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Author Topic: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger  (Read 7571 times)

Offline OmegaOm

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Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« on: September 04, 2009, 03:01:52 AM »
Dont know why they made the hellblaster weaker, when Chaos is so overpowering already.  The armies in warhammer are definitely not balanced. If warhammer fantasy existed in reality then yes the Chaos Daemons would be stronger, but the will of the humans would create such devices to effectively battles these horrors or else the humans would be extinct. 
Since warhammer is a strategy game, the armies should be balanced somehow.  You shouldn't have to play the evil doers to win a tournament.  I do agree that the hellblaster was a little too strong for 1 warmachine in previous editions, but the empire does need some more of a boost in power in other areas.  Or GW should decrease the power of the vampire counts and the Chaos Daemons.

Offline Derek Contyre

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2009, 09:06:05 AM »
Yeah also remember that the empire would outnumber the daemins by like a million
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Offline Obi

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2009, 03:05:55 PM »
So your point is, what exactly?

-edit-

'your' is plural, in this case
« Last Edit: October 12, 2009, 03:38:30 PM by Obi »
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Offline Derek Contyre

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2009, 09:46:46 PM »
Hmm, I didn't have a point there now that I look back on it.

I dont know why GW are making the evil armies so powerful, but it seems to be a recurring theme with them. Make the good armies able to draw and the evil armies able to win. I cant wait to see how they OP the empire next edition.
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Offline Lord Solar Plexus

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2009, 05:27:11 AM »
It's because they're evil themselves, or at least that is the most plausible theory.

They won't make Empire any stronger in the next edition, army book or whatnot, just add some colour schemes, tweak a few points and S values, exchange a few heroes for new ones, and be done with it.
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Offline Otaku

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2009, 02:58:53 AM »
theyll do more than that. they will  bring points down even more so that you have to buy even more models in order to field a 2250 point army..  :dry:

Offline Derek Contyre

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2009, 08:08:07 AM »
Thank sigmar I started in sixth when box sets were fifty bucks(aus) for 19 models or so.
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Offline kk14

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2009, 12:59:08 AM »
They won't OP Empire. It has consistently been average strength for as long as I can remember, and then some. Wanting to be more than average is for evil people. Good people want to be just powerful enough, and no more.
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Offline Fandir Nightshade

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2009, 02:36:28 PM »
Empire is still able to at least compete with the top notch armies they gave empire quite some candy (war altar, prayers on bound level 4, hatred for the priest, core flagellants, rocket launcher, steam tank, outriders) while on the other hand they took away some stuff (no cavalry hammer, i really liked those ones, no two inner circle as core, no more fussilade, griffon banner technically gone, greatswords no more warbanner)

overall I think empire is doing okish but has lots of space to improve in the next army book.

Offline Wolfgang aus Wien

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2009, 03:08:03 PM »
GW will do what they have always done:
Each successive new army book is 'stronger' than the preceding ones.
(With the possible exception of Dark Elves....they seem to continuously suck)
That's how the sales department likes it.

Offline Fandir Nightshade

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #10 on: December 21, 2009, 03:27:38 PM »
WTF? Dark Elves continue to suck? They are one the big three and by no means suck. Also I have to disagree

empire average and decent

orks average and decent

high elves average and decent (perhaps even too weak and stupid designed with asf)

demons...overpower

vampires ...overpower but weaker than demons

warriors of chaos..average and decent (except that super killing spell)

dark elves....overpower

lizards...average and decent

skaven...yet to come out in the tournament environment but they look overpower again.

Offline Inarticulate

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #11 on: December 21, 2009, 04:14:52 PM »
Tombkings and DoW, don't even bother putting the models on the table against DoC.
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Offline Derek Contyre

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2009, 12:52:52 PM »
I would, but only to see the casket go off. Lol, that is something I found out, the casket affects BASE Ld values, without the generals LD to back it. . . wicked.
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Offline Fandir Nightshade

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #13 on: December 22, 2009, 01:01:31 PM »
Hmmm quite nice against vampires, they quite often have decent offensive magic but weak magic defensive the casket of souls sounds pretty impressive against them if you can protect it against flying vampires.

