  It also works with a single unit if an opponent places his units too tight so the back end hits the neighbor.  It's evil and punishes Ogre Gutstars (or any Deathstar).  See important Note!!!

SUPER IMPORTANT!!!  The Tank and the Demigryphs have to have the flank exposed to the Horde with a majority of the Executioners in the 45* front arc of each unit!  So each unit has to expose flank with 6 Execs in front arc.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 26, 2012, 03:39:31 AM
Right and I think this would work if we in the 8-11 range on the stank and fall a little short. If we roll really low then the Demis should get moved to the side of the executionersso that they can't wheel to make their charge against the stank. The good news is you get to see what the stank does and then put the Demi's where you need to to hold up those executioners.

It's because of this type of situation that I have never actually run a horde formation. You can get pinned down and just stuck there.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 26, 2012, 03:46:05 AM

If the stank doesn't make it, the executioners have to charge the Demis, but the stank might be in the way, so they can't close the door. Locally, we call this the eagle cock block (nought you know what I'm talking about).


Doesn't the target unit have to close the door if the charging unit is unable to?
It would only be an impossible charge if neither unit could close the door.

Nope.  If you have the front arc you have to charge and close the door.  If two units are both in a Hordes front arc (hence the double eagle reference) they prevent the Horde from closing the door.  It also works with a single unit if an opponent places his units too tight so the back end hits the neighbor.  It's evil and punishes Ogre Gutstars (or any Deathstar).  See important Note!!!

SUPER IMPORTANT!!!  The Tank and the Demigryphs have to have the flank exposed to the Horde with a majority of the Executioners in the 45* front arc of each unit!  So each unit has to expose flank with 6 Execs in front arc.

I don't have my rule book here with me so will check when I get home but this is how i think it works.
Horde has an eagle on the left and right blocking the hordes close the door for either charge.
The horde charges the eagle on the left. it moves until it contacts and wheels as far as it can without contacting the other eagle (though may be within 1") The eagle is then forced to close the door if possible. The only way the charge can fail is if neither unit is able to close the door.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 26, 2012, 04:13:47 AM
Unlike most situations, both rules that may be pertinent are on the same page. (22).

Under no circumstance can a unit use its charge move to move into contact with an anemy it has declared a charge against.

There is also the rule about the defender closing the door.

So, in the scenario where the stank fails by 1 or 2 inches, it will be on an angle on the rights side of the fron of the executioners. To charge the stank, the executioners would have to move forward and then close the door. But if the Demis are at an equal distance away from the executioners on the left side with a similar (but mirrored) angle then the executioners would bump on their way into the stank. The same thing would happen going with a charge against the Demis. So you don't get to the part where the defender closes the door.

Now if the stank misses by a bunch, then it willbe further out, but to the right of the executioners. Meaning that the executioners will have to wheel to line up to the stank even in the slightest. So the back left corner of the executioners will out an inch if this happens, and the Demi's just need to be "in the way".

Not the originally intended use of demigryphs knights; they are very durable chaff in this game.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 26, 2012, 04:36:39 AM
but the horde doen't need to move forward....it can just wheel for its charge therfore contacting whichever unit it wants first.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 26, 2012, 04:39:13 AM
In this situation, I would argue that the Executioners could charge both units.

Under the title Charging More Than One Unit on page 18, it says a unit can normally only declare a charge at a single enemy unit.  However, if there is no way of completing the charge against an enemy unit without touching another then the charging unit must also declare a charge against the other unit.

Once the Executioners make contact with both units it obviously can't close the door on either....but both units could close the door on it.

Even if the above doesn't qualify as "completing the charge" criteria, the moment a unit contacts another but can't finish the charge, the defenders finish closing the door themselves.  The only way you could prevent that is if something was in the way of both defenders so they couldn't pivot either.  I am going to assume this is the case of some double-eagle side-by-side craziness.

No matter how you slice it-  I don't think these are the desired outcomes you are looking for in this situation.

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Dnic on September 26, 2012, 06:36:42 AM
I vote for picture 1. With one change: The Stank charge the EXE.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 26, 2012, 06:51:07 AM
Okay TDG'ers...a little summary.

Here is how I see Blue wanting to move.  Let me know if anything needs to be changed.  The silver arrows are the direction the STanks will be heading.
(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2B3APoss.jpg)

Of notice, the major witch is in the right most corner of the warriors, a flank shot will either hit 5 warriors or the witch, we cannot aim for both. None of the archers seems to be able to hit anything, the arcane ruins/big spear unit will most properly provide cover for the warrior bunker. There are 11 warriors left, no champion, so we need to reduce this by 6 before look out can be avoided. This requires all three cannons and luck and the dreadlord not dispelling the crows= all eggs needs to be in one basket.

Also by the placement of the left most archer detachment, and the cover to the wizard bunker, I would say go protect the cannon and the wizard bunker (the shades will be able to charge both from the current location)

Both steam cannons should align for the witch. If we get through with the birdies and inflict at least 2 wounds, I would suggest we aim the GC for a full flank shot of 5 warriors (if the birdies inflict less than 2 wounds we aim for the witch), but fire one of the two steam cannons prior to the GC. The first steam cannon will hit three models (one being the witch), and most likely cause 3 death warriors. This is followed by the GC hopefully killing 5 warriors for a total of 9-10 warriors and less than 5 models left and nowhere to hide. And finally we should be able to hit with the last steam tank killing the witch… This requires much luck!! And haven’t done the math of that happening as it is quite complex, but I’m guessing that we are at less than 50% if the birdies are not dispelled and less than 30% if it is dispelled. 
I still think it is worth it, the steam tank will most likely outrun the executioners and thus will not be charged for another turn.   




