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Author Topic: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens  (Read 15089 times)

Offline Harshey

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #50 on: September 25, 2012, 05:00:40 AM »
And I'm saying in this situation you'd still want to declare the charge against the harpies first, then if they flee, you redirect to the shades. We can't have the harpies out there as a second redirector for our 4th turn.

If I was the dark elf player, I would hold with the harpies and hope for a failed charge, because they'll be so useful next turn.

Offline George

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #51 on: September 25, 2012, 05:11:44 AM »
just a thought for team green
When the Demi's charge the Hydra will a pursuit or overrun cause it to hit the shades?
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Offline Windelov

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Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #52 on: September 25, 2012, 05:50:03 AM »
I feel like we will lose the STank with 1 wound next turn.
The best use I see for him is to delay the executioners if possible. I'm still advocating aiming for the gap bewteen the harpies and executioners so it can't be charged. This means either the executioners spend a turn reforming to face it or Dreadlord relies on the metal mage to blow it up....which means less spells at the intact parts of our army.

STank 2 should be able to pick an angle to be outside of 14inch from the executioners and reiksgaurd will have an awkward movement to do the same.

Another crazy idea to redeploy the reiksguard would be to offer up a charge for the executioners aat a long didtance and flee from the charge. I'd be aiming for a flee angle that aims us at the side of the spears. so we can't be charged  or overrun into. This would then slow the executioners down to a 6" move max

There are few things that can kill the steamtank: misfire of the canon and spells and the DE player has plenty of more tempting targets currently. The harpies isnt realy a threat although they may lock it down for a turn. What fandir is advocating is a all or nothing attack on the metal sorc., and i think its the right thing to do even though i initially suggested otherwise. The executioners will not become a bigger threat over time and we should concentrate our forces on the centre.

.[/color]

Offline George

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #53 on: September 25, 2012, 06:00:29 AM »

There are few things that can kill the steamtank: misfire of the canon and spells and the DE player has plenty of more tempting targets currently. The harpies isnt realy a threat although they may lock it down for a turn. What fandir is advocating is a all or nothing attack on the metal sorc., and i think its the right thing to do even though i initially suggested otherwise. The executioners will not become a bigger threat over time and we should concentrate our forces on the centre.

My concern with the harpies is their ability to screw up our charges turn 4. With the harpies out of the way we could end up being able to charge the spears on turn 4 with both large blocks of knights and the steam tank while using the small knight unit to keep the executioners from having any more impact on the game.
I have concerns that we will just end up locked in one massive combat in the middle in which the executioners will be deciding factor in about turn 5 or 6.
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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #54 on: September 25, 2012, 06:25:21 AM »
I feel like we will lose the STank with 1 wound next turn.
The best use I see for him is to delay the executioners if possible. I'm still advocating aiming for the gap bewteen the harpies and executioners so it can't be charged. This means either the executioners spend a turn reforming to face it or Dreadlord relies on the metal mage to blow it up....which means less spells at the intact parts of our army.

STank 2 should be able to pick an angle to be outside of 14inch from the executioners and reiksgaurd will have an awkward movement to do the same.

Another crazy idea to redeploy the reiksguard would be to offer up a charge for the executioners aat a long didtance and flee from the charge. I'd be aiming for a flee angle that aims us at the side of the spears. so we can't be charged  or overrun into. This would then slow the executioners down to a 6" move max

There are few things that can kill the steamtank: misfire of the canon and spells and the DE player has plenty of more tempting targets currently. The harpies isnt realy a threat although they may lock it down for a turn. What fandir is advocating is a all or nothing attack on the metal sorc., and i think its the right thing to do even though i initially suggested otherwise. The executioners will not become a bigger threat over time and we should concentrate our forces on the centre.

.[/color]

I really have to agree with windelov here. Everything has to go to the center if we want to put preassure on the metal-witch. Even a 1 wound STank is a problem for Dreadlord and if he choose to kill it with a spell then something else lives. The execs will arrive to late if we go for a Turn 4 Charge with everything. And as mentioned the STank is supposed to clear of the harpies if possible.

Offline Fandir Nightshade

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #55 on: September 25, 2012, 06:41:39 AM »
I think both stanks could manage to shoot their repeater pistols at the harpies killing one or two of them a panic check is all we need.

IF the wounded ol rusty (STank 1 with one wound) isnīt likely to get away from the exectutioners if it lines up to kill the witch we should consider moving it to line up a shot at the spear horde with the cannon ball going through the first rank forcing look out sir on the dreadlord, the bsb and the death mage all without any wardsaves, Dreadlord was rather lucky on his leadership tests if I have learned one thing in warhammer, it is that the dice even out through a game you just have to force enough rolls and at some point everyone runs out of luck.

