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Author Topic: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)  (Read 2875 times)

Offline Mortim

  • Posts: 318
Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« on: September 01, 2013, 07:35:49 PM »
Hi,

I just finsihed the tourney this weekend. 123 players with many ETC veterans  and tough armies with a score of 9 out of 16 in the comp system. I had only played 2 games in last 6 years and I had only old models at my disposal. It was going to get tough!

I asked here on the forums about which ranking I would get, and I got many answers between Place 60 and 120, most of the bets being around the bottom of the list...

My list comp 13 (which was a crappy list according to the comp system).

1 Arch lector on Altar, hvy, enc shield, opal amulet
1 General on Griffin, charmed shield, dragonbane, sword of might, ironcurse Icon
1 Capatsus Bsb, Lance, dawnstone, OTS, shield, fpa, dragonhelm
1 Death wizard, lvl2, ruby ring
1 Heavens wizard, scroll

20 halberdiers
10 handgunners
5 Archers det
10 crossbowmen
5 Archer det

5 Knights banner of eternal flame
5 IC kights
5 Reiksgard Knights
5 Outriders

10 greatswords
10 flagellants
1 great cannon
1 Steamtank

11 deployment drops.

So, I Went MSU empire with 11 drops (crucial) I planned to fight like Wood elves with empire clothing.


Game 1 vs High Elf comp 11

He had an all mounted list with 5 scouts

1 Star Dragonlord
1 Bsb (2+ vs magic banner) in dragon princes
1 level 2 with princes
1 level 2 with princes

12 Silver helms
8 Dragon princes
10 Reavers
5 reavers
5 Reavers

2 eagles
1 Frost Phoenix
6 bs 5 scouts
maybe something else


I deployed in my typical fashion, trying to mask my plan and trying to confuse my opponent by deploying odd stuff in an odd order. He had a hard time to know where I would put the Hammer (my most expensive units stank+chars). I deployed all my expensive stuff after he was done, opposite corner from his dragon lord and Phoenix to buy me some time.

He got first turn. I Think he thought my list was absolute cakewalk so he basicaly moved Everything forward max range more or less in a typical HE disdain. This was actualy was going to cost him the initiative i a way.

I had a nice flank charge with my 20 halberdiers + possible altar in front and/or  griffon in front at his dragon princes with 3 chars.. He rightfully opted to flee and escaped , I redirected my valiant "HalberStar" (as i liked to call them ironicaly) at his silver helms, he chose to hold and my halberdstar was now engaged in a grind fight with decent odds. Even my crossbowmen charged both eagles to lock them up, bypassing the frostphoenixs charge arc doing so. My Archers and other units decided to march forward past his units to avoid their charge arcs or move back, just to buy time by denying them any turn 2 charges. I fired cannon+ Stank (shooting some bs shooting first to get the charmed shield) at his DragonLord, managed to kill the rider and wounding that dragon abit (I Think he had 7 wounds or so).

Now his princes where fleeing, his eagles and silver helms were locked in fights he didnt see coming and his reavers where weakened by magic or simply out of range or charge arc to do anything, Even hsi Frostbird was unable to find any good target. With loss of his Dragonlord i Think he started to play more cautiously and I Think that spelled his doom. He didnt go all in at that Point and started hiding the Frostbird from cannons and Went chasing some of unimportant units. He rallied princes but they were still in a bad dangerous position.

The rest of the game was me charging his Dragon princes with multiple units (he had to flee every time or get rolled over from all sides) while his dragon and Phoenix didnt get much done (they killed my valiant crossbowmen and Archers). With the dragon+birdie killing some of my crappy units and his princes fleeing or retreating, I had time to take care of the mutiple reavers.

Win 14-6, he killed 235 (10 greatswords, 10 crossbowmen, 5 Archers), I killed 1000 or so!