 

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 26, 2012, 07:45:20 AM

Also by the placement of the left most archer detachment, and the cover to the wizard bunker, I would say go protect the cannon and the wizard bunker (the shades will be able to charge both from the current location)
 
This is a good point, I think the shades would love a go at our wizard. That said if we screen the cannon and mage's archers they may just move around and start shooting our mage's bunker just as we plan to do.
Maybe we could screen the mage bunker and give him the cannon as a juicy target?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 26, 2012, 07:59:51 AM

Also by the placement of the left most archer detachment, and the cover to the wizard bunker, I would say go protect the cannon and the wizard bunker (the shades will be able to charge both from the current location)
 
This is a good point, I think the shades would love a go at our wizard. That said if we screen the cannon and mage's archers they may just move around and start shooting our mage's bunker just as we plan to do.
Maybe we could screen the mage bunker and give him the cannon as a juicy target?


I still cannot see why we need to sacrifice the cannon, most its worth gold in the next turn if we dont get the witch in this one.. Lets just place the archers disrupting the shades charge of both units with an overrun path in the middle of the two.

Also important, we need to be more aggresive with the reiksguard or they will never get in combat.. I would even risk marching them through the forest or below the forest if that would get them near the battlefield (HGG, is what depicted really a march move of 14" over the hill?).

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: grifter on September 26, 2012, 08:25:11 AM
I vote for picture 1. With one change: The Stank charge the EXE.

I agree, option 1. I think the STank is meant to be charging in that anyways, just that the arrow isn´t red (same on the right flank with some charges).

I´d rather not use sneaky rules abuses when playing friendly games against non-Skaven opponents.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Bildskoene Bengtsson on September 26, 2012, 08:33:31 AM

I still cannot see why we need to sacrifice the cannon, most its worth gold in the next turn if we dont get the witch in this one.. Lets just place the archers disrupting the shades charge of both units with an overrun path in the middle of the two.

Also important, we need to be more aggresive with the reiksguard or they will never get in combat.. I would even risk marching them through the forest or below the forest if that would get them near the battlefield (HGG, is what depicted really a march move of 14" over the hill?).

I've actuallt changed my mind. Save the cannon and make that extra shot count next turn. Our 5 Archers will probably not kill anything anyway. Also our Wizard is in jeopardy right now. 
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: George on September 26, 2012, 08:34:00 AM
In this situation, I would argue that the Executioners could charge both units.

Under the title Charging More Than One Unit on page 18, it says a unit can normally only declare a charge at a single enemy unit.  However, if there is no way of completing the charge against an enemy unit without touching another then the charging unit must also declare a charge against the other unit.

Once the Executioners make contact with both units it obviously can't close the door on either....but both units could close the door on it.

Even if the above doesn't qualify as "completing the charge" criteria, the moment a unit contacts another but can't finish the charge, the defenders finish closing the door themselves.  The only way you could prevent that is if something was in the way of both defenders so they couldn't pivot either.  I am going to assume this is the case of some double-eagle side-by-side craziness.

No matter how you slice it-  I don't think these are the desired outcomes you are looking for in this situation.

I don't think you could end up charging both units as it is possible to contact 1 first (by just wheeling) and therefore the chargee would have to close the door. From reading page 22 I can't see any way for there to be a failed charge.
I even fail to see how 2 eagles could be positioned 1" apart and cause this to happen as you are allowed to move within 1" of any unit when charging

But enough of being sidetracked...

@windelov
I can get behind the screen the cannon argument and I also suggested the reiksgaurd into the wood.

I will let the rest of the brains trust work out the best way to hurt the wizard's bunker as I amseeing things quite differently to the est of the team....I'm also interested to see how it plays out as uts not a tactic I've been in a position to use before.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: MrAbyssal on September 26, 2012, 09:44:15 AM
I still say concentrate all firepower on the Super Sta... I mean Metal Witch (as per Windelov's plan). I'm not liking the Reiksguard movement in that diagram either. Would prefer around the back of the wood if possible or through it for expedience's sake. I also think we should move the archers with the wizard more behind the IC Knights and use the detachment to try and send the Shades off to the East. If the Shades decide to go around we should be able to reform Kn1 to face them or failing that they can go after the Metal Witch.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Wojownik on September 26, 2012, 09:56:20 AM
I vote for picture 1. With one change: The Stank charge the EXE.

I agree, option 1. I think the STank is meant to be charging in that anyways, just that the arrow isn´t red (same on the right flank with some charges).

I´d rather not use sneaky rules abuses when playing friendly games against non-Skaven opponents.

I concur, 1st scenario
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 26, 2012, 09:57:38 AM
I still say concentrate all firepower on the Super Sta... I mean Metal Witch (as per Windelov's plan). I'm not liking the Reiksguard movement in that diagram either. Would prefer around the back of the wood if possible or through it for expedience's sake. I also think we should move the archers with the wizard more behind the IC Knights and use the detachment to try and send the Shades off to the East. If the Shades decide to go around we should be able to reform Kn1 to face them or failing that they can go after the Metal Witch.

I think maching through the forest is the only viable action if we are to be able to charge next turn, as there is about 24" to where the big spear unit will be after reforming from archer wipeout

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 26, 2012, 11:14:46 AM
The DECB only works if you have your flank exposed with 2 Eagles (units) and the Horde has to charge the front.  Page 22 has the charger contacting the front, unable to close door due to terrain or other unit, so the defender closes the door.  The Demigryphs and Tank would have to be have to expose the flank yet have enough models (6 in this case) have to lie in the Front Arc.

The charger never gets to the Front arc so it can't complete the charge.  It's a totally valid Horde/Deathstar neutralizer.  It only works if the Tank rolls high enough to get there, which it probably won't.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Friar Metick on September 26, 2012, 12:01:39 PM
I vote for picture 1. With one change: The Stank charge the EXE.

I agree, option 1. I think the STank is meant to be charging in that anyways, just that the arrow isn´t red (same on the right flank with some charges).

I´d rather not use sneaky rules abuses when playing friendly games against non-Skaven opponents.

I concur, 1st scenario

I agree with all the above.

