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Author Topic: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation  (Read 18233 times)

Offline Sircyn

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #50 on: May 29, 2007, 02:14:35 PM »
All those shiny new watch towers we will be building on top of the ashes of slash and burnt forest will be far better eyes! I think the idea of recivilising the areas immediately surrounding our beleaguered towns and roads is a very evocative one. The Dwarfs would essentially be watching our armies reclaiming our land, something everybody knows we will be doing. Unless by a long shot they find the crown up there I don't see with the info we have now that the landmark is worth fighting for.

I think with the way the campaign will work our numbers need not be all too much of a handicap in some senses. If all of us here write coordinated background material in enough volume we would in effect hijack empire victories that aren't our own that don't add a narrative. Of course that does require Imperial victories.... Which we can improve disproportionately to our numbers if we show up to every event we can at GWs. Even if we lose we can influence the manner of our defeat by providing a steady stream of good written material.

Do we know if there will be an official campaign forum seeing as GW have rid themselves of their community boards?

Offline Ostermarker

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #51 on: May 29, 2007, 03:26:27 PM »
Having, for the second time ever, looked at the map, surely as we're planning on making a triangle of roads between The Bitter Moon, Egondorf and the Tower of Vigilance, why not extend the roads from the Bitter Moon and Egondorf to the Altdorf-Talabhein Road, allowing more reinforcements (or whatever) to surge in, possibly explaining why we're no longer as defensive later on in the campaign.

Apart from later on removing the Skaven from their lair, fortifying the Giant's Tump and the un-named tower, and connecting them together and to the Old Forest Road (possibly) I see nothing else of strategic value here.

Although, adding a defensive force to the henge may make the local Wood Elves more friendly (less antagonistic) towards us.
So, Ostmarkers wear purple, but it's manly purple, not like that Bretonnian purple.

Offline Sircyn

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #52 on: May 29, 2007, 06:02:51 PM »
Would the WE mind us deforesting a chunk of the region? If they would take exception to it I don't think there is much we could do to appease them in recompense.  :icon_biggrin:

The tower of vigilance looks like an ideal candidate for a fresh road travelling left to join the kemperbad-talabheim road. I did think Egondorf was connected to the Altdorf road but now I think it is a tributary of the Talabec. I would agree that at least one of the two ought to get a link way onto the main road.

After the three places are joined to each other and the major roads through the area, we could then choose  where we want to go.  Either search for the Elven ruins and clear out the Skaven, or try and forge a road across the barren hills to the fort or just continue recivilising the primary triangle until the crown pops up and we have to reassess. I would favour the latter rather than marching off to scuffle around the henge or throw ourselves at the Skaven. I think the major determining factor of our second half of the plan is the crown, where it is and who has it.

Offline Ostermarker

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #53 on: May 29, 2007, 07:09:19 PM »
Can we even be sure it'll pop up in our region?
Will it even pop up during the campaign? (As in GW decide on who has it, and what happens due to results)

I agree that it may be best to fortify the triangle, and then perhaps connecting the tower to the triangle and then to the Old Forest Road. Then we can try and reassess our position, if anything big happens, from this defensive position.
So, Ostmarkers wear purple, but it's manly purple, not like that Bretonnian purple.

Offline Sircyn

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #54 on: May 29, 2007, 09:57:45 PM »
We can't be sure it will show up or if it will be possible to fight over it. If it does I think odds are it will either be the UK or the US that gets it thanks to the greater number of players. Even if there is no chance of seeing the crown float across the map we will have to be prepared for unexpected contingency, having that fortified position would be the best place to face surprises.

I would like to think the crown would be turfed up, then the races squabble over control of it as the owning race attempts to flee with it. However nothing stops someone just using it and becoming all powerful, although just how powerful could be debatable considering the previous owners were an insane dwarf and a goblin, hardly a fountain of knowledge. Could just be a standard campaign where the winner at the end earns the prize, could just be the crown zaps whoever wears it and we end up with the status quo again. I don't want to verge too deeply into speculation on this because it is a bit futile really.