Aftermath: he got outdeployed, but more importantly he got too Confident and didnt expect me to countercharge/lock his units to allow me to pick apart some of his more dangerous units. He also started to play cautiously after the loss of the Lord (on the dragon) chasing my crappy units instead of going all out and roll over my more valuable units.


Game 2 vs Lizardmen comp 11

1 Slann
1 Special character (dunno, great weapon charcater god in challenges he said)
1 saurus char with shield
1 more saurus char

25 saurus
25 saurus
12 skinks
12 skinks
12 chameleons

20 skinks with 3 krox
1 Salamander
3 terradons
3 terradons

Early turns:

I was worried about the 2 saurus blocks with multiple characters, so I opted to win this game in the deployment phase (like deploying stuff that would make him Think I would castle in a spot like many empire players do). He had to drop both big saurus blocks Before I had to commit my last 1500 pts , lets call that the "Hammer"(read steam tank, my 1k characters, cannon and other stuff). I baited him with some units in both corners, making it hard for him to know where I would put the bulk of my Points.

I opted for weighted flank with the Hammer on the left supported by some Knights facing skinks+ chameleons+ terradons while the far left was held by greatswords and some Knights vs skinks+ both saurus blcoks with all his chars. In the middle I had flagellants, all my Bs shooters and reiksgard on the board edge just waiting to shoot and countercharge if needed.

He took first turn, advance skinks+terradons+ chameleons, shots some units but nothing too bad realy. Realising he got outdeployed he had to start moving his Saurus blocks the long diagonal way to maybe reach my Hammer in later turns.

He got a bit too Close with 1 unit of terradons and i charged with my crossbowmen (he didnt expect me to charge lol) and I got 1 unit locked in combat while I shot the other. Because his big blocks of saurus where so far away I felt Confident to push my central reiksgard straight at the chamelons skinks for a good turn 2 charge which would be hard to escape.

In turn 2 he marched the saurus some more and shot some Knights with skinks on my right (god skinks shoot well, my 5 Knights were down to 3). crossbowmen won vs terradons, pursued (failed to Catch) but were in good position for a turn 2 charge on the chamelons. I charged the crossbowmen+archer+reiksgard in chamelons and wiped them out quickly pushing Deep into the Lizardmen side of the board. The other small Knights cheagred the skinks but only 1 unit made it, the other got shot to pieces wih stand shoot!

Turn 3 he still couldnt do anything useful with the saurus blocks so he had to tackle my army with salamander+ skinkkrox unit+ some odd magic. I combo charged the krox unit with Altar+ Reiksgard+Archers and outrdiers in flank lol (he wasnt expecting the outriders to flank charge them!). Krox unit got realy beat up which allowed me to Catch them and consolidate. Still those saurus units where too far away. Turn 4 to the end was uneventfull. I retreated while killing Everything possible except the 2 saurus blocks and his characters.

Result 14-6! He killed 235 pts of my army and I killed 850 or so.

Aftermath: That game was actualy won in the deployment phase


Game 3 vs Bretonnia comp 15, ETC 5 years Captain and Veteran!

After 2 wins, I knew I was bound by the pairing system to face some realy good players, and ofc I had to play against one of the most experienced players in the tourney with my nemesis, a MSU bretonnian list. Furhtermore the scenario was a modified blood and glory (i had only my general + bsb + 1 banner vs 6 banners+bsb+ his general) making the odds realy bad for me. And finaly to add bad to worse, my opponent is a ETC Captain with many years of experience at high level.... God I would have to realy do something extraordinary to even get any Points here.

His list

1 Level 4
1 Lord with heroic killing blow (I found out later, he was eyeballing my stank)
1 bsb
1 Captasus

8 or so Grail Knight with +d6" charge (I found out the hard way)
4x6 KotR
1x8 KotR
5 Fast cav
1 Trebuchet
4 Peg knights
maybe something else, probably more small Knight units


So this was going to be tough, in a bad scenario for me vs so many small and faster but better units....