Question: Can we move the Stank where we want it to be using steam points so we can steam gun the Exe's, without charging them?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 26, 2012, 12:16:59 PM
Also important, we need to be more aggresive with the reiksguard or they will never get in combat.. I would even risk marching them through the forest or below the forest if that would get them near the battlefield (HGG, is what depicted really a march move of 14" over the hill?).[/color]

The Reiksguard did not make a full move.  If the Reiksguard swing around the tanks on the hill they will be in pretty easy charge range of the Exes.  If you do a full move pointing towards the center, the Exes even have your flank.  Not good.

I tried looking at reforming them and then moving straight into the woods but they sure don't get very far in that scenario.

So what I ended up with was them on hill, away from Exes but keeping them in LOS.  If you don't like it, let me know.


I've actuallt changed my mind. Save the cannon and make that extra shot count next turn. Our 5 Archers will probably not kill anything anyway. Also our Wizard is in jeopardy right now. 

For the final placement of the Wizard bunker, I will make sure that it is outside the LOS of the Shades. 

However, it seems like most of Team Blue wants to keep the detachment in the way of the Shades instead of sacrificing the cannon.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 26, 2012, 12:25:34 PM
I´d rather not use sneaky rules abuses when playing friendly games against non-Skaven opponents.

Lets see how you feel after the upcoming cheese fest that is the DArk Elf magic phase now that we have no scroll.  Using legal rules isn't sneaky.  Just saying.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 26, 2012, 12:35:42 PM

I tried looking at reforming them and then moving straight into the woods but they sure don't get very far in that scenario.
So what I ended up with was them on hill, away from Exes but keeping them in LOS.  If you don't like it, let me know.

I was thinking quick reform, and march towards the centre either through or south of the woods. As the quick reform is free, we should be able to   
a whole 14", as far as I can see that should take the majority of models out of the woods if going through, or just pass that south most angel of the forest being able to wheel abit towards the big spear. Sorry going into so much detail here :blush:
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 26, 2012, 12:54:33 PM

I was thinking quick reform, and march towards the centre either through or south of the woods. As the quick reform is free, we should be able to   
a whole 14", as far as I can see that should take the majority of models out of the woods if going through, or just pass that south most angel of the forest being able to wheel abit towards the big spear.

You can only move, not march after a quick reform.  That only gives you 7"  In this case, it puts you barely into the southern woods.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: mottdon on September 26, 2012, 01:25:01 PM
Ok.  I tend to think that the Reiksguard are just going to have to play clean-up with the spear horde.  I don't think moving through the woods will be a viable option at this point.  Moving them along the south side of the forest, while playing it safe, will totally take them out of the game.  They might as well not even be on the table top.
As for the wiz. bunker, I like moving them behind/to the right of the ICKs next turn after using FoD. 
The left Archer detach. needs to block the Shades for a turn, so that the cannon can get another turn.  At least fill them with grapeshot.
I feel as though the Knights 1 block needs to keep moving toward the witch's bunker on the left, while the Kinghts 2 block needs to move forward to (1) deal with the Harpies or block the Executioners (depending on how they move) (2) sandwich the bunker on the right.  After depleating the bunker of bodies, we should be able to make short work of that block and then be able to move to the rear of the Spear horde.
I still like the idea of firing our guns on the bunker and the proposed movement of the stanks.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Empire - Ulric on September 26, 2012, 02:05:03 PM
Option 1 with the steam tank trying to charge the executioners (3d6 used for movement)

The other thing I caught was one other small error Knight Unit 2 will only charge the Shades if they flee from the Reiksguard and are visible, then redirect into the Harpies.
Title: Sv: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 26, 2012, 02:40:36 PM

I was thinking quick reform, and march towards the centre either through or south of the woods. As the quick reform is free, we should be able to   
a whole 14", as far as I can see that should take the majority of models out of the woods if going through, or just pass that south most angel of the forest being able to wheel abit towards the big spear.

You can only move, not march after a quick reform.  That only gives you 7"  In this case, it puts you barely into the southern woods.

Well how did i forget that, must have mixed skirmisher quick reform with swift reform, thx!

Lets go for the hill!

Sendt fra min GT-I9000 med Tapatalk2
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: grifter on September 26, 2012, 03:51:46 PM
I´d rather not use sneaky rules abuses when playing friendly games against non-Skaven opponents.

Lets see how you feel after the upcoming cheese fest that is the DArk Elf magic phase now that we have no scroll.  Using legal rules isn't sneaky.  Just saying.

Sorry, no offense intended, just seemed like a shifty rule interpretation to me. If it is indeed legal, fair enough.

Although I don't know what DE having a strong armybook has to do with our use of shifty tactics (which, as you have pointed out, wouldn't be the case). [/color]
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 26, 2012, 03:58:02 PM
I´d rather not use sneaky rules abuses when playing friendly games against non-Skaven opponents.

Lets see how you feel after the upcoming cheese fest that is the DArk Elf magic phase now that we have no scroll.  Using legal rules isn't sneaky.  Just saying.

Sorry, no offense intended, just seemed like a shifty rule interpretation to me. If it is indeed legal, fair enough.

Although I don't know what DE having a strong armybook has to do with our use of shifty tactics (which, as you have pointed out, wouldn't be the case). [/color]

No worries, just throwing out viable Anti-Horde tactics   :icon_smile:
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 26, 2012, 04:25:56 PM
Let's roll a 12 with the stank. We have a 3/8 chance of making the charge.  Then the block doesn't matter.  not the best odds, but the stank doesn't usually get much better odds of making the charge to the front.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 26, 2012, 06:50:35 PM
Ok I am here....i also throw my vote into saving the cannon...if the witch is on the right corner of the small spear unit how about we fire both stanks down the front rank of the spear unit? I mean potentially we have 20 dead spears and with both shots all three characters under the template so we should have statistically one failed look out sir roll if either the Lord or the bsb go down they are easy pickings for our knights.
I wouldn´t be unhappy with the death mage dying either.