Offline Veldemere

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #55 on: May 30, 2007, 09:28:25 AM »
The building of roads will become part of the plan. We already have 'broad brush' goals for the campaign but are not yet discussing these openly on the forum (we will have full discussion though when the time comes). My thought is to review goals on a weekly basis once we know how the campaign is panning out. Some races are starting by looking for the crown but I would be surprised if it turned up week 1.

As it stands the Skaven lair does not seem to offer any tactical advantage, the ruins look interesting but currently the HE, DE and chaos are all looking to fight over that one and it could be a bloody battle if we stepped in. The dwarfs and greenskins look to be trying to wipe each other out. Gobbos will no doubt be heading for the tavern, which we need to defend along with the other established Imperial settlements. Most worrying to me at the moment are the VCs trying to take the tower of vigilance, possibly a week 2/3 goal for us. But fluff wise it seems disadvantageous trying to defend a tower when they have no missile troops or war machines to garrison in it (apart from those bloody banshees!).

But keep up the thoughts, I am sure the strategic importance of all these locations will become clearer as the campaign rumbles on.

As for the GW stuff I know our local GW is holding mega battle events and I agree as many who can attend those should as it will help our cause.
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Offline Veldemere

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #56 on: May 31, 2007, 01:11:36 PM »
Seems to have gone a little quiet with the new generals, any of you new UK generals out there sign on and give us your army fluff, it's always nice for us to know who we are fighting alongside.
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Offline wissenlander

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #57 on: June 04, 2007, 01:26:36 PM »
Can I ask you guys to sumarize what your objective is in this region?  I want to post it so the other factions know so we can all work together on fluff (over at Warvault).
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Offline Veldemere

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #58 on: June 04, 2007, 03:26:32 PM »
We are currently planning week 1 only, this will be to protect Egondorf and the Bitter Moon. In subsequent weeks this position will be strengthened by building a link to the main roadways and connecting and fortifying the Tower of Vigilance. This will then be our base of operations for further forays and investigation dependant on what the other races are doing in the region. The hunters of Sigmar have been given clear comission to clear the forests preparing the way for the new roads and to warn of potential dangers. Our archers are using the cover of Taals forests to provide us intelligence on other key areas of importance for us.

We believe the orcs and Dwarves of the region will be involved in a significant Waaargh/ Grudge around the Giants Tump and stone circle, the Goblins are heading for the Bitter Moon, Lizzies look like heading for the stone circle, Vampires split between the Tower of Vigilance and the Skaven Lair, All elves heading for the ruins with a small contingent of Druchii going for Egondorf, Chaos and Skaven are still unknown to me.

Hope this helps.
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Offline wissenlander

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #59 on: June 04, 2007, 03:27:16 PM »
Yup that's good.  Thanks Veldy. :wink:
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Offline Tostig

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #60 on: June 04, 2007, 03:29:54 PM »
I had a brief read-through of the instructions for a NC Nottingham Tourney when I was in the GW store today, and it seemed to be based around Egondorf. I guess we'd better send even more re-enforcements there. I'll have a proper read through of the fluff and rules if I pop in tomorrow, two people were using it at the time.

Offline Veldemere

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #61 on: June 04, 2007, 03:36:49 PM »
Damn it man did you not tell them who you were, you are a sub-commander, they should bow deeply and move away backwards!
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Offline Veldemere

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #62 on: June 05, 2007, 09:51:07 AM »
Does anyone else have any other goals they think we should achieve other than the above?
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Offline Mark Perry

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #63 on: June 05, 2007, 12:13:07 PM »
I believe our aims should be in the first instance to defend the triangle of Bitter Moon, Egondorf and Tower of Vigilance, certainly during the first week, primarly against the Greenskins and DE. While the Dwarfs also engage with numerious opponents on the Giants Tump. From week 2 on we should look to expand our defensive triangle as opportunaties arrise.