He prayed , I had deployed my 3 Knights units spread evenly across the board as Close as I could to try to stall his small units from gainnig ground by doing the face off game keeping distance while the rest of my lines basicaly hugged the board edge. He was abit too cautious while advancing giving me time to Cannonball the treb. He also didnt scroll a well aimed spirit leech at his general (ld9 vs 9) which he rolled 1 and I got 6... ending in 5 wounds of which he didt pass enough ward saves... (he realy got mad at himself for not scrolling that one). Which actualy meant he couldnt KB my stank and also gave me a small chance to actually have a chance in the blood and glory part of the scenario.

Then he suprised me with a 27" inch charge at my Altar with his Grail Knights+bsb (they had 2 banners with lots of movement bonuses) which got my altar and lord killed /runned down! 1-1 in lord kills in turn 2 lol. Luckily I had my stank nearby so I charged the grailknights did some wounds and locked them there which allowed my Griffin general time to join in and finsih them off.

The rest of the game was a serie off cat and mouse game with us trading Knights units vs my Knights+flags+greatswords. He landed a couple of devastating Comets that killed my wizards, cannons. In the end it was a bloody mess tha resulted in both of us having lost most of our standards/general etc so both got the B.Gory bonus Points of the secnario!
A big crowed of players gathered around our table and most of them couldnt understand I was able to give the ETC captain a run for his money! It was a very intense and challeninging game, and with the crowd around it felt like some kind of finals game!

End Result  Draw 10-10 we killed 1850 Points each.

Aftermath: This was my second game only vs Bretonnia ever vs one very experienced army commander with my subpar empire list in a very difficult secnario for me... I had to pull my hair off to do Everything possible vs an army that denied my only advantage, to play the MSU game. I couldnt even outdeploy him effectively... I Think this was one of my best game ever tbh.

I was exausted after this first day. We Went for a beer + chinese food. I was absolutely dead and Went to bed early like 21.00 with 2 wins and 1 draw, exausted but undefeated!


Game 4 vs Daemons, Another ETC veteran and top 5 ranked players in Sweden.

So lol, I had 2 wins, 1 draw vs 1 realy good player.... I was 100% to get Another realy tough opponent... and yes I did! An ETC hero with many tournament wins at his belt playing Daemons Nurgle flavour.

His List

Great Unclean One level 2
1 BSb with Death snipe
1 Level 2 metal+ tzeentch combo i Think or maybe it was the tzeentch horrors that casted tzenthc spells dunno

20 horrors
30 plaguebearers
3 Drones
4 Nurgle beast of doom
10 furies
1 Khornecannon thing
8 Flamers
2 nurglings scouts
maybe something else, not sure.

Scenario was giving bonus Points in turn 3 and 6 to hold objectives... Looking at his army I had no chance in hell to even try to hold these. I managed to do my deployement tricks, and he Place the Greater unclean toprotect his Cannon and flank at first. So I deployed all my expensive stuff as far as I could while the rest of my army hugged the edges (proved absolutely game changing, but I didnt know why untill his magic phases).

I took first turn killed a couple of drones and started working on flamers with all I got (shooting on 8+ anything + any magic that could make it). I also Placed my wizard+cannons + Stank in a perfect Cannon bait (So he would be tempted to aim at all 3 with his khorne cannon). He took the bait, the shot bypassed my stank and cannon and landed perfect on my heavens wiz... she died, not as planned... (I was hoping the shot would land on stank which would mean it wouldnt Bounce any further since the stank cant die from d6 wounds). I returned fire at the cannon butdid only a couple of wounds back with 2 Cannonball hits.

The middle turns was him trying to get any meaningfull combat while his Great unclean had to go the long diagonal road (abondoning the cannon) and me starting to encircle the plaguebearers with 2x5 Knights + Griffin + Altar + Captasus. I had no intention to fight them , but I wanted to make it look like it so he had to be cautious with them , effectively paralysing them. His more dangerous units like plague beast had been out deployed and oly reached some of my non important units (greatswords I had dpeloyed in middle on edge).

