Topic: 3000 points: Averland Army (Themed)

[Irisado]

I have my second battle against the new Vampire Counts this week, and after scraping a draw in my first game against them, I've decided that I need some advice with my list, as I'm not sure that it's up to the task.

Just a few points before I post it:

1. I play an Averland army, so some units (e.g. Halberdiers) are included because they fit the background of this province.  Such units may not be the best units, but I like themed armies, so I really want to keep units which fit the Averland theme.

2. I don't play in tournaments, and I dislike overpowered lists, so please don't suggest power gaming combinations, such as War Altars, two Steam Tanks, and Karl Franz on a Dragon.

3. Please bear in mind that I have very limited choices for my State Troops.  This is because I didn't buy enough boxed sets before they changed the sixth edition to seventh edition plastics, so there are some units that are not big enough, and others which I just don't have (e.g. Swordsmen).  I refuse to buy seventh edition plastics for the Empire as they are ghastly models without exception.

Taking these points into account, please give me as much feedback on my list as possible, and where you feel it could be improved.

Lords:

Grand Master (Knights of the Blazing Sun) 245 points (leads Knights of the Blazing Sun)
Laurels of Victory, Holy Relic

Light Wizard Lord 291 points (attached to Knights of the Blazing Sun)
Level 4, Barded Warhorse
Rod of Power, Orb of Thunder

Heroes:

Bright Battle Wizard 164 points
Level 2, Barded Warhorse
2 Dispel Scrolls

Battle Standard Bearer 183 points (attached to Spearmen)
Full Plate Armour
Imperial Banner

Warrior Priest 144 points (leads Halberdiers)
Two Handed Hammer
Armour of Meteoric Iron, Icon of Magnus

Warrior Priest 111 points (leads Spearmen)
Heavy Armour, Shield
Sword of Might

Core:

25 Halberdiers 170 points
Full Command, Shields
Detachments: 10 Free Company 50 points, 5 Crossbowmen 40 points
I know that Swordsmen are better, but Halberdiers go with the Averland theme, and I don't have a large unit of Swordsmen to field even if I wanted to

20 Spearmen 140 points
Full Command, Shields
Detachments: 8 Swordsmen 48 points, 5 Crossbowmen 40 points
I know this unit is too small, but I don't have any more models unfortunately

5 Knights Panther 115 points

10 Handgunners 105 points
Marksman, Hochland Long Rifle

12 Tilean Crossbowmen 96 points
I know there's no difference between Tilean and State Crossbowmen, but having the read that Tileans can be found in an Averland army, I decided just have the name for reasons of background

10 Huntsmen 100 points

15 Flagellents 160 points
Prophet of Doom
I would have liked a larger unit, but again I have no more models

Special:

9 Knights of the Blazing Sun 304 points
Inner Circle, Full Command
Standard of Arcane Warding

20 Greatswords 230 points
Full Command
I'm really not sure whether this unit is worth it.  Any thoughts?

5 Pistoliers 90 points
Outriders would have been better I suspect, but alas I don't have any

Great Cannon 100 points

Mortar 75 points

The basic plan if for my infantry to form a defensive centre around the BSB with Imperial Banner, while I use my cavalry to smash through one flank.  It's the old hammer and anvil tactic, which has worked for me well in the past, but against these Vampires, I'm not so sure.  I do have a VC army myself, and the book, so I'm well aware of what I'm up against, by my opponent is very crafty, and often has some very clever combinations, often using less favourable magic items, which catch me by surprise.

Anyway, please give me your thoughts on the list.

[Oenghus]

I'm still not quite up to speed on the ins and outs of Empire, so I can't really comment on the list to any great extent (my one suggestion might be to switch the second priest's sword of might to a plain old GW and give him the Rod of Command so that his unit can make that one all-important insane courage roll vs outnumbering fear-causers). 

I have, however, played against Vampires a lot.  I'm not sure how much tactical input you'd like, but I'll give you what I've got anyway. I find that any strategy relying on crushing a flank and moving on vs vampires tends to fail due to, for example, one stupid little skeleton that survives the crumble and holds up your entire sweep for an entire turn.  That gives the vamp time to a) regrow the unit and b) grow several more units to back it up.

The only way to beat them with a conventional army (well, the easiest way that I've found, anyway) is to do the sort of thing that we've learned not to do over the course of playing regular old warhammer.  Find his least well-protected character, and frontally charge your knights into it.  Maybe have a VHS mage in the unit, if he's not running the character it a ranked up unit (that will have a champion).  Direct as many attacks as you can on the character.  When the knights break and run, hopefully the character is dead.  If not, try it again.