Offline Derek Contyre

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #14 on: December 22, 2009, 10:29:53 PM »
Thats what my thirty skeleton archers are for. . . Mwahahah
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Offline Nicholas Ironfist

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #15 on: December 22, 2009, 10:46:35 PM »
yOU BUNCH OF WHINGING CRY BABIES !!!! I read this and thought I had found a high elf forum. Empire are mobile, tactical and fairly cheap. Artilary is the ducks nuts and we have some of the most useful magic items there is. If any of your theroires were correct (and they are not) then surely Lizards would kick arse. Threads like this really do annoy me...lets boast our stats cause my lame mind can't think strategically. Less whinging more fighting !!!! (or painting :)
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Offline Sejestephan

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #16 on: December 22, 2009, 11:52:45 PM »
WTF? Dark Elves continue to suck? They are one the big three and by no means suck. Also I have to disagree

empire average and decent

orks average and decent

high elves average and decent (perhaps even too weak and stupid designed with asf)

demons...overpower

vampires ...overpower but weaker than demons

warriors of chaos..average and decent (except that super killing spell)

dark elves....overpower

lizards...average and decent

skaven...yet to come out in the tournament environment but they look overpower again.


Your list is crazy talk, there is way more difference between the armies than good and overpowered.
Orcs, beatmen and ogres are much worse than Empire, Wood elves, High elves and so on, which in turn are worse than Lizards wich are worse then the big three.
The new skaven isn't that bad, it's a good army, but not overpowered and nowhere near the big three.
Looks like GW realized that the game got a little too overpowered with DE, VC and Demons.

Anyway, thats my two cents

Offline Warlord

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #17 on: December 23, 2009, 01:07:22 AM »
Looks like GW realized that the game got a little too overpowered with DE, VC and Demons.

You give GW too much credit.
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Offline kk14

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #18 on: December 23, 2009, 07:14:30 AM »
I would, but only to see the casket go off. Lol, that is something I found out, the casket affects BASE Ld values, without the generals LD to back it. . . wicked.

I didn't think it affected units which were Immune to Psych.
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Offline Derek Contyre

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #19 on: December 23, 2009, 01:43:59 PM »
Daemons are immune to psych? then i guess it doesn't affect them, oh well, two screaming skull catapults then :icon_eek::icon_mrgreen:
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Offline Fandir Nightshade

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #20 on: December 23, 2009, 01:51:30 PM »
Odd the banshee affects even immune to psych nowadays what a pity Khemrie got screwed (once again)


@ Sejestephan

I just placed the army books that did come out around and after empire and therefore my trend. I think empire can compete with any army even if it gets tough against demons they have a decent fighting chance.

Skaven - A bomb? bell or that plague thingy granting unbreakable? Rocket launcher?

Offline Tribun

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #21 on: December 23, 2009, 06:36:25 PM »
1. The prob with overpowered armies is not soo bad!! Look at the big tournaments: There are not only DoC and Vamps on the top3, but even armies like the empire or the woodies!

2. Even a overpowered army can be fielded in the wrong way by a stupid general. I believe, that a very clever player can win with every army!

Offline Sejestephan

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #22 on: December 25, 2009, 12:14:03 PM »


Skaven - A bomb? bell or that plague thingy granting unbreakable? Rocket launcher?

I didn't say that they suck, however even though they have good things it doesn't mean that they are broken like demons, it looks like a good army, but not better than most.



Offline commandant

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #23 on: January 22, 2010, 03:46:01 AM »
the bell is a bit of a problem, mainly because it makes the unit unbreakable but that is about it.   Its no worse than it used to be and the plague furnace is just a new toy you need to point a cannon at and forget about.   but hey I'm one of those players that thinks that Dark Elves aren't that bad.   Sure their magic can be horrible and they can cheesy lists if you want to, and the hydra thing is a little underpriced but who dosen't have  cheesy lists, who dosen't have underpriced things (looks around for people to point out that the empire doesn't have cheese lists and then remarks on the list that contains karl franz on a dragon, 4 cannons and 2 steam tanks, or what about underpriced imperial stuff, well the war alter is the most underpriced thing in the game as far as I can tell, though the hydra is a close second)
Sure Dark Elves are strong and in the hands of a skillful player very dangerous but that is kinda where it stops.   High Elves with their ASF are much more over powered than Dark Elves and yet nobody seems to count them as one of the big three.   If humans can even come close to the abilty of elves then in this tolkien fantasy setting within which we live there is a problem so stop whining about how weak your army is and figure out how to beat the other guy, how to use your detatchments to pull him out of place and how to use your greatswords and knights to clobber him while you use your cannons to blow away anything you can't clobber.

Offline Derek Contyre

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Re: Empire Weaker, Daemons Stronger
« Reply #24 on: January 24, 2010, 12:25:28 PM »
We aren't in a Tolkien fantasy setting.

Thats LoTR.

hate to break it to you.
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