Oh yeah, I learned soemthing new, daemons get to roll on some crazy table that affected all my units on a 6 roll, placing templates that could potentialy decimate my MSU army. They hurted me abit, but most of the time since my army was spread out and hugging edges, most scattered without totaly wiping my units or lone charcaters... Phew...! I managed to spirit Leach his bsb which was nice!

In the end, I combo charged a few units that I was sure I could overrun to get past his charge arcs grabbing a few Points here and there.

Result 12-8 he killed 400 pts or so while I got maybe 1000 or so Points.

Aftermath: This game looked realy bad for me on paper, especialy vs a ETC hero like him, but here again my many deployement choices meant I could somewhat outdpeloy him and avoid his greater unclean one and beasts of nurgle most of the game (they killed only 10 greatswords and 5 vanilla Knights) which gave me time to kill a few of his units and still the win. Daemons looks like a fun army and powerfull army to play too. Are they considered OP btw?


Game 5, final game vs HE infantry list, Another ETC veteran

His list

1 Loremaster
1 Lv4 Shadow mindrazor etc
1 bsb with antimagic banner on 2+

30 White Lions
25 Phoenix guard with razor banner
20 Sisters i Think (spearmen that had bows)
20 Archers
5 Reavers
1 Eagle
2 RBT
maybe something else not sure.

Okay, this list was going to be tough for me to get any Points, since I have more or less nothing that could engage his blocks. On the plus side, his army was infantry based and compact which meant I could outdeploy him, which I did  :-D

I Went for split up on both sides leaving only my bs shooters+ greatswords hugging the edge in the center while he deployed a perfect infantry battle line. He had to abandon 1 RBT in a corner (to get his units moving the long way to my corner where I had all my expensive stuff) vs my 5 nilla Knights + 20 halberdiers (I wasnt going to feed my halberds to his elite infantry anyway so I might aswell walk the long way to a RBT to help the knights).

He took 1 st turn, shot a few Knights and got unlucky miscating dead his loremaster turn 1 (wita some template casualities in his inf). This was more or less going to cost him the game since it meant he had "only shadow lore" left, which is absolutely worthless vs a MSU army like mine since there is no Point debuffing my 90-120 pt units or mindrazoring to kill my units. He needed lots of magic missiles more than anything.

I danced around him, redirecting, double fleeing you name it, anything to make sure none of his big blocks could Catch anything meaningfull. My bs shooters in the middle board egde had a field day shooting all his units passing past them at short range since his somewhat slow infantry elites couldnt afford to waste turns killing them (had he had the loremasters alive he could have zapped them). My greatswords managed to flank charge his eagle and get a good flank charge later vs his sisters and crushed them with lucky rolls (sisters 3 wide, I rolled 7 wounds+ charge+ flank vs 1 wound + flag and he lost steadfast since I had whittled down that unit prior to the charge)

His White lions had the longest walk and got abit unlucky with a couple of failed charge at my stank that was locked in combat with Phoenix guards. When the White lion horde (down to maybe 13-15 models by now, since all my shooters had a free turkey shoot) finaly reached my stank, they also exposed themselves to a most devastating flank charge by Griffin+Altar+ Captasus doing enough wounds to wipe them out. I also killed the bsb netting me more Points.

Result 17-3

Aftermath: my opponent had some realy bad luck (crucial failed charge in a infantry army, bad miscasts on 2-3 Dice spells....aswell which realy made Everything so much easier for me. His army also suffered from having too few and slow units to counter my evasive MSU army- With a bit better luck for him this could maybe have been a draw or a small victory for me. Anyway he took it okay, but its not very fun for me or for him when the Dice rolls are like that.

Also him playing an infantry army meant time was against him vs an army like mine, he had to keep pushing to try to get any Points and allowing my crappy units to whittle him down without hinderance... (I had charged my reiksgard at his Archer unit to keep them busy most game, and my greatswords to keep those sisters busy while my cannons+ chaffs killed the RBTs)


Final result... Drumroll......

