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Author Topic: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition  (Read 9171 times)

Offline Oxycutor

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Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« on: May 24, 2017, 04:04:23 PM »
Cubicle 7 have announced they are doing a new edition of WFRP in the in Old World

http://cubicle7.co.uk/

I know there will be plenty of people on this forum who will be interested, if not delighted to hear this

Offline Karl Voss of Averland

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2017, 04:23:34 PM »
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Offline Oxycutor

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2017, 04:27:53 PM »
Not much info at the moment.

They've said they will be at Warhammer Fest this weekend,and i'm going, so i'll track them down and see what I can find out, and give them my opinions as a long time player/GM

Offline wissenlander

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2017, 04:41:02 PM »
No AoS is good for me. 

I've heard that a lot of folks seem to like 1st and 2nd edition over 3rd.  Is 3rd even worth it?
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Offline Oxycutor

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2017, 05:40:28 PM »
3rd got bogged down with custom dice and cards and tokens, like a board game.  Too much stuff on the tabletop.

It did have some good things, like a party cohesion thing, and some great artwork throughout, and some pretty good stories, but I didn't like they system that much. 

I converted the few stories I did try to 2nd ed, which was my favourite version of the game.

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #5 on: May 24, 2017, 06:09:13 PM »
I love 1st. You can do anything with it by just GMing well. I tried 2nd but just got slowed down trying to keep the new rules in mind. First ed all the way for me - chuck in extra modifiers based on what the players describe, common sense and a feel for the setting and it's a great system. Anything you don't like, perhaps careers, modify that too. GM tastic!
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Offline Zygmund

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #6 on: May 24, 2017, 11:12:39 PM »
Now this is interesting! Never played the actual game, but I really liked the thorough background in the 2nd ed books.

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Offline ZeroTwentythree

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2017, 03:47:14 AM »
I love 1st. You can do anything with it by just GMing well. I tried 2nd but just got slowed down trying to keep the new rules in mind. First ed all the way for me - chuck in extra modifiers based on what the players describe, common sense and a feel for the setting and it's a great system. Anything you don't like, perhaps careers, modify that too. GM tastic!

WFRP1 is one of my favorite RPGs to play or GM, though it's been ages since I've done either. I think the careers take a bit of work from both the GM and players (and open minded players,  for that matter) but can be a creative force in the game. Otherwise, it's a beautifully straightforward system. Plus the oldschool Warhammer setting and resources are great.

Some friends picked up WFRP3 and showed/explained it a bit and it seemed like it was the opposite of all of the things I liked from WFRP1. Never played WFRP2, but have some of the supplements and they're great, and probably useful for any edition or just general interest for Warhammer fans.

Offline rufus sparkfire

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2017, 10:29:48 AM »
This sounds interesting. The background for 1st edition is fantastic, but the rules are a bit wonky.
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Offline Xathrodox86

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #9 on: May 25, 2017, 10:36:57 AM »
Not much info at the moment.

They've said they will be at Warhammer Fest this weekend,and i'm going, so i'll track them down and see what I can find out, and give them my opinions as a long time player/GM

3rd sucks. It was an overpiriced board game with RPG elements, moronic rules and was a test template for FFG's Shades of the Empire RPG (which was good).

I'm waiting for the 4th edition and will definetly support it on kickstarter, if such thing will be possible at all. I'm happy that it will be a spiritual successor of 1st and 2nd editions.

Here's to 4th be a huge success and a great game! :::cheers:::
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Offline Oxycutor

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2017, 10:43:21 AM »
I don't think it's likely to be a Kickstarter project.  Probably got some investment from GW

Offline Xathrodox86

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2017, 10:52:20 AM »
I don't think it's likely to be a Kickstarter project.  Probably got some investment from GW

Yeah, figures. Still, I'd love to be able to donate a small sum for that project. Good RPG's should be supported and Cubicle 7 has a history of making good RPG's.
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Offline Oxycutor

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2017, 10:54:20 AM »
I guess I'll be supporting it bu buying it on release.  i've got all but two books across all the previous editions

Offline Xathrodox86

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #13 on: May 25, 2017, 11:23:02 AM »
I guess I'll be supporting it bu buying it on release.  i've got all but two books across all the previous editions

I still have a few pieces left to collect, mainly from the 1st. They're damn hard to get tough and pretty expensive to boot.
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Offline Oxycutor

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #14 on: May 25, 2017, 11:30:32 AM »
Yeah.  I only need Dwarfs Stone and Steel from 1st.   Children of the Horned Rat and Knights of Bretonnia from 2nd

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Offline Xathrodox86

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #15 on: May 25, 2017, 11:50:38 AM »
Yeah.  I only need Dwarfs Stone and Steel from 1st.   Children of the Horned Rat and Knights of Bretonnia from 2nd

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I need Dwarfs: Stone and Steel too, as well as Marienburg: Sold down the river. There's also the Lord of Winter, an exclusive polish-made campaign for the 1st edition.