When you attack a unit, kill it dead in one round or don't bother attacking.

Erm.  I hope that something in that jumble was helpful.  Good luck anyway.

[Perambulator]

You've already noted the difficulties you will have with your limitations in men.

The Greatswords will be much better if you add a close combat detachment to help it out.

I would drop the Orb of Thunder unless you are certain you are going to be facing an enemy that has fliers.

[dabber]

Grand Master (Knights of the Blazing Sun) 245 points (leads Knights of the Blazing Sun)
Laurels of Victory, Holy Relic

Since you cannot break undead on the charge, you should plan for extended combat.  That means something bigger than his basic lance is highly desirable.  Meaning Sword of Power.  Since VC don't really have an ignore armour saves weapon, Dawn Armour would be great defense.  I admit that precludes the Laurels, but a 3k game is going to have a NASTY fighting Vampire Lord and you don't want your general going down.

There is no reason to give wizards barded warhorses.  The extra inch of movement is more valuable than the still wimpy armour save.  Drop the barding.

You probably don't have the models, but your other two fighting characters really should be on horses.  One guy goes on foot - the one with AoMI.  All other fighting characters should be riding a horse.

[Raulmichile]

I don't get why halberdiers fit the theme with Averland.  But anyway, this is just personal preference.  As Preambulator said, put a swordsmen detachment to Greatswords if you can, negating ranks to the enemy you have the possibility to shorten the total of GS in the unit, thus saving you the points to field the swordsmen.  Swordsmen are not killy but more durable than any other option.

[Irisado]

Since you cannot break undead on the charge, you should plan for extended combat.  That means something bigger than his basic lance is highly desirable.  Meaning Sword of Power.  Since VC don't really have an ignore armour saves weapon, Dawn Armour would be great defense.  I admit that precludes the Laurels, but a 3k game is going to have a NASTY fighting Vampire Lord and you don't want your general going down.

There is no reason to give wizards barded warhorses.  The extra inch of movement is more valuable than the still wimpy armour save.  Drop the barding.

You probably don't have the models, but your other two fighting characters really should be on horses.  One guy goes on foot - the one with AoMI.  All other fighting characters should be riding a horse.

You're correct that I don't have the models to put the other characters on horses.

I've taken the Sword of Power before, but I exchanged if for the Laurels, as I felt that if I could get a high combat resolution, I could force many Undead units to crumble to dust through combat resolution.  I plan to use the Knights of the Blazing Sun and Knights Panther to charge Undead units simultaneously if I can, so I should be able to get enough kills to force them to crumble to nothing.  I agree that this would be more difficult against certain units.  My opponent has a nasty habit of taking two Vampire Lords, one for magic casting, and one for combat.  The one tooled up for casting spells will most likely be in the Grave Guard, which I have no intention of charging with my cavalry, but I agree that I could end up having to fight the other one.  The Sword of Power is quite tempting from that point of view.  I'll have to think about it some more.

I'll remove the barding from the Bright Wizard, since he is on his own.  The Light Wizard is in with the cavalry though, so the extra save may be useful in combat, and he won't be able to move any faster without it anyway, due to being in a unit of heavy cavalry.

Perambulator: My opponent will be fielding quite a few Fell Bats, so the Orb of Thunder is there to ground them, so that they can't attack my artillery crews.

Raulmichile: Take a look at paragraph three in the Averland section of the library to see how the Halberdiers fit in  .  Giving the Greatswords a detachment of Swordsmen is a good idea, but I'd have to use the detachment that is currently supporting the Spearmen, and I only have Archers, Crossbowmen or Handgunners to fill that void.  Would two units of missile troops successfully support Spearmen?

Just to help you all a bit, extra models which I do have access to are:
Archers, Handgunners, Crossbowmen, Pistoliers, Knights, Griffon, Wizards, Helblaster Volley Gun, Steam Tank (I have no intention of using that in this list though), and a variety of Elector Counts.

Thanks for all the advice so far, please keep it coming.

[Irisado]

In the end, I did opt to exchange the Laurels of Victory for the Sword of Power, as I decided it probably wasn't possible to wipe any of the large VC units on the charge, unless they were severely depleted, in which case I wouldn't need the Laurels at all.

I also removed the barding from both Wizards' horses, and I gave the Light Wizard a Dispel Scroll with the left over points.

My opponent and I have now deployed, and I don't think it's looking that good for the Empire, as I made a rather fundamental deployment error, but we shall see.  I'll let you know how the battle goes.

Wish me luck.