So what we could do

Stank one move with 3 dice towards the spear horde in a way that the harpies remain within 12 inch 1-2 dice cannon shot repeater pistol on harpies.

Stank two move with 3 dice towards the metal witch 1-2 dic cannon shot if possible repeater pistol on harpies.

Reiksguard moves over the hill not touching the woods if possible trying to stay at least 14 inches away from the executioners.

Archer detachments move to shoot at the metal sorc bunker the right one tries to block the spear hoard in a way that makes an overrun to the ick impossible and would bring the spear horde closer to the stanks if he choses to overrun.

Knight 1 on the left charges the dark riders

Knight 2 on the right moves into a position to support an attack on the spear hoard OR in need redeploys to intercept the executioners from being a threat in turn 5

big archer group moves into a position to fire their arrows into the metal witches unit.

We concentrate what we have on her unit flock of doom .

Cannon and stank 2 will try to shoot the metal sorcs bunker...cannon 1 should make the start trying to get rid of the first rank of her bunker possibly killing all five targets and forcing a look out sir roll then the archers let fly and hopefully kill the last one or two models we need for the unit to be depleted enough to grant no more look out sir. With a little luck..(nothing unreasonable here...failing a look out sir roll is a 16 % itself...as is a misfire  :ph34r:) we should be able to bring the witch down...if not we have good chances to put enough pressure on the darklord to make the next turn very interesting at least.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2012, 07:02:45 AM by Fandir Nightshade »

Offline George

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #56 on: September 25, 2012, 06:53:23 AM »
okay...you've convinced me
having the small knight unit in position to deflect the executioners was the clincher....but damn I hope we panic those harpies or kill the mage.
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Offline Fandir Nightshade

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #57 on: September 25, 2012, 07:05:04 AM »
It is all about stacking chances....if we donīt kill the harpies and donīt kill the metal witch....the fight still isnīt over but we have to figure out new stuff next turn depending on how the dreadlord reacts and in turn puts pressure on us....it is always important keeping the heat up especially in tournament games as people start to make mistakes and lose the game to those....

This is the reason I think most gunlines lose in tournaments as they have only one way to put on pressure and often have a hard time to react on it they sit....and wait...and hope to kill enough of the enemy to survive the close combat.

Offline Windelov

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #58 on: September 25, 2012, 07:37:18 AM »
using the archers to block the shades should not affect our use of the canon, we can simply line them up just blocking the right side of the front, just barely blocking their path.. they should still be able to shoot at the wizard bunker  although with long range instead of short (hitting on 6 instead of 5+). The shades will most likely charge us next turn but our canon lives and may fire yet another turn

« Last Edit: September 25, 2012, 08:01:39 AM by Windelov »

Offline Fandir Nightshade

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #59 on: September 25, 2012, 07:54:49 AM »
George Bengtson....what is your call on the archer detachment? we lose five S3 shots but gain our cannon for another turn.

Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #60 on: September 25, 2012, 08:24:33 AM »
George Bengtson....what is your call on the archer detachment? we lose five S3 shots but gain our cannon for another turn.

If we'll be able to kill enough of the bunker without those 5 shots, then yes I'm all for saving our cannon. If not then I say sacrifice the cannon. Isn't there also a slight risk that the cannon will panic from the slaughtered archers?

We should also decide what we want to use the cannon for next turn. Sniping a character and hoping for a 1? The extra shot must be put to good use if we choose that path.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2012, 08:27:34 AM by Bildskoene Bengtsson »

Offline Windelov

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #61 on: September 25, 2012, 09:34:18 AM »
George Bengtson....what is your call on the archer detachment? we lose five S3 shots but gain our cannon for another turn.

If we'll be able to kill enough of the bunker without those 5 shots, then yes I'm all for saving our cannon. If not then I say sacrifice the cannon. Isn't there also a slight risk that the cannon will panic from the slaughtered archers?

We should also decide what we want to use the cannon for next turn. Sniping a character and hoping for a 1? The extra shot must be put to good use if we choose that path.

I think we will be able to shoot, just at long instead of half range, so at 6+ instead of 5+
Also if we roll high with the 6 steam point tank, we might get in range of the big spear unit with the steam gun,

« Last Edit: September 25, 2012, 09:59:37 AM by Windelov »

Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #62 on: September 25, 2012, 09:41:16 AM »

I think we will be able to shoot, just at long instead of half range, so at 6+ instead of 5+


I know but 6+ instead of 5+ basicly means zero dead in the bunker instead of one. Question is do we need that extra dead spearman or not?

Offline Fandir Nightshade

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #63 on: September 25, 2012, 09:44:02 AM »
Also some will have reductions from cover due to the shades and the ruins.....lets just assume those 5 shots wonīt count for much.