Reiksguard could move up the hill next turn either charging the exes or marching down the hill towards the center....I have a feeling my suggestions have messed up the unit from turn one forward....
Title: Sv: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 26, 2012, 07:30:22 PM
We wanted to kill the major witch, and we still can. The characters in the big spearmen unit is spread out so we need to be really lucky if we are to hit all three.

I say lets go for the metal witch with all three cannons and magic.

Sendt fra min GT-I9000 med Tapatalk2
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Friar Metick on September 26, 2012, 08:17:24 PM
I´d rather not use sneaky rules abuses when playing friendly games against non-Skaven opponents.

Lets see how you feel after the upcoming cheese fest that is the DArk Elf magic phase now that we have no scroll.  Using legal rules isn't sneaky.  Just saying.

Sorry, no offense intended, just seemed like a shifty rule interpretation to me. If it is indeed legal, fair enough.

Although I don't know what DE having a strong armybook has to do with our use of shifty tactics (which, as you have pointed out, wouldn't be the case). [/color]

No worries, just throwing out viable Anti-Horde tactics   :icon_smile:

I like the tactic, I want to revisit it when I finish my High Elf army and am using the dreaded Eagle diverters.  :eusa_clap: I am not sure if I would count on it here because were hoping the Stank dice roll comes out the way we want it to, and I don't have the greatest luck with dice. So I prefer to go with a high probability move if that option is possible.  :icon_smile:
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 26, 2012, 08:23:33 PM
Ok metal witch with all three guns...and archers saving the day....or cannon.

Anyone against this?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 26, 2012, 08:35:00 PM
I´d rather not use sneaky rules abuses when playing friendly games against non-Skaven opponents.

Lets see how you feel after the upcoming cheese fest that is the DArk Elf magic phase now that we have no scroll.  Using legal rules isn't sneaky.  Just saying.

Sorry, no offense intended, just seemed like a shifty rule interpretation to me. If it is indeed legal, fair enough.

Although I don't know what DE having a strong armybook has to do with our use of shifty tactics (which, as you have pointed out, wouldn't be the case). [/color]

No worries, just throwing out viable Anti-Horde tactics   :icon_smile:

I like the tactic, I want to revisit it when I finish my High Elf army and am using the dreaded Eagle diverters.  :eusa_clap: I am not sure if I would count on it here because were hoping the Stank dice roll comes out the way we want it to, and I don't have the greatest luck with dice. So I prefer to go with a high probability move if that option is possible.  :icon_smile:

If you don't have 4 Eagles, shame on you.  :icon_smile:

Here's our discussion oner on the Illinois board.
http://iwfb.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=232
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 26, 2012, 08:35:27 PM
Ok metal witch with all three guns...and archers saving the day....or cannon.

Anyone against this?

Archers saves the cannon and fire for flank shot on big spear unit next turn  :icon_smile:
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: MrAbyssal on September 26, 2012, 11:00:32 PM
Ok metal witch with all three guns...and archers saving the day....or cannon.

Anyone against this?

Archers saves the cannon and fire for flank shot on big spear unit next turn  :icon_smile:

+1 to this.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 27, 2012, 12:02:33 AM
***Update***

Team Blue Movement

ICK charge the Harpies and the western Knight charge the Dark Riders.  Both hold.

STank 1 gets a 12” move.  STank 2 gets a 13” move.  Both go full steam ahead towards the Metal witch.

The Archer detachment moves to intercept the Shades encroaching on the cannon, the eastern Knights wheel to turn back to the center and the Reikguard barely crest the hill and stay as far away from the Exes as possible.



(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2B3A.jpg)



Team Green Movement

Reiksguard declare a charge against the Shades.  They Flee 7.”  Reik move forward 5” on a failed charge.

The Knights declare a charge against the Shades now, which have to flee again.  The Shades Flee another 6” away from the Knights. 

The Knights make the Leadership test to re-direct and declare a charge against the Harpies.  The Harpies hold.  Rolling a 4,2,2 equals a failed charge on the Knights.  They stumble forward 4.

Demigryphs declare a charge against the Hydra.  It holds.  Demis make their DT test.

The STank rumbles forward 10 towards the Executioners.

The west Demigryphs reform to get the flank of the Executioners (and the rear of the Exes if they charge the STank!)


(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2G3A.jpg)



Team Blue Magic & Shooting

Empire rolls a 3+1 for Winds of Magic.  1 channel for the DE plus +1 DD for the Seal of Grond makes it:  4 PD, 5 DD.

The Beast Mages goes all out on a 4-dice Flock of Doom on the Sorc bunker. 
16+4=20.  Dreadlord rolls all his DD:  2x6s.  Dispelled.

Shooting:
--Archer Regiment fires at the Sorc Bunker.  They manage to kill 1 Warrior.
--Archer detachment fires at the Shades.  All misses.
--The Great Cannon fires off its cannonball.  Goes 2” and bounces 2”  Doesn’t hit anything.
--STank 1 loads up a shot.  Misfire.  Takes 3 wounds.  It finally ended its own life.    :cry:
--The STank 2 shoots its cannonball.  Hits mage + 3 models.  Metal Sorc makes the Look out Ma’am! Roll.  Kills 4.  Engie fires his pistol at the horde to no effect.
(In total, you killed 5 of the Sorc Bunker.  It has 6 + Sorc remaining.)


Team Green Magic & Shooting

Same gig:  4 PD, 5 DD.
--First cast is a 1 die 5+ Ward on the Reiksguard.  Failed cast.
--Second cast is a 1 die 5+ Ward on the ICK.  Success on a 5.  Dreadlord lets it go.
--Last cast is a 3-dice Iceshard Blizzard on the Executioners.  11+4=15.  Dreadlord rolls all his DD and gets 2x 6s.  Dispelled.