Place 17 out 120+ players!!! 4 wins 1 Draw, still undefeated!

It felt realy nice to make such a comeback with so few games played vs top players in the 3 final games!!!!

MSU empire actualy works nice, It made it realy hard for my opponents to Catch any meaningfull Points since most of their armies are built to deal with Deathstars and not a horde of chaffs.

On the minus side, MSU army meant I had a realy hard time myself to Win big at all since none of my units can kill anything by itself, which requires enormous coordination and luck to achieve anything decisive.

I Think my next army will try to fit in 1-2 medium unit (demis or something) that can push abit more unsupported to achive bigger wins.

Also, 2 levels 2s + lots of bound spells IS a realy powerfull magic phase and is very safe aswell (both heavens and spirit Leach spam dont need many Dice). I dont miss a level 4 at all, and I realy Think the lv4 is overated and is a very risky and miscasty strategy in a tourney setting. IMO and from what Ive seen from my opponents, a lv 4 by himself is not enough, it should be lv 4 + lv2 to allow flexible spell combos. Only going for the Spells of doom on a level 4 and six dicing it, at least vs a MSU army like mine proved more risky to the caster than to my army of empire chaffs!


Cheers,

Mortim
« Last Edit: September 02, 2013, 02:39:59 PM by Mortim »

Offline madeinitaly1

  • Posts: 123
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2013, 11:25:43 PM »
well i read the armylist and battle report here but it looks terribly weird to me :D i mean if u really haven't played for so long, used such a weird list, and won 4 games in such an hard tournament you have my respect  :biggriin:

Offline DerBaron

  • Posts: 95
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2013, 10:37:23 AM »
 :eusa_clap:

Very well done! Though I didn't read the reports yet, I'd say you'd be quite deadly with a bit more competitive list.. or maybe your playstyle just fits perfectly into your list :)

Offline Sixplus

  • Posts: 171
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #3 on: September 02, 2013, 11:27:44 AM »
 :eusa_clap: well done you definitely proved my guess wrong. You clearly must have read up on alot of the new books, only having played 2 games in 6 years im surprised you were up to date with all the 8th ed rule changes and new army books and units out there now days. To beat ETC players with 2 games under your belt is very impressive.

Offline Fandir Nightshade

  • Posts: 10067
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #4 on: September 02, 2013, 11:33:59 AM »
Congrats...well done!

This is what warhammer is supposed to be about.

Offline Lord Solar Plexus

  • Posts: 3212
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #5 on: September 02, 2013, 12:36:01 PM »
Truly awesome. I don't think I could have pulled that off! Chapeau!  :icon_wink:
Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress; but I repeat myself. - S. Clemens

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www.rheinerftliga.haarrrgh.de

Offline Mortim

  • Posts: 318
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #6 on: September 02, 2013, 01:51:51 PM »
Thanks alot guys, I thought about you this weekend and realy tried to do my best as a community thing (thinking I ll represent our forum there).

I didnt do anything awsome or any genius move, I just spent most of my effort in the deployment phase (with 11 drops thats was my best asset), making sure I would avoid anything  Big and nasty like deathstars and such.

Their armies are built to deal with other deathstars and collect big points on 1-2 big combats boosted by big magic... their armies were not built at all to try collect points vs 15-19 units scattered all over the board... (my units are worth between 35 and 135 pts, except what I call the hammer Altar+ stank+flying chars which can either escape or just survive 1-2 rounds of close combat till the game ends). And all the uber lv4 with dwellers, pits of shades, purple sun etc realy take more risk trying to kill my 100pt units with 6 dice than me losing a few guys here and there. The smart players didnt even cast those spells vs me!

I also deployed like I would get the second turn in every game. Meaning all my units on my board edge, except sometimes a few knights 12" to deny their advance a bit. My stank, and Altar and flying chars deployed in a corner opposite to their most expensive stuff, meaning it was like 48" to their deathstars lol.