I think every single dead spear in the unit counts.



 Also we have to consider this if the spear horde charges to clear out the archer detachment 2 the witch canīt join the unit. So more likely should the witch survive she will join the big ass horde of spears making one nice big juicy all eggs in one basket now dreadlord really would have to get rid of the stanks to still win the day so he has to rely on magic if searing doom (big version) goes off one stank should be done ( I guess he would try to kill the cursed stank and kill ol rusty with spirit leech) if he goes for big he will most likely provoke a miscast yet another chance for the witch to die and also to take along several spears with her.

Offline George

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #64 on: September 25, 2012, 09:50:03 AM »
I think give the shades the cannon...it keeps them a turn away from the action....ie can't block our charges
We're going to win big by getting the spears or lose big....the cannons points aren't likely to matter too much
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Offline Windelov

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #65 on: September 25, 2012, 10:04:14 AM »
Oh well, you're proberly right, let the cannon die :dry:

Offline zakalwe

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #66 on: September 25, 2012, 10:05:34 AM »
I am +1 for moving the Stank towards the executioners, and moving the demi's round. I would be tempted to save the Steam gun for the Dark riders, this plus engineer pistol could clear them. Meaning we get 2 HBVG's at the spears.
DGK2 into Hydra is a given. Hope we knock some wounds off before the breath weapon hits .

Would it be an option just to hold with the reiksguard, blocking harpy Los atm. Charge Harpies with KN2, meaning if they flee we have knight 2 supporting reiks should the spears risk a long charge.

If we do charge with the reiksguard and we stumble forward. there is a fair chance our champion will hold his own in a challenge against anything other than the dreadlord. Holding his spears in place should they charge.

Shuffle the ICK over a bit and angle to allow a Thunderbolt on the DR and block Harpy LOS to nearest Hellblaster should it all go pete tong.


Offline Windelov

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #67 on: September 25, 2012, 10:25:49 AM »
If we roll high for movement of the Stank1 (12+ "), we might consider pointing the steam gun at the big spearunit, although it's hard to see from the maps I would guess we would be able to hit about 10 including a character or two


Offline Noght

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #68 on: September 25, 2012, 11:11:06 AM »
And I'm saying in this situation you'd still want to declare the charge against the harpies first, then if they flee, you redirect to the shades. We can't have the harpies out there as a second redirector for our 4th turn.

If I was the dark elf player, I would hold with the harpies and hope for a failed charge, because they'll be so useful next turn.


If the Harpies hold (and they will hoping for 9 or less) then we can't declare a charge on the fleeing Shades.  So we have to declare Kn1 on Shades and hope to make the LD8 test redirect?

We could send the STank at the Riders, if we make it they die, if not Steam them.  Either way the STank is in the way.  Unload all Volleys on the Execs.  Reposition DG1 for flank or rear charge on Execs or center. 

Flee with Reiksguard when Spears charge.  Move IC's up a bit per Zif's plan, though I'd stay 15" away.

Iceshard the Execs and hope they blow a panic test or Terror test so they can't charge the STank.
"...the most incorrigible vice being that of an ignorance which fancies it knows everything..."  Camus.

Offline zifnab0

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #69 on: September 25, 2012, 11:39:13 AM »
Reposting the modified plan from before:

DG1: Move forward to within 1" of the Executioners so they cannot wheel past. Move out of Executioner front arc, position for a flank/rear charge against Executioners next turn.

Steam Tank: Rumble 2 steam points towards the Spearmen Dark Riders and blast them with the steam gun.

ICK: Move forward, staying 14 15" away from the Spearmen bus.  Rearrange characters in the unit so that the Lord cannot be in base contact with either Huss or the BSB.  If Lord is in the center of the Spearmen, move Huss and BSB to the edges of ICK.  If he is on one side or the other, move Huss and BSB to the opposite side of ICK.

Reiksguard: Charge Shades, redirect into Hydra if (when) they flee.

DG2: Charge Hydra.

Kn2: Charge Harpies, redirect to shades (if visible) Charge (now visible) fleeing shades, redirect into harpies.

Other considerations:
Magic: key spells are 5+ ward on the ICK, flaming attacks on the Reiksguard, and Iceshard the Spearmen.

Shooting: Steam gun on Spearmen, HBVG on the Dark Riders Spearmen to wipe them out.

Offline Friar Metick

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #70 on: September 25, 2012, 11:59:02 AM »
Reposting the modified plan from before:

DG1: Move forward to within 1" of the Executioners so they cannot wheel past. Move out of Executioner front arc, position for a flank/rear charge against Executioners next turn.

Steam Tank: Rumble 2 steam points towards the Spearmen Dark Riders and blast them with the steam gun.