My force will initaily be at the Tower of Vigilance to warn of comming attacks and to fight a delaying action. Then Sigmar willing take part in aggressive pre-emptive attacks on our enemys, possably including a large flanking effort in the final weeks of the campaign.

Offline Veldemere

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #64 on: June 05, 2007, 01:49:09 PM »
Thanks Mark, who is your general so we can refer to him fortifying the Tower.
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Offline clausewitz

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #65 on: June 05, 2007, 03:27:45 PM »
I believe our aims should be in the first instance to defend the triangle of Bitter Moon, Egondorf and Tower of Vigilance, certainly during the first week, primarly against the Greenskins and DE. While the Dwarfs also engage with numerious opponents on the Giants Tump. From week 2 on we should look to expand our defensive triangle as opportunaties arrise.
We might well find that future objectives are modified by events unfolding (i.e. further information becomes available through the NC website).  But our primary goals will remain as stated.
Quote
My force will initaily be at the Tower of Vigilance to warn of comming attacks and to fight a delaying action. Then Sigmar willing take part in aggressive pre-emptive attacks on our enemys, possably including a large flanking effort in the final weeks of the campaign.
I'm not sure that its possible to perform any kind of strategic flanking.  Since there are no real battlelines involved.  How do you define the "rear" areas of a beastmen army?  How do you threaten the supply lines of an Orc WAAAGH?

The only thing I can see in terms of strategic maneuvering that could be done would be more akin to taking table quarters in the final turns of a battle.  That we would make concerted pushes towards some of the other objectives (e.g. the ruined tower in the NE).

I also believe that we may need to alter our plans to take account of how the different factions are doing.  Since we can follow this on the results page and so can our opponents.

This is a good reason for our plans not to be too restrictive (our current plans are good in this respect).  And simple enough that even unimpressive battlefield results should suffice in achieving our goals.  For example, if we were to do badly we might register 25% wins, but as the goal is initially just to defend Egondorf/Bitter Moon then even that 25% should have a significant number of Empire armies winning "in the defence of Egondorf/Bitter Moon", rather than 25% wins for various objectives scattered around.  And obviously this is even more prevalent if we do well (which of course I hope we do!).
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Offline Veldemere

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #66 on: June 06, 2007, 08:25:47 AM »
Sorry this is my first time trying to post an image so I hope it works.

This is a map from Bugmans where they have plotted out the first weeks moves for each of the races, just thought you may find it useful/ interesting.



I suspect most of the information is correct seeing as most races are part of the GDA.
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Offline Ostermarker

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #67 on: June 06, 2007, 10:53:59 AM »
They've got quite a few armies which aren't doing anything. It could be useful, if only to see what the GDA are planning. Thinking about our plans atm, we only care about the left half, and possible attackers.

Therefore:
Elves (Tor Thana could be used as a starting point for an attack.
Orcs (Outright attacking us)
Skaven (The lair is a similar position to Tor Thana)

are the only real threats I see as being on this map.
So, Ostmarkers wear purple, but it's manly purple, not like that Bretonnian purple.

Offline Veldemere

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #68 on: June 06, 2007, 11:11:55 AM »
Therefore:
Elves (Tor Thana could be used as a starting point for an attack.
Orcs (Outright attacking us)
Skaven (The lair is a similar position to Tor Thana)

are the only real threats I see as being on this map.

I feel there are a few mistakes on this map, the druchii will attack egondorf I think and possibly some of the VC, they seem quite divided with some wanting the tower of Vigilance. There seems to be some thought that there will be a VC skaven war, which would be great and may reduce the chances the little rats will take the crown no matter who finds it! TKs are still a total mystery to me (if anyone can help).

I don't think it will be the orcs attacking us, information from Da Warpath implies that it will be goblin armies going for the tavern orcs going for the Dwarves.

Bear in mind this map only represents what those players on their respective forums are planning to do fluff wise, there will be many more players who will act independantly, please urge all those whom you play with regularly to go to their respective forums as it will clear the waters slightly (not make things easier, but at least clear the waters).

