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Author Topic: Starting a New Empire army  (Read 749 times)

Offline Musketeer1887

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Starting a New Empire army
« on: May 28, 2013, 07:23:53 PM »
Hey guys first time posting and I was wondring about commencing a new Empire army, I would love your guy's opinions on what units are best and which is the right waqy to go with empire?

Offline The Peacemaker

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2013, 07:25:55 PM »
Pistolier/outriders box
Militia box.

Will give you tons of bitz to make your army look cooler.


Edit: What to get for your army. If you want competitive take a loot at the battle report/army list section. You'll have to choose between getting a hurricanum or a War Alter for competitive. Or both.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2013, 07:29:18 PM by The Peacemaker »
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Offline Musketeer1887

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2013, 07:27:01 PM »
What are the best core units to field?

Offline Quickbeam

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2013, 07:55:54 PM »
Halberdiers. You want a good large unit of them to start out almost any empire army.
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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #4 on: May 28, 2013, 08:47:05 PM »
Some stores are still carrying the Army box from Christmas. That's a good starter

Offline Gankom

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2013, 09:39:49 PM »
It's a great starter if you can manage to pick it up.

The end result is going to be what you like the look of best. Many of the choices come down to one unit being better only by a small margin.

Offline The Peacemaker

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2013, 10:03:43 PM »
It's a great starter if you can manage to pick it up.

The end result is going to be what you like the look of best. Many of the choices come down to one unit being better only by a small margin.

This sums it up.

Super competitive is something like max demi-gryphs, 2 Stanks, some cannons or something like that.

For core you can't go wrong with 40-50 halberds, 8-10 knights, box of archers. You'll always field them. The militia box comes with 10 bows, 5 halberds, 5 greatswords, 10 xbows equipment which is why its pretty good.


Browse the rest of the Empire site, there is tons of help. We have 'beginners guide to the empire' written up but I'm not sure if it was stickied or where it might have been moved too.
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Offline TCWarroom

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2013, 10:27:01 PM »
I actually have one of those big boxes left. I am surprised its still there but it is the best way to start. PM me if interested.

Offline zifnab0

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2013, 12:01:01 PM »
My optimal list would be:

Arch Lector on War Altar
Wizard Lord
BSB on Foot

40 Halberds
10 archers + two 5-man detachments
2x5 Knights

2 cannons
2x4 Demigryphs

Steam Tank

That should be about 2200, plenty of points for magic items and a bit of customization.  Depending on how magic crazy you get, more archers and a Hurricanum wouldn't be remiss.

It gives you a good mix of what the Empire has to offer - artillery, knights, state troops, and buffs, buffs, buffs.

You could also go with an all-mounted army.  Just substitute some more knights for the halberds and archers.  Maybe bring another steam tank if you're feeling dirty.

Or you can drop the knights and take some greatswords for an infantry-based army (with two hordes).  Check out my TEG against Rothgar.  I don't think that list did too poorly without knights (although I would have taken knights instead of the spearmen if I'd had the option).

If you want a more black powder feel, drop the steam tank and the Demigryphs.  Take a pair of HBVG and Engineers.  There should give you enough points for a unit or two of outriders.

Offline Commander Bernhardt

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #9 on: May 29, 2013, 12:51:58 PM »
I honestly suggest you would make use of the detachment rules also, they are one of the strenghts of empire. dropping one unit of demigryphs and maybe one of knights for a detachment of two.

but basically it matters what you prefer most, do you want a force of disciplined footsloggers supported by knights or do you want a force based around one or two knightly orders supported by some infantry?

two cannons AND a steam tank is quite redundant, change at least one for a helblaster volley gun
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Offline Musketeer1887

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #10 on: May 29, 2013, 04:02:37 PM »
are swordsman viable?

Offline Commander Bernhardt

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #11 on: May 29, 2013, 05:10:39 PM »
are swordsman viable?

as a detachment, yes
as a parent unit, propably no
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Offline The Peacemaker

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #12 on: May 29, 2013, 06:47:23 PM »
two cannons AND a steam tank is quite redundant, change at least one for a helblaster volley gun

Until you start rolling 1's or missfires. Then you are quite happy to have them.

are swordsman viable?

as a detachment, yes
as a parent unit, propably no

Well...a 10-15man parrent unit with two 5man archer detachments for chaff and redirecting could be useful.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2013, 06:53:00 PM by The Peacemaker »
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Offline The Peacemaker

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #13 on: May 29, 2013, 06:52:20 PM »
Double post.
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Offline Musketeer1887

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #14 on: May 29, 2013, 09:03:01 PM »
Ive heard the steam tank is ome of their best units?
Ive heard itreforms really well in the anvil type roll additionally
 it has some pretty decent and nasty combat attacks
« Last Edit: May 29, 2013, 09:06:54 PM by Musketeer1887 »

Offline Arfa

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2013, 04:30:02 AM »
Ive heard the steam tank is ome of their best units?
Ive heard itreforms really well in the anvil type roll additionally
 it has some pretty decent and nasty combat attacks

Steam tanks are fantastic, although if you're new to the game their rules mechanics can be somewhat different (not exactly your normal unit). But for effective points you really cant go much further.

Arfa

Offline Grimful

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2013, 05:08:13 AM »
Swordsmen can work as a parent unit, of course they aren't as good as Halberds, but that doesn't mean they are not viable.

That being said, I would suggest using them as a detachment and not a main unit, 15-20 could work well.

I'll just throw out a few ideas of what I think it's good to have in an Empire army:

Warrior Priests/Arch Lector - No matter which you use, Hatred + Prayers + channel + decent fighting states means these guys are a strong, strong choice to field in an army.