ICK: Move forward, staying 14 15" away from the Spearmen bus.  Rearrange characters in the unit so that the Lord cannot be in base contact with either Huss or the BSB.  If Lord is in the center of the Spearmen, move Huss and BSB to the edges of ICK.  If he is on one side or the other, move Huss and BSB to the opposite side of ICK.

Reiksguard: Charge Shades, redirect into Hydra if (when) they flee.

DG2: Charge Hydra.

Kn2: Charge Harpies, redirect to shades (if visible) Charge (now visible) fleeing shades, redirect into harpies.

Other considerations:
Magic: key spells are 5+ ward on the ICK, flaming attacks on the Reiksguard, and Iceshard the Spearmen.

Shooting: Steam gun on Spearmen, HBVG on the Dark Riders Spearmen to wipe them out.


You have my vote. Hopefully the DGK2's will be charging a fleeing hydra.  :-)   :::cheers:::   :eusa_clap:
Blessed be those who game.

Friar Metick

Offline Noght

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #71 on: September 25, 2012, 12:07:39 PM »
Reposting the modified plan from before:

DG1: Move forward to within 1" of the Executioners so they cannot wheel past. Move out of Executioner front arc, position for a flank/rear charge against Executioners next turn.

Steam Tank: Rumble 2 steam points towards the Spearmen Dark Riders and blast them with the steam gun.

ICK: Move forward, staying 14 15" away from the Spearmen bus.  Rearrange characters in the unit so that the Lord cannot be in base contact with either Huss or the BSB.  If Lord is in the center of the Spearmen, move Huss and BSB to the edges of ICK.  If he is on one side or the other, move Huss and BSB to the opposite side of ICK.

Reiksguard: Charge Shades, redirect into Hydra if (when) they flee.

DG2: Charge Hydra.

Kn2: Charge Harpies, redirect to shades (if visible) Charge (now visible) fleeing shades, redirect into harpies.

Other considerations:
Magic: key spells are 5+ ward on the ICK, flaming attacks on the Reiksguard, and Iceshard the Spearmen.

Shooting: Steam gun on Spearmen, HBVG on the Dark Riders Spearmen to wipe them out.


You have my vote. Hopefully the DGK2's will be charging a fleeing hydra.  :-)   :::cheers:::   :eusa_clap:

I concur.  Just wondering about what's the benefit of 5 str 3 steam blast vs just plowing into the Riders with D6 + 3d3 grind?  Unless we're afraid we won't make the distance?  Engineer has 3 shots with Repeater Pistol also?
"...the most incorrigible vice being that of an ignorance which fancies it knows everything..."  Camus.

Offline zifnab0

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #72 on: September 25, 2012, 12:26:50 PM »
I concur.  Just wondering about what's the benefit of 5 str 3 steam blast vs just plowing into the Riders with D6 + 3d3 grind?  Unless we're afraid we won't make the distance?  Engineer has 3 shots with Repeater Pistol also?

Distance.  We're more than 12" away from the Dark Riders.  If we put all 3 dice into the steam engine we've got a low chance of hitting the riders, leaving only 1 dice for the steam gun.  2 dice gives us a decent position and the steam gun is big enough to hit all of the riders.

Second, if we run into the Dark Riders the Executioners will hit our flank.  If we don't go straight at them we can present the front of the tank.

HHG: What's your position on the Executioners reforming after combat to present their rear to the steam tank and their front to the DG?  Legal or not?
« Last Edit: September 25, 2012, 12:33:35 PM by zifnab0 »

Offline zakalwe

  • Posts: 227
Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #73 on: September 25, 2012, 12:27:12 PM »
If we plow into the DR and kill them all, what is to stop the executioners from flank charging the STank.   Would both HBVG shoot the executioners, to aid the flank. if not steam tank will suffer/ could even die if it got hit in the flank by 3 ranks of executioners.

Hell doing the maths, average says we will stick around.

What are we going to shoot the HBVG's at I think it would be preferable to shoot both at one target, exec's or spears.

Offline Noght

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Re: Tactical Decision Game 2.4: The Plot Thickens
« Reply #74 on: September 25, 2012, 12:33:30 PM »
If we plow into the DR and kill them all, what is to stop the executioners from flank charging the STank.   Would both HBVG shoot the executioners, to aid the flank. if not steam tank will suffer/ could even die if it got hit in the flank by 3 ranks of executioners.

Hell doing the maths, average says we will stick around.

What are we going to shoot the HBVG's at I think it would be preferable to shoot both at one target, exec's or spears.


Agree with Zif, no reason to rumble into Riders.  Shoot both Volley Guns into Spears.  9 wounds is a panic, though we could do more than that...
"...the most incorrigible vice being that of an ignorance which fancies it knows everything..."  Camus.