Shooting: 

--West Helblaster opens up on the Dark Riders:  Misfire, 10, 4.  Engire re-roll also comes out a 10.  24 shots = overkill.  The Dark Riders are turned into dog food.
--East Helblaster opens up on the Warrior bus:  6, 8, 6.  20 shots, 8 hits, 7 wounds.  7 die.
--STank blasts the Executioners with a 2 Str Breath attack.  Hits 21 models, 7 wounds, 3 saves.  4 Exes die.  Engie fires his pistol as well-  no effect.


Team Blue Combat

The Knights easily clear out the two chaff units.  The Vanilla Knights suffer 1 casualty in the process, however.


Team Green Combat

The only combat is the rusted Demis versus the Hydra.
--First go the Beastmasters-  6 hits, 2 wounds, 1 save.  Demis take 1 wound.
--Demis go.  9 attacks, 5 hits, 2 wounds, no regen saves.
--Knights go.  3 attacks, 2 hits, 1 wound, Regen save.
--Hydra goes.  7 attacks, 4 hits, 2 wounds, no saves.  1 Demi is removed.  Hydra pops his (now) Str 3 breath weapon and gets 12 Str 3 hits.  4 wounds.  All saved.

Combat resolution:   Demis charged downhill and did 2 wounds, Hydra did 3 wounds.  Empire wins by 1.  Dreadlord needs to make a Break test on a 7 and rolls a 5.  The Hydra holds.


End of Empire Turn

Here is what it looks like:


(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2B3ADone.jpg)



(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2G3ADone.jpg)



Not the greatest turn for the good guys.  Hopefully Dreadlord suffers the same fate on his Turn 3.
I will be getting with Dreadlord soon to get his decisions for his turn.  Stay tuned.

 :::cheers:::
HHG

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: zifnab0 on September 27, 2012, 12:24:06 AM
Combat resolution:   Demis charged and did 2 wounds, Hydra did 3 wounds.  Tied combat (remember, no standards or musicians in your Demis!).
You forgot +1 for charging downhill (p. 53)
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 27, 2012, 12:30:55 AM
What Zif said.

Quote
Not the greatest turn for the good guys.  Hopefully Dreadlord suffers the same fate on his Turn 3.
I will be getting with Dreadlord soon to get his decisions for his turn.  Stay tuned.

I think it was an awesome turn :icon_smile:
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 27, 2012, 12:36:53 AM
Combat resolution:   Demis charged and did 2 wounds, Hydra did 3 wounds.  Tied combat (remember, no standards or musicians in your Demis!).
You forgot +1 for charging downhill (p. 53)

Yes I did!  I will go up and modify the post.  Dreadlord just rolled a 5 on the Break test.  The fatty holds.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 27, 2012, 01:06:38 AM
Well... That didn't go as planned just about anywhere, except for the shooting phase.
Demi's against the hydra? Really needed a third wound there do we could finish it during dreadlord's turn.

So how many executioners are left?
And how many spears are left?

I expect we're going to be dealing with a lot of chaff for our next turn. We just need to get through this next magic phase...
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 27, 2012, 01:17:15 AM
Well... That didn't go as planned just about anywhere, except for the shooting phase.
Demi's against the hydra? Really needed a third wound there do we could finish it during dreadlord's turn.

So how many executioners are left?
And how many spears are left?

I expect we're going to be dealing with a lot of chaff for our next turn. We just need to get through this next magic phase...


27 Exes.
24 Warriors.

Pointy-eared bodies are getting low....
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Friar Metick on September 27, 2012, 01:39:49 AM
I´d rather not use sneaky rules abuses when playing friendly games against non-Skaven opponents.

Lets see how you feel after the upcoming cheese fest that is the DArk Elf magic phase now that we have no scroll.  Using legal rules isn't sneaky.  Just saying.

Sorry, no offense intended, just seemed like a shifty rule interpretation to me. If it is indeed legal, fair enough.

Although I don't know what DE having a strong armybook has to do with our use of shifty tactics (which, as you have pointed out, wouldn't be the case). [/color]

No worries, just throwing out viable Anti-Horde tactics   :icon_smile:

I like the tactic, I want to revisit it when I finish my High Elf army and am using the dreaded Eagle diverters.  :eusa_clap: I am not sure if I would count on it here because were hoping the Stank dice roll comes out the way we want it to, and I don't have the greatest luck with dice. So I prefer to go with a high probability move if that option is possible.  :icon_smile:

If you don't have 4 Eagles, shame on you.  :icon_smile:

Here's our discussion oner on the Illinois board.
http://iwfb.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=232

Thanks for the tip and link.  :::cheers::: IWFB....huh, do you go to BiTS?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Friar Metick on September 27, 2012, 01:54:38 AM
Combat resolution:   Demis charged and did 2 wounds, Hydra did 3 wounds.  Tied combat (remember, no standards or musicians in your Demis!).
You forgot +1 for charging downhill (p. 53)

Yes I did!  I will go up and modify the post.  Dreadlord just rolled a 5 on the Break test.  The fatty holds.


Did the fatty roll a panic test when the shades fled through it?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 27, 2012, 01:59:10 AM
Combat resolution:   Demis charged and did 2 wounds, Hydra did 3 wounds.  Tied combat (remember, no standards or musicians in your Demis!).
You forgot +1 for charging downhill (p. 53)

Yes I did!  I will go up and modify the post.  Dreadlord just rolled a 5 on the Break test.  The fatty holds.

Did the fatty roll a panic test when the shades fled through it?

Did the Execs when the Riders got vaporized?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 27, 2012, 02:01:44 AM
Thanks for the tip and link.  :::cheers::: IWFB....huh, do you go to BiTS?

Was scheduled and paid, had to cancel due Relay for Life.  Next year though.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Friar Metick on September 27, 2012, 02:06:08 AM
Thanks for the tip and link.  :::cheers::: IWFB....huh, do you go to BiTS?

Was scheduled and paid, had to cancel due Relay for Life.  Next year though.