Also these plans do not mean you should only report fights against the opponents listed as attacking us, there will be groups of every race wandering and searching.
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Offline Mark Perry

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #69 on: June 06, 2007, 12:18:02 PM »
@ Clausewitz if you had read my post on the bottom of page 1 of this thread I think you will see that we are in agreement. The fortunes of war will dictate a great deal who we can strike at most successfully.

Flexability is one of the keys to a successful defense (Wellingtons defense against Ney in Portugal for example had a brilliant defense that combined the best elements of a static and mobile defense) and I don't want us to become too bogged down in complicated plans at this early stage of the campaign.

I agree that we need to coordinate so that most battles are fought initially around our defensive position to maximize the victories we achieve. Once that is done I think we will need expeditionary forces to circle around enemy positions, so that we can strike at strategic locations that become apparent as the campaign unfolds. Or strike at other races forces who become entrenched in combat against each other (I can see that happening allot with the stunties).

Lets not forget that both the Brett Knights and ours work best in an attacking (or counter attacking) situation, as the campaign unfolds I would love to see both knights charging into the rear of a Vampire army or O&G horde.

But lets not get ahead of ourselves, lets concentrate on defending the triangle for the first week and see what opportunities arise from there.

OH yes my Generals name is Maximilion Scholl :biggriin:

Offline WarbossKurgan

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #70 on: June 06, 2007, 03:36:33 PM »
I don't think it will be the orcs attacking us, information from Da Warpath implies that it will be goblin armies going for the tavern orcs going for the Dwarves.
We aren't attacking the Dwarfs either!

The Orcs of Da Warpath Cruzade in the Barren Hills are heading for Marchen's Henge (to re-carve the stones into effegies) and maybe the Giants Tump afterwards. Da Warpath Looterz are not going to be focused on any one location or enemy as we intend to make a thorough search for the Shiney Boss Hat... crown.

 :icon_biggrin:
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Offline HeraldOfTheFree

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #71 on: June 06, 2007, 06:06:00 PM »
Hi, I'm completely new to these forums (this is my second post...), although I am a long-time fan of the website.
I have read through this thread so far and registered on the main recruitment thread, and since I am in the UK Im going to take part in the war effort here.
My commander is General Kurt Luther, an Ostlander baron who is a veteran of war with Orcs and Goblins. He holds a great deal of power and  land in Ostland, and the army he leads actually rallies to him, not the Elector. In fact, Luther's family has expressed an interest into taking electoral position for centuries, but their views hold them back. *This is info of the top of my head, I need to sit down and think the background out*
Right, points to make.
  • What is Helstroms 4th? Sorry if I missed it, but there was a lot of battle plan to take in!
  • I believe all efforts should be made to take the strongpoints you guys have discussed and then expand them. Tower of Vigilance? Why not get our Engineers to make a castle of Vigilance? Likewise the Bitter Moon can be expanded into a fort, and Egondorf can be fortified.
  • Wouldnt it be cool at the end of the campaign to have a booklet of our own, describing in detail the locations we capture? Lets try and flesh out these areas in a way GW cannot do.
Ave Imperator fellow Generals!
Death to Bugmans Oathbreaking Dwarfs!

Offline nosramuk

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #72 on: June 06, 2007, 10:02:12 PM »
I love the way the dwarfs head straight for the mountain. Classic, could make up so many funny jokes about that. Anyways, this aside, i have one main point to say.

We should choose one site and stick to it for week one.
The reasoning behind this is:

1. Although there are a good few people in this topic posting thier support, there are going to be a lot more players elsewhere who arent a member of this site. Hmm, think ill be able to describe this more easily via maths. Say that the uk members of this site are representative of 5% (to get a better idea someone can count number of people who posted in this thread) of uk empire generals. If we spread our forces over 3 locations this goes down to 1.66% in each location, basically making the results insignificant. However, if all 5% are in one region, this will be noticed (i.e. have more significance) and will have better effect on the final outcome of that location.