Actualy fighting realy good players realy helped me, simply because those guys dont want to win small, they will try anything to get 20-0 simply because getting a 12-8 isnt enough for them to get first to fifth place. That way those guys usualy went ALL IN in turn 3-4 when they realized this was going to be a draw at best for them. They offered so many things on "silver plates" thinking my crappy units wont be able to kill them... so the draw simply turned to small victories in my favor when they took more risks. I played their greed as my best weapon and time was on my side... Also I think vanity played a part also. I mean how could a couple of ETC Captains/Hero with good lists Lose vs my empire list right?

So in the end, I managed to do well in the deployment phase, the rest was more me with low expectations playing their vanity, greed and the time and competition factor. I am doing good at having an overall strategy on how I want the game to evolve but I lack seriously (due to 8th ed inexperience) on a tactical level on how to make small wins Big.

I used to play alot of tournaments before in 5th-6th ed, like 2-4 per year and most of that experience served me well even if i lacked experience in 8th ed.

Cheers, sorry for all the misspelling, I was so tired yesterday, but I wanted to type it all before I would forget.

/Mortim

« Last Edit: September 02, 2013, 02:44:07 PM by Mortim »

Offline sammay23

  • Posts: 888
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #7 on: September 02, 2013, 06:22:13 PM »
Congrats, Mortim! Love seeing the MSU list confounding foes with big blocks.

I agree with your sentiment that it's hard to win big with MSU against those death-star-like units, but I'd argue that the games are much more fun because, instead of crashing your buffed deathstar into your opponent's you are thinking from deployment on about avoidance and maximizing force.

You stated that you didn't do anything genius, and I suppose that may be true, but I've found it very challenging to consistently remain mindful of all the charge ranges, double flees, etc. I see it as tantamount to a game of chess, where you and your opponent should be thinking three turns ahead. Lots to keep in mind! Hence, perhaps, your exhaustion. Consistently thinking that hard is something that a lot of players don't do. Consistently executing well on all fronts is very challenging.

Nice work, and way to show off the MSU approach!

I'd like to hear more about your opinion of the General on Griffon. How'd it play for you? You didn't play against any opponents with powerful ranged abilities, but I'm interested to hear your thoughts on the usefulness and viability of the griffon.

cheers,

Sam
Bring out the mop and broom sammay.  I want to see you clean this house.

Offline Mortim

  • Posts: 318
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #8 on: September 02, 2013, 08:57:15 PM »
Thanks guys, and Sammay I ll tell you about the griffon!

Game 1 vs HE Star dragon+frost birdie+all mounted:

Griffon+Pegasus+small Knights surrounded the constantly fleeing DPrinces with 3 chars in them. Sadly the game ended in turn 3 or 4 so I never had time to cathc them. Too bad I had a chance there to get a 17-3 or maybe even 20-0 as the HE player only killed 235 pts in return.

Griffon guy served as a threat more than anything. The HE didnt have much shooting and his mages where fleeing/ralying/fleeing all game. the Griffon guy could have been Another Pegasus in that game.


Game 2 vs Lizardmen

Griffon guy served as area denial quite well. I moved him around with Pegasus bsb which had OTS. He didnt see any meaningfull combat, he could have been Another capatsus here aswell as I had no intention to charge any big saurus block with 2 Saurus chars + 1 special saurus char.


Game 3 vs Bretonia

Here he actualy saved me the game as I had realy no clue of what to expect in terms of nasty magic item combos the bret could have. I got caught off guard by the nasty 27" charge from the grail Knight with bsb etc into my Altar. Griffon guy+Steam dragon (tank) managed to Clean up the grail Knight unit (10 guys including charcaters) in 2 CC phases which was Quick enough for me to recover from having that big Lance unit where I dindt want to (in my lines on the board edge). After that the griffon guy started to chase the Damsel lv4 unit around who had not a good heavens spell selection to deal with my griffon so they had to keep away, and in so doing couldn't get any good spells off to affect the battle in the brets favor. So Griffon guy contributed in my effort to get that draw vs the ETC captain. Here Another captasus wouldnt have made the same impact maybe 2 would have for the same Points.