I've been to both, they were a blast.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 27, 2012, 02:08:32 AM
Combat resolution:   Demis charged and did 2 wounds, Hydra did 3 wounds.  Tied combat (remember, no standards or musicians in your Demis!).
You forgot +1 for charging downhill (p. 53)

Yes I did!  I will go up and modify the post.  Dreadlord just rolled a 5 on the Break test.  The fatty holds.

Did the fatty roll a panic test when the shades fled through it?

Did the Execs when the Riders got vaporized?

I will try and do a better job of writing psych tests into the posts.  Yes, he made them both.

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 27, 2012, 02:13:53 AM
Combat resolution:   Demis charged and did 2 wounds, Hydra did 3 wounds.  Tied combat (remember, no standards or musicians in your Demis!).
You forgot +1 for charging downhill (p. 53)

Yes I did!  I will go up and modify the post.  Dreadlord just rolled a 5 on the Break test.  The fatty holds.

Did the fatty roll a panic test when the shades fled through it?

Did the Execs when the Riders got vaporized?

I will try and do a better job of writing psych tests into the posts.  Yes, he made them both.

You.     Are.     Killing.    Me.    Smalls.   
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 27, 2012, 02:36:39 AM
Combat resolution:   Demis charged and did 2 wounds, Hydra did 3 wounds.  Tied combat (remember, no standards or musicians in your Demis!).
You forgot +1 for charging downhill (p. 53)

Yes I did!  I will go up and modify the post.  Dreadlord just rolled a 5 on the Break test.  The fatty holds.

Did the fatty roll a panic test when the shades fled through it?

Did the Execs when the Riders got vaporized?

I will try and do a better job of writing psych tests into the posts.  Yes, he made them both.

You.     Are.     Killing.    Me.    Smalls.   

  What part?  That you have a glimmer of hope that maybe I forgot?  Or the fact that Dreadlord makes a lot of his rolls?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 27, 2012, 02:38:52 AM
I was at BITS. Ran my empire too. I think I ended up with a very fun but disappointing 2-1-2 record. Really good tournament. Doubled in size in its second year two about 80. If people on the forum are looking for a good tourney, we have a few food ones in Chicago.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Noght on September 27, 2012, 02:50:56 AM
  What part?  That you have a glimmer of hope that maybe I forgot?  Or the fact that Dreadlord makes a lot of his rolls?

You need to use my dice for Leadership rolls.  :icon_smile:

Maybe the dice will balance this turn. (Please, please).
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: MrAbyssal on September 27, 2012, 02:59:02 AM
Well that was a wholly uninspiring display from our Steam Tanks and Cannon... if the Great Cannon had hit just 2 elves of the Rusty Steank hadn't exploded...

Oh well, just have to roll with it...
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 27, 2012, 06:03:45 AM
Yes our rolls...like ALL turns before were below statistics but well we have to deal with what we got our stanks are cursed of course the one with only one wound left rolls the missfire and not the other one ...of course out of four cannon shots...one hits. Next dark elf magic phase most likely will end the game :-(
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 27, 2012, 07:48:37 AM
It's all in the dices, sometimes I could wish for a 2d6 rolls providing more predictable results, but on the other hand it wouldn't be as challenging :eusa_wall:

The fight isnt over, we can hope for an equally miserable DE magic phase and they cant really do us much harm besides that next turn..
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 27, 2012, 07:57:02 AM
If they take out the stank next turn it basically is game over as we have little means to take out the dreadlord who in turn cancels out our grandmaster who would otherwise ravage his spear horde with his IC Knights.

As stated the list is basically our antidote...that said we made several mistakes too though. I think we really messed up with our Reiksguard unit. I for my part was too scared and therefore played too defensively....what we should have done is ignore the stupid magic protection circle and just advance and in turn two get to grips with multiple charges like icknights +1 steam tank into the spear horde or charging past the spear horde into the spear bunker...we made too little use of our speed.  
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 27, 2012, 08:07:56 AM
If they take out the stank next turn it basically is game over as we have little means to take out the dreadlord who in turn cancels out our grandmaster who would otherwise ravage his spear horde with his IC Knights.

As stated the list is basically our antidote...that said we made several mistakes too though. I think we really messed up with our Reiksguard unit. I for my part was too scared and therefore played too defensively....what we should have done is ignore the stupid magic protection circle and just advance and in turn two get to grips with multiple charges like icknights +1 steam tank into the spear horde or charging past the spear horde into the spear bunker...we made too little use of our speed.

I agree with you on the magic circle, we wanted to tuck away precious units in it, while we still had multiple juicy targets out of it = no use.

I still think the dreadlord is in a difficult position though, but lets not get ahead of ourself and reveal all their weaknesses before the DE player moves. 
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: mottdon on September 27, 2012, 12:08:36 PM
True, while we are about to be in a world o' pain, we still have some major units to contend with.  This'll be interesting.

I also don't put us out of the game just by losing our Stanks (He still has to take one, very stong Stank down).  Our ICKs haven't been touched, nor our Reiksguard.  Our vanilla knights are still circling his army and we still have our mage bunker (even if you dominate the magic phase, you still have to contend with him).  I would much rather have our positioning with so many fast units rather than his. 

Do not dispair, men of the Empire!  Glory awaits those who stand firm in the face of adversity!  For GLORY!  For Mankind!  FOR SIGMAR!!!
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 27, 2012, 12:11:55 PM
DEATH OR GLORY!

 :::cheers:::
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 27, 2012, 02:32:52 PM
Dreadlord’s Third Turn

Versus Team Blue

Movement

The Shades charge the Archer Detachment.

The Executioners attempt to charge the Reiksguard.  They fail and move forward 5.”

The Harpies move to get in the way of the STank. 

Last, the Spearmen reform into a bus six wide.  The Metal Sorc jumps into the new bus.  The Warrior bunker she left reforms, faces toward the west Knights and moves their direction.  (Death Mage on the right, BSB 3rd from the right, Dreadlord on the left, Metal Mage in the 2nd row

Wildwood kills two more Executioners in its clutches.