Halberds - If you're bringing Halberds, you'll want a lot I usually bring 30-50 depending on my point size, but since you're starting out 20+ will probably work well, if you find them dying too fast just add more.

Magic is important, so buying a mage box could be a good idea, at lower point games magic isn't going to be a huge devastating thing most of the time, but higher up (1500+) it can be crippling to play an army with a level 4 when you have no magic outside of WPs.

Battle Standard Bearer (BSB) - This is a pretty important unit though he can be hard to fit into smaller games with adequate protection, re-rolls for break tests can make or break you (haha pun).

I would stay away from Crossbowmen/Handgunners, as I've had poor results with them and they don't seem to earn back their points or provide much tactical advantage. Archers are better for the most part. That being said, since a unit of HG/CBs comes in the battalion you can use them as a wizard bunker or something.

Outside of those units I can honestly say the Empire doesn't have too many bad choices, sure there are units that I think are better than others (For example I feel like the Hurricanum is better than the Luminark) but you can still build a viable army as long as you don't go overboard in one area (Example: All Knights, all missile troops, literally nothing but halberds, etc.)

And if you're looking  at tanking a steam tank, I say go for it. 1000 point steam tanks my be considered cheese by some people, but I don't think it's that horrible.
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Offline The Peacemaker

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #17 on: May 30, 2013, 05:49:51 AM »
Magic is important, so buying a mage box could be a good idea, at lower point games magic isn't going to be a huge devastating thing most of the time, but higher up (1500+) it can be crippling to play an army with a level 4 when you have no magic outside of WPs.

Instead of the mage box I would recommend buying the Hurricanum/Luminark kit. You get a wizard in there.

Quote
Battle Standard Bearer (BSB) - This is a pretty important unit though he can be hard to fit into smaller games with adequate protection, re-rolls for break tests can make or break you (haha pun).

I would suggest putting alot of thought into which model you want for this guy. You take him everygame and it should be a model you like and want to use. There are a few variants you can buy so choose carefully.

Quote
I would stay away from Crossbowmen/Handgunners, as I've had poor results with them and they don't seem to earn back their points or provide much tactical advantage. Archers are better for the most part. That being said, since a unit of HG/CBs comes in the battalion you can use them as a wizard bunker or something.

Yep, archers are better. But since you get 10 in the box you can either convert them or just build them and stuff them in the back ranks of a halberd unit. And sometimes a 10man unit is good for a deployment drop.
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Offline Musketeer1887

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #18 on: June 01, 2013, 10:04:53 PM »
Ok well i tried a match today against my friends tomb kings and didnt do too bad, whats people's opinioms on great swords becuase they worked efficiently in a horde of 30 for me?

Offline Syn Ace

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #19 on: June 01, 2013, 10:43:50 PM »
Great Swords are good because they have plate and are Stubborn -- I like to have a hero in there with an iron curse icon to give them a 6+ ward save against war machines because they always attract attention.

Demigryphs are a great unit. Steamtank sees a lot of service in my armies. 2 cannons usually. Big Halberdier horde. Hurricanum give a nice bonus. Make sure you get a warrior priest in with your greatswords -- rerolling misses in the 1st round of each combat because of Hatred is great.
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Offline xxvaderxx

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2013, 11:04:58 PM »
Great Swords are good because they have plate and are Stubborn -- I like to have a hero in there with an iron curse icon to give them a 6+ ward save against war machines because they always attract attention.

Demigryphs are a great unit. Steamtank sees a lot of service in my armies. 2 cannons usually. Big Halberdier horde. Hurricanum give a nice bonus. Make sure you get a warrior priest in with your greatswords -- rerolling misses in the 1st round of each combat because of Hatred is great.

I actually dont like them. Too big they are too expensive (30+ models) for flanking porpoise (20 models) i find that knights with grate weapon do it better with 2+ save at the same cost.

The only way i could consider fielding them is under 16 models and i dont think they are that good at those numbers.
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Offline Arfa

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #21 on: June 02, 2013, 08:44:09 AM »
Quote
I actually dont like them. Too big they are too expensive (30+ models) for flanking porpoise (20 models) i find that knights with grate weapon do it better with 2+ save at the same cost.

Flanking porpoise you say?



Offline Grimful

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #22 on: June 02, 2013, 11:05:15 PM »

I actually dont like them. Too big they are too expensive (30+ models) for flanking porpoise (20 models) i find that knights with grate weapon do it better with 2+ save at the same cost.

The only way i could consider fielding them is under 16 models and i dont think they are that good at those numbers.

I disagree with your opinion on them, I think Greatswords, while expensive, can work well in groups of 30-40. Their expensive, but they very rarely fail me in games. I don't play competitions, so I can't vouch for their viability there, but in competitive-casual games they work well.

I will agree that they probably aren't worth using in groups less than 20, but their stubborn and ability to make detachments stubborn even if they are not steadfast in combat is pretty good. Overall I don't think they are a "must-have" choice, but I love mine and couldn't imagine not bringing them.
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Offline xxvaderxx

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #23 on: June 02, 2013, 11:18:50 PM »
I disagree with your opinion on them, I think Greatswords, while expensive, can work well in groups of 30-40. Their expensive, but they very rarely fail me in games. I don't play competitions, so I can't vouch for their viability there, but in competitive-casual games they work well.

A unit that size i would consider it hit and miss really, if your opponent does not have the tools to deal with hordes, then they can do some serious damage, on the other hand if he does, does 400+ points will be going away real fast. That is why i like halberiders or spearmen hordes better, while less combat proficient they are more expendable.
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Offline warhammerlord_soth

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Re: Starting a New Empire army
« Reply #24 on: June 03, 2013, 07:07:41 AM »
Knights !


Masses of them.
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