Game 4 vs Demons

Griffon guy helped med push hard on one flank as the ETC demon player had some infantry (horrors, flamers) that had no intention of facing a Griffon and my Captasus bsb with OTS (that makes a nasty combo to reroll ward saves on thunderstomp, griffon attacks). The actual fighting the Griffon was minimal but he served as area denial/threat so my Knights and stuff could get some moving around to encircle the plaguebearers for a potential 6 turn charge form all sides. As the greater Unclean one was finaly closing in, I opted to go safe and didnt do the charge on Pbearers. I wanted to finsih off the GUO with 3 wounds left with 2 cannon shots, but we didnt get time for a 6th round sadly. Here I d say Captasus or 2 would have done same thing if tooled up nicely.

Game 5 vs HE

Griffon guy served as slowing down the Big HE blocks by going on their flank or rear (mostly their flank as I prefer to charge the flank= less return attack). The HE blocks had to slow down their march to my lines or risk getting triple charged from Griffon+Pegasus+ALtar from Flank (btw I found all 3 fit nicely corner to corner vs most infantry). I had to kill those RBT realy Quick and occupy the 20 or so Archers with stubbron reiksguard and greatswords into flank of sisters to allow manouver and freedom of movement for the griffon.

It was more of combined effort but it worked nicely:
Stubborn guys in the shooters, with bsbcaptasus in reroll range, Griffon guy also nearby looking menacingly at the HE hordes flank.

Griffon guys final charge killed 9 White lions in 1 CC phase which was exactly enough wounds to finish of the WLions and get their Points+banner which contributed in 17-3 instead of maybe only 12-8. My AL accepted the challenge from the WL champion so the Griffon could just go nuts on the unit. Again this was a combined effort. In that particular situation Griffon guys many attacks and thunderstomp was probably Worth more than 2-3 captasus.


Griffon guy never even got to use his charmed shield, or even ironcurse. In fact he got only target once by some demon flamers. Griffon guy never died in 5 games, but thats probably because I played him as countercharge/threat more than anything else (Area denial/Point conservation/multicharge threat). I had great fun with him and since he never died/got targeted I had a nice time moving him around looking great seeing him making enemy units turn towards him to avoid getting flanked/rear/combo charged.

He turned around 2 games out of 5, which isnt a great value for Money but was nice enough for me that I never felt i would have liked to have a level 4 instead for the Points or a GM. More Captasus would have been a better choice for sure with similar results but I d lose abit of the fun factor and uniqueness. Also I like being the underdog/dark horse/go against the interwebwizdoms  :icon_biggrin:

I didnt face much artillery, but the warmachines I faced all targeted my cannon/steamtank. I guess ppl Think the griffon is sooo bad , it isnt Worth bothering with him!

I could see the Griffon work in a more aggressive army to add some Power to a Flank charge, and only a flank charge (as it minimise the attacks back on the griffon, and especialy in a corner to corner flank charge so only 1 guy can strike the griffon) vs an infantry unit. That flank charge would require Another flyer or fast hero capable of accepting (and surviving) the challenge so the Griffon can go to Town with thunderstomp. In the game vs HE I had a nice triple charge vs the Phoenix guard but i roled 3,1,1 and 2,1,1 and 4,2,1 for my altar/griffon/captasus.... in the flank of those Phoenix guards... I would have loved to seem them reroll those 4+ wards due to OTS (captasus in middle of the flank covering all bases with OTS) so the Altar impact hits and Griffon thunderstomp could turn those haughty Phoenix 4+ ward save into a lesser 5+ ward. I tried again abit later, but vs those White lions which sealed the deal.