(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2B3B.jpg)



Versus Team Green

Movement

The Executioners charge the STank.

Otherwise, the Harpies fly to divert the ICK.  The Dark Riders ride hard to divert the Reiksguard. 

The former Sorc bunker makes a swift reform and moves off towards the Demis.  Immediately after, the Warrior bus also performs a swift reform and move towards the Demis in the west.


(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2G3B.jpg)



Magic Versus Team Blue

Dreadlord rolls a 5 and 4.  +1 PD, +1 DD channeled.

PD 10, DD 6.

3-dice Plague of Rust on the STank.  IF.  Roll on the Miscast table is a 7.  The Death Sorc takes a wound, and the other 4 Warriors around her die.  Loses 4 Powerdice.

On two PD, Metal Mage tosses a Powers of Darkness.  7+4+1=12.  Empire rolls all the Dispel Dice = easily Dispelled.


Magic Versus Team Green

PD 10, DD 6.

4-dice Plague of Rust on the STank.  20+4+1=25.  Empire lets it go.

1 die Powers of Darkness with Sac Dagger.  7+4+1=12.  Empire lets it go.  He gains only 2 dice.

PD 7, DD 6.

2-dice on Enchanted Blades of Aiban on the Executioners, plus a sac dagger warrior.  13+4+1=18.  Empire lets it go.

Now for the big one-  5 dice and a Sac Dagger on a boosted Searing Doom on the Demis.  22+4+1=27.  Empire rolls all its Dispel Dice for 22+4=26.  The spell barely goes off.

8 hits.  6 wounds.  2 die.  They make the Panic test.


Shooting Versus Team Green

Shades fire on the Knights on the hill to no effect.


Combat Versus Team Blue

Shades attack Archers.  5 hits, 3 wounds.  No hits back.  They run 4.  Get chased down  at 11.”  The Cannon crew and the Archers both make their Panic tests.


Combat Versus Team Green

In the Demis versus Hydra battle-
--Beastmasters.  4 hits, 1 wound, saved.
--Demis.  2 hits, 2 wounds, 1 save.  Hydra takes another wound.
--Knights.  No effect.
--Hydra.  7 attacks.  4 hits, 4 wounds, 1 save.  One Demi is removed.

Demis lose by 2.  Make the Break test on a 3.

Executioners versus the STank-  12 attacks, 11 hits, 7 wounds, no saves.  STank takes 7 wounds, has 3 remaining.  Executioners reform to 7-wide.


The AfterMath

Here is what it looks like at the end:


(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2B4APrep.jpg)



(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w495/DaHoffmans/TDG2G4APrep.jpg)



See you in TDG 2.5!

 :::cheers:::
HHG

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 27, 2012, 02:50:28 PM
The lady of luck hasn't abandoned us for good, although I would have love to see the metal witch roll anything but a 7 for miscast ;o)
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 27, 2012, 02:57:30 PM
Don´t get too greedy...I wonder though why the stank was rusted and not melted.

Greedy Darklord I guess.

But I won´t complain and already have dreams filled with bloodlust and glorious charges.  
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 27, 2012, 02:59:25 PM

But I won´t complain and already have dreams filled with bloodlust and glorious charges.

I'm already plotting in, and I'm really happy with the placement of characters in that bus  :icon_wink:
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Dnic on September 27, 2012, 03:01:42 PM
Lets generate 5 steam point. It will hopefully either kill the Stank(KABOOM), so the helblasters can shoot the exe, or give the Stank a good last turn.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: mottdon on September 27, 2012, 06:40:53 PM

But I won´t complain and already have dreams filled with bloodlust and glorious charges.

I'm already plotting in, and I'm really happy with the placement of characters in that bus  :icon_wink:
Same here!  I am really pleased with how that turned out!  I was expecting much worse.  Wow, the possibilities are quite wide at this pont.
I think that we need to focus as much of our forces on the spear block.  Hit 'em fast, hit'em hard!  All his eggs are now in one basket, and since he chose to refrain from charging our Archer detachment, we still have them for a little screening!
I say that we send our KN1 over the top of the ruins to finish off whats left of the bunker and lock away those VPs and then crash into the rear of his spear block.  Grapeshot the shades and turn our archers to face/shoot them as well.  We can move our archer detachment back enough to make room for our ICKs to charge in as well as our KN2 unit.  Let the Stank take out the harpies and then address the spears.  The Reiks continue to get to the center (spears) as fast as possible.  If the exec. start getting too close, then we use the archer detachment to slow them down.
Time to test our might! :eusa_clap:
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 27, 2012, 06:49:15 PM
How about we charge the archers and the ICK knights in....with both units in cc our knights have two guys not in combat which is great as those two guys are the grandmaster and the priest we leave the priest out of combat and make way with the grandmaster to a spot where the dreadlord can´t smite him...but we can slice and dice the bsb. Without bsb next turn the dreadlord is in trouble...as are the mages.
 

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: mottdon on September 27, 2012, 06:53:27 PM
How about we charge the archers and the ICK knights in....with both units in cc our knights have two guys not in combat which is great as those two guys are the grandmaster and the priest we leave the priest out of combat and make way with the grandmaster to a spot where the dreadlord can´t smite him...but we can slice and dice the bsb. Without bsb next turn the dreadlord is in trouble...as are the mages.
 
Ooooo.  I didn't think about that.  Wow, Fandir!  I'm impressed! :::cheers:::
Masterful stroke on the strategy!
Title: Sv: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 27, 2012, 07:05:01 PM
Yep my thought exactly, the 3 archers confronts the dreadlord and the warrior next to him. That leaves 80mm for the knights, 2 on the bsb plus 2supporting and likewise for the sorcerer.

ifå possible we should pivot the steamy to get on the left flank of the executioners or we will be.charged next turn. The reiksland might attempt af charge of harpies and overrun into the spears (edited i got the harpie angle wrong, perhaps not the best idea to charge )

The small knights 1 unit should position to the shades and knights 2 for the minor spear and flank of big spear..

