home

Author Topic: Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.  (Read 10657 times)

Offline Hedgy

  • Posts: 45
    • View Profile
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« on: April 08, 2005, 12:37:38 PM »
Keeping it constructive: A guide to army list rating.

Note: This guide assumes that the maker of the list you are reviewing is male. If by some strange anomaly they are female consult my other guide Warhammer The Romantic Game of Fantasy Battles.

General Guidelines:

Try to not speak to speak in definitive terms.
Your list will get owned by X or Halberdiers are never worth their points

Use 'I' when stating things that you have found. Use 'others' when talking about what others think.
I find that two scroll caddies is often overkill - other people have tried X and been successful

Don't compare how the army will do against hypothetical armies. Or rock hard lists (Unless they have specifically stated that they WILL be facing rock hard lists like in a GT)
You're screwed if your opponent takes 3 mortars - This army would get owned by the Skaven army of doom

Questions to ask while looking at the list:

What level are they planning on playing at?
I think that the first thing you should do is to determine what level of competitiveness they plan on playing at. I like to sort the levels into three categories: new player, casual, and competitive. With new players be gentle and concentrate on making the list legal and the units effective at what he wants them to do. Don't reinforce the belief that a hard army list is necessary to win and let them try out fun magic items and gizmos while making sure that they aren't expecting too much from them.

Is he breaking any rules?
Does his free company detachment have light armour? Is he expecting to get four attacks with a Runefang by giving his GoTE an extra hand weapon? Correct him, and if something seems fishy, but you can't put your finger on it, summon the rules god by making a ludicrous claim about fast cavalry being able to reform then charge.    

Has he expressed any unrealistic expectations for a unit?
Is he taking a single HLR and calling it an unbeatable magic defence? Give him a gentle dose of reality and show him how it's possible to use HLRs as part of a magic defence.

Are the units efficient at their intended job?
Don't change the purpose of the unit. Make the unit better at its purpose. Suggest giving those hammer knights a war banner instead of an extra rank.

Is his list seriously missing any components?
Here is where you get to guide him towards using all those points you saved him by pointing out the limitations of the Banner of Valour. If you want him to see the value of 'nilla knights suggest he adds them here. If he could use a scroll caddie, now is the time to show him how he could add one. Just remember not to go overboard and to keep the heart of the list intact.

Finally ask yourself:
DO I KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT?
If you answer no here, will there really be any benefit aside from increasing your post count? As said above if you haven't tried it yourself, or you are using others' advice, admit it.

Disclaimer: In no way is this guide intended to be offensive to the French or any other nationality. Please do flame me saying it is. Definitely do not put words into my mouth by assuming the guide is anti-French and supporting my correct stance. For the love of god don't get this article locked by being stupid. If you don't know what any of this is alluding to don't ask.

Feel free to add more or comment on points.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2007, 12:50:11 AM by Warlord »
"If you have an original idea you need to read more books"
-someone else

Offline Clarkarias

  • Posts: 3576
  • Sarnia, Ontario
    • View Profile
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2005, 12:58:50 PM »
I think this is a most excellent article.  It should be a sticky in the Parade Ground.

And how can I flame the french...you don't talk about troops running away... :wink:
Actually, forget Karl-Franz. I want rules for Thyrus Gorman on a dragon. - Rufus Sparkfire

Offline Hedgy

  • Posts: 45
    • View Profile
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2005, 01:03:49 PM »
Yes well after my last artical was modsasinated I decide to go for a less contraversial topic. Some of my upcoming works include a investigation on puppies being cute and a Kellogg Briand thread on how war is bad.

Disclaimer: I dont actually feel I have been wronged by the mods. It was time to lock the other artical, but modsasinated was just such a cute term I couldn't resist.
"If you have an original idea you need to read more books"
-someone else

Offline General Helstrom

  • The Old Ones
  • Posts: 5322
  • Chicks dig moustaches
    • View Profile
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2005, 01:14:33 PM »
Quote
a genital does of reality


I'm hoping there are two typos in this bit ;)

Other than that, good article! People should definitely take this to heart before they go tearing someone's list apart.
I don't know what Caesar thought when he got to the Ides of March
Don't know what Houdini bought when he went to the store
But I sure do miss the eighties

Offline rufus sparkfire

  • Global Moderator
  • Posts: 32079
    • View Profile
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2005, 01:31:02 PM »
Very good indeed, but for the love of Holy Sigmar (whose Scripture is the Dictionary of the People) use a spellchecker/proofreader!