2. It keeps things very very simple.

Simplicity is good as the plans have a greater chance of being successful as there is less to go wrong. Its kind of hard to mess up when you see on this site in big letters "week 1, post all battles at Egendorf"

To be honest, id much rather have a more complex plan as its more fun, however experiance has taught me that this only works if there is a large group of very active people who are all in good comunication with each other. And from the looks of things there are probably around 30 people in this forum topic, which isnt small, but its not huge either. If there were 100 people then things would be a bit different, but there is still would be the other two issues to deal with. These are player activity and communication.

 Now within this group of around 30 people im guessing the activity level is going to be about average. Most of us have lives of some sort or another outside of warhammer and so playing a 2000 pt game every day is probably a no no. Personally if i tried hard, i could play around one 500pt game a day (on average) and say one 2000 point game a week.

Finally theres comunication. Now communication via forums is always a slow process.At its best, realistically, im guessing everyone can log in once a day for 5 minutes. This means that if there is a change of plan, some time needs to be given before it can be carried out. (average log in times are probably once every 2/3 days.)


  Other things. Mark Perry, i really liked your fluff post, i like your writing style, it made a good read.

Fluff wise, I basically have two forces, my 500 point force led by Captain Luitdorf (first name George) (which will do most of the fighting) and my 2000 point force led by one of the officers of the reiskguard. (normally this is Old kurty, but not gonna use him in campaign as not very fluffy.) Might post up some fluff later.
« Last Edit: June 06, 2007, 10:26:21 PM by nosramuk »

Offline MiB

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #73 on: June 06, 2007, 11:01:34 PM »
TKs are still a total mystery to me (if anyone can help).

Unfortunately TK dont seem to be doing anything to organise themselves, at least not that I can tell from anywhere online

Offline Veldemere

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Re: The Barren Hills- UK-Regional Organisation
« Reply #74 on: June 07, 2007, 09:12:47 AM »
Nosramuk, you make some good points particularly with regards to the size of our footprint. Please bear in mind there are probably about twice as many people reading the forum as there are posting on it so that may increase our numbers slightly. The main reason we have been forging alliances is so we can get consistency of fluff from other races as well, by virtue of the fact most of us are active in writing on forums it is likely we will be the most active in writing fluff. We currently have the Bretonnians looking like allies and work is progressing with the High elves, if more races are saying the same thing it is more likely to get noticed.

This also ties into the point about Helstroms 4th, the reason for adding this to your army title is to make us stand out as a 'block vote', GW will notice if 20-30 armies in this region all have that in their army title and are more likely to pay attention to the fluff.

If you see the map above most races are signed up to this opening move via their forums this would probably be somewhere in the region of 25-50% of the active players in the campaign this will have an effect.

The opening move has been kept as simple as possible whilst still allowing flexibility for future moves. The main focus of our forces must be Egondorf (our primary goal in this campaign is to protect the Empire) with the Bitter Moon as a secondary. The Tower is tertiary to our plans but looks to be facing some resistance from the VC, but none the less essential to our plans even if we cannot take it we could still benefit if, by the end of week 1, there is no overall control.

Nos, if you can play 500 per day and 2k once per week that would be fantastic, I am judging this (and trying to do my maths) based on players playing 1-2 games per week, 6 reported games would be a great boon.

I suspect GW would not mind the Bitter Moon being a fortified inn for 2 reasons, on the fluffy side this place must be getting attacked all the time with its location so close to the forest and all those beasties, secondly and most importantly to have a fortified inn on the tabletop requires one to buy more of their terrain sets that have just gone on sale.

Turning the tower into a castle is less likely I think, that is a huge undertaking and requires a lot of manpower, something not in ready supply during a war, also the easiest time to storm a castle is when it is being built, we risk our hard work going to someone else. Possibly something we can do once we win this campaign.

Great to have both of you on board, Nosramuk and HeraldOfTheFree, keep up the good work, and please do keep questioning anything you think may not be right, it open up the discussion and flow of opinions.

Thanks for info on TK MiB, are you keeping an eye out on them?
Veldemere, Elector Count of Solland (Elect)
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