Sendt fra min GT-I9000 med Tapatalk2
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 27, 2012, 07:16:33 PM
The exes won´t see the stank thanks to the hill.....I think the archers can only go to the left side of the unit....it would be better if they could go on the right though I might check this in the brb.

Reiksguard most likely has to continue to dilly dally around picking flowers and braiding each others hair.
Title: Sv: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 27, 2012, 07:24:52 PM
The exes won´t see the stank thanks to the hill.....I think the archers can only go to the left side of the unit....it would be better if they could go on the right though I might check this in the brb.

Reiksguard most likely has to continue to dilly dally around picking flowers and braiding each others hair.
Bravo, hadnt seen the hill :)

the spear character placement is lord war war bsb war witch

I think it is perfect with archers going left. And i dont think the brb allows us  to change it.

Sendt fra min GT-I9000 med Tapatalk2
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 27, 2012, 07:28:19 PM
Ok in any case...the lord isn´t in contact with our grandmaster....hurray! Slicey dicey kill that heathen bsb.
Title: Sv: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Windelov on September 27, 2012, 07:42:03 PM
Exactly, great stuff ahead!  :D

Sendt fra min GT-I9000 med Tapatalk2
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: mottdon on September 27, 2012, 09:24:19 PM
I'm torn on the vanilla knights though.  Yes, they would be a help in taking out the shades, but that's all they will be good for.  On the other hand, we'll get the VPs and have saved the units down there from any harm (his VPS).
If they were to attack the remainder of the bunker, they can then assist in taking out the spear block from behind.
The KN2 block can position themselves for a flank on the spear block or chasing down the bunker.  That was after all their purpose in this list.

Nice to be in this position though!
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 27, 2012, 09:26:41 PM
Good idea with the shades...how about right nilla knights ride hard towards the shades?


Next turn a charge before they take down the cannon.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: mottdon on September 27, 2012, 09:31:18 PM
I'm a little concerned about simply leaving the ICKs to take out the Spears all by themselves.  His chances go way up.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 27, 2012, 09:35:43 PM
The stank and the left knights will be in for help next of our turns......in doubt we can figure out what to do with the right knights...Also we are talking knights against spears....once the dread lord is dead the fight is over...and the dead lord dies as soon as the bsb is down.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: mottdon on September 27, 2012, 10:35:31 PM
That's what I want to see!   :-D
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: MrAbyssal on September 27, 2012, 11:01:00 PM
All sounds good so far. Sorry I haven't had much input. Sometimes it sucks being in a time zone so far ahead of people.

We can probably try and hit the Shades with the killer budgies, but then we'll probably want Wyssan's on the ICK and probably Savage Beast as well so we probably won't have the PD.

Stank can't really do anything except plough through the Harpies but we might get lucky enough to get in on the last turn. Reiksguard will probably need to cut through the forest. Kn2 can move to hit the Shades on the last turn as well.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 27, 2012, 11:09:03 PM
Hmmm lets wait and see how the move goes and then think about magic I would like the Grandmaster with 7 attacks with the runefang!

 ::heretic:: ::heretic:: ::heretic::
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 27, 2012, 11:41:29 PM
Stupid hydra. How did we not get any wounds on it before entering combat? We needed one cannonball to hurt it.

Couple of questions:
1. Did the executioners make their fear check?
2. Will the arcane ruins create. -2 penalty to shoot through? I'm assuming yes.
3. Can the vanillan knights charge into the hydra? I'm thinking no.

Thoughts for our next turn:
Steam points: let's go big (5) and hope we either blow up so the HBVGs can get the executioners down into single digits, or we once take one wound and put a serious Hurt on the executioners.

Charges:
If the stank lives through it's steam point phase and has 5 or more steam points, I think we should charge the last Demi into the rear. With that many steam points, we should be able to cut the number of executioners down to 10. They'd still be steadfast, but would lose combat pretty badly and if they fail their test we can catch them (unlikely).

If the stank loses a bunch of steam points or explodes, we let the HBVGs shoot them and keep the Demis where they are.

Other units charge the chaff in front of them.

Vanilla knights: move full speed past the hydra towards the spearman.

After combat, I think we'll want to overrun with anything we can.
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 28, 2012, 12:07:50 AM
Stupid hydra. How did we not get any wounds on it before entering combat? We needed one cannonball to hurt it.

Couple of questions:
1. Did the executioners make their fear check?
2. Will the arcane ruins create. -2 penalty to shoot through? I'm assuming yes.
3. Can the vanillan knights charge into the hydra? I'm thinking no.

1.  Yes.
2.  Yes.
3.  No.

 :::cheers:::
HHG
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Harshey on September 28, 2012, 12:33:35 AM
Thanks!
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 28, 2012, 02:26:56 AM
TDG 2.5: Die Hard (http://warhammer-empire.com/theforum/index.php?topic=43914.msg747956#msg747956)  is up and posted.

See ya over there!   :wink:

HHG
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Calisson on September 28, 2012, 08:17:59 AM
Combat Versus Team BlueShades attack Archers.  5 hits, 3 wounds.  No hits back.  They run 4.  Get chased down  at 11.”  The Cannon crew and the Archers both make their Panic tests.
Why in the world did the Shades pursue, rather than reform and face the cannon?
Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 28, 2012, 08:22:00 AM

*shrug*

Maybe they failed a leadership test....maybe they wanted to make certain the remaining archers die die die.....maybe he didn´t think about it or thought hatred worked like frenzy forcing an overrun.

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Holy Hand Grenade on September 28, 2012, 11:00:26 AM

*shrug*

Maybe they failed a leadership test....

This. 

Shit happens.   :unsure:

Title: Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
Post by: Fandir Nightshade on September 28, 2012, 11:09:24 AM
HA! what I am saying forcing as many rolls as possible will lead to some failure eventually....stacking the cards guys...stacking the cards.