I mean really, 'genital does'?  :shock:

Once the spelling is cleared up, I think this would indeed make a good sticky for the parade ground.
Hey, I could still beat up a woman!
If I wanted to.

Offline Hedgy

  • Posts: 45
    • View Profile
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2005, 01:46:36 PM »
Quote from: rufus sparkfire
Very good indeed, but for the love of Holy Sigmar (whose Scripture is the Dictionary of the People) use a spellchecker/proofreader!

I mean really, 'genital does'?  :shock:

Once the spelling is cleared up, I think this would indeed make a good sticky for the parade ground.


both genital and does are spelled corectly. I did use a spell checker. :bonk:
 By proofreader do you mean a type of program or a human. Further more I stand by my subconsious sugestion. Nothing removes the desire to bring the imperial banner like a good genital does.  :wink:
"If you have an original idea you need to read more books"
-someone else

Offline rufus sparkfire

  • Global Moderator
  • Posts: 32079
    • View Profile
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2005, 01:52:54 PM »
I meant an actual human. I can see several other correctly-spelt but contextually-wrong words. A couple at least. Tell you what, I'll fix those for you and then glue this thread to the parade ground.
Hey, I could still beat up a woman!
If I wanted to.

Offline Midaski

  • Sussex, England
  • Administrator
  • Posts: 9691
    • View Profile
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2005, 03:20:02 PM »
Another nice article Hedgy :clap:

That's the problem with spell checkers sometimes - they let you use a valid word with the wrong meaning.

However I see it's been cleaned up, (I even did a few bits myself, and if you like I'll have a go at your other one for you?

I only hope that it's accolade as a 'sticky' does not proportionately decrease its 'reads'.
Quote from: Gneisenau
Quote
Metal to Finecast - It is mostly a swap of medium. 

You mean they will be using Ouija boards instead of Tarot cards for their business plans from now on?

Offline RGB

  • Posts: 1379
    • View Profile
    • http://www.hammer-anvil.com
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2005, 03:34:08 PM »
Nice work!

Proofread it and it can get put up, no?

And no need to get pre-emptively defensive  :-P
« Last Edit: July 02, 2007, 12:43:32 AM by Warlord »
[in the good of life]

Offline Calvin

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 4138
    • View Profile
    • CalvinWinter.net
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2005, 01:10:07 AM »
Another Great Article, sorry about the other one but some of the comments were really getting out of hand.

This one is a good general guide to commenting and it was a great idea to write it.
Quote from: Rufas the Eccentric
Remember this every one, when in trouble just screem, CALVIN!
Quote from: Eight
I'd pay an extra 15 points or so to be able to take the engineer out back and shoot him.

Offline Hedgy

  • Posts: 45
    • View Profile
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2005, 04:08:39 PM »
We'll I think its safe to say the only the mods and RBG look at stickies. Hey how many mods does it take to cure an attack on the english language. :P
"If you have an original idea you need to read more books"
-someone else

Offline Midaski

  • Sussex, England
  • Administrator
  • Posts: 9691
    • View Profile
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2005, 04:32:39 PM »
Just one - as long as he gets there first :wink:
Quote from: Gneisenau
Quote
Metal to Finecast - It is mostly a swap of medium. 

You mean they will be using Ouija boards instead of Tarot cards for their business plans from now on?

Offline Calvin

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 4138
    • View Profile
    • CalvinWinter.net
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2005, 02:11:50 AM »
RGB?  What's that?  Really big Geeks???


EDIT: never mind, smacks self with mace! Sorry RGB!
« Last Edit: July 02, 2007, 12:42:39 AM by Warlord »
Quote from: Rufas the Eccentric
Remember this every one, when in trouble just screem, CALVIN!
Quote from: Eight
I'd pay an extra 15 points or so to be able to take the engineer out back and shoot him.

Offline RGB

  • Posts: 1379
    • View Profile
    • http://www.hammer-anvil.com
Keeping it constructive. A guide to army list rating.
« Reply #13 on: April 12, 2005, 04:56:55 AM »
Heh, it's a conversation starter. RGB? What? Well, talk to me and find out!

It's really just Red Green Blue. Although Really Big Geek suits me fine.
[in the good of life]