I have to try some more with the griffon, but what scared me mostly was medium/big Archer units to whom the griffon is the best target in my army. That limited my griffons freedom of movement alot. I never felt liked that with bsb captasus with 1+ and dawnstone. In that regard my 5 man reiksguard supported my Griffons advance realy well.

So far My griffon experience is more about grouping the Bsbcaptasus+the griffon+ 5 reiksguard to solve most situations.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2013, 12:22:23 PM by Mortim »

Offline sammay23

  • Posts: 888
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2013, 09:48:33 PM »
Your last sentence sums it all up for me. Any MSU list is all about combining units, so you bring enough force to bear to crunch your opponent's larger units.

Sounds like the griffon may not have been that much better than a captasus in a bunch of your situations. My list currently features four captasi, and I'm loving it.

What would you say your most potent tricks were? I notice you do a lot of double flees and other tricks I like to use. What else did you notice was particularly confounding for your opponents?
Bring out the mop and broom sammay.  I want to see you clean this house.

Offline Mortim

  • Posts: 318
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #10 on: September 05, 2013, 08:01:52 AM »
Hey Sammmay again.

Yeah the Griffon could have been 1 or 2 captasi in most games.

The best tricks I had was:

11 deployments, with more than 1300 pts to be placed at drop 10 and 11 (all chars+steamtank). I placed all of that in same spot opposite to weak opposition and making sure to be asfar as possible from deathstars, wizardlords etc...so my opponent had to come to me to get those points (and they come to me since in a tourney they all try to win BIG) . This meant in turn that all my opponents tried to reinforce their weak flank with all the fast stuff they had, that had been "out deployed". Those fast stuff had to come piecemeal vs my 1500pts in my corner and fight at very bad odds. The best part was that I wanted to kill the fast stuff anyway, and those came unsupported and piecemeal vs my best killers (chars and stank).

I pretty much won all games due to this strategy. This strategy dont work vs opponents that dont try to win/place high in the tourney. But it worked great vs top players that want to win big.

Other tricks was paralyzing enemy units by encircling them, just pretending I would flank+rear+front charge. That gave me lots of time to shoot (I shot 2 cannons per turn in all 5 games for 6 turns, and most of my bs shooters could shoot all game long simply because my enemies had to ignore them to try to get my Big points while time was running out for them due to my deployment strategy) and zapping (this army has Banishment+Ruby ring+spririt leech, occasional comet and lots of nasty buffs from lector+ and debuffs iceshard and occasional doom and darkness etc).

You know when you have 2x90pts of hand gunners/crossbowmen shooting all game long killing 3-6 white lions per turn sometimes at short range simply because time is running out for them and they cant afford to turn around and kill those shooters... you simply have a great time!

My typical deployment looked like this (they all hugg my board edge)

the first 8 units worth 750 points lol which is often enough to force all my opponents units to be on the table.

Knights flaggelants...............archers...handgunners...Reiksgard. outriders... Crossbowmen... archers.......greatswords.... knights.


Then I deployed the rest of my army (1750pts) after they were done. In a meta where deathstar vs deathstar and lv4 of doom vs lv4 of doom is what the game is about, I dindt need to do anything super fancy to win my games. their army were like lone elephants chasing my mosquitoes and getting rammed by rhino after my mosquitoes wekeaned them(stank + chars).





Offline sammay23

  • Posts: 888
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #11 on: September 05, 2013, 09:41:39 PM »
I love it! And it sounds like you had an excellent time, too :)

Any chance you remember any of the battles (particularly the Brets one) well enough to put them into Battle Chronicler? We need more reports that are focused on movement and diversion to help others learn this stuff.
Bring out the mop and broom sammay.  I want to see you clean this house.

Offline Mortim

  • Posts: 318
Re: Tourney Reports (continued from make your bets army list)
« Reply #12 on: September 06, 2013, 07:36:29 AM »
Hi, yeah I remember most of the bret battle, but i have never used the battle chronicer before. I can give it a try this weekend!