For the 2nd edition you can get Children of the Horned Rat and Knights of Bretonnia pretty easily here in Poland, but they are of course in polish language.
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Offline zak

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #16 on: May 26, 2017, 03:06:48 PM »
1st edition was my very first RPG love the game 2nd was not bad at all ...3rd is WAY to complicated almost ridicules

I would love a 4th edition that goes back to the roots  :::cheers:::
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Offline Oxycutor

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #17 on: May 27, 2017, 02:00:53 PM »
It might not be popular with some, but I'm excited to see they've also announced they are doing an AoSRPG.

The setting of the Old World was largely built by the Roleplaying game to start with, and at 4th edition the WFB game changed a fair bit and added more.   But the Empire especially comes from WFRP

AoSRPG is arguably what is needed to bring some depth to the setting.   I also hope the systems are compatible.

*edit* It says in the press release it's different systems, so I guess not compatible
« Last Edit: May 27, 2017, 02:12:03 PM by Oxycutor »

Offline Xathrodox86

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #18 on: May 29, 2017, 11:26:01 AM »
My guess is that the normal WFRP will be more like a sandbox game. In fact here are a couple of official news, concerning the future game.

"Hey everyone, here is some news I squeezed out from the guys of C7 in Warhammer Fest concerning the future of WFRP, enjoy!

-Release date is late 2017, will be a starter set, forgot to ask if it will be a kickstarter or not
-Something will be done for TEW as it is its 30 anniversary
-Lustria book(He said:'Definitly!')
-Naggaroth book(He said:' Will make sure filling the gap of no-elf related offical material)
-No reprint for the Realm of Chaos/slave of Darkness books
-Maybe reprint of other books, still up on the air
-AoS rpg will be next year after WFRP was initially released
-D100 system, nth to do with WFRP 3rd ed
-When I ask about Nippon and Cathy, he was very enthusiatic.
As he kept saying nothing is annouced at the moment and pretty close-mouthed, that's all I could get from him"
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Offline Deuce

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #19 on: May 29, 2017, 09:10:59 PM »
The difference between 1st and 2nd ed is a matter of taste, I think. 2nd ed set out to fix some of the bugs in 1st ed, and provide some much-needed streamlining for the rules. 1st ed was distributed by drip-feed over the course of about 15 years by three different manufacturers, so while there was a lot of great stuff in there it was also all over the place. Thanks to the stubbornness of the v1 grognards it was also becoming increasingly divorced from what was going on in the rest of the setting.

Unfortunately, 2nd ed introduced a number of bugs of its own. And the new setting (post-SoC) wasn't universally popular at first - and was within a few years outright abolished when GW decided to "forget" SoC had ever happened. Nevertheless, 2nd ed managed to turn out a pretty complete set of supplements in the space of 4-5 years.

Some of the books produced for both editions were fantastic. Shadows Over Bogenhafen, Death on the Reik and the two Middenheim supplements are so strong that even with two dodgy final instalments in the campaign series there are still many who would proclaim it the greatest RPG campaign ever. Sold Down the River is the stuff of legend, although personally I think it's a little overrated. For v2, Tome of Salvation is almost unimpeachably excellent. Shades of Empire is also great. If you don't feel like collegiate colour magic murdered your parents outside an opera house in your youth, Realm of Sorcery is good, and other books like the Companion, Barony of the Damned, Realm of the Ice Queen and so on are too.

3rd edition had some interesting ideas but wasn't really fit for purpose as a roleplaying game. What bothered me just as much though was that it didn't make any attempt to expand or deepen the setting. This may have been down to licensing, but in both v1 and v2 many of the books were replete with new information, speculation, added details to really build the world. They were what kept me engaged with the setting while the wargame books were becoming increasingly bland and preposterous. The 3rd ed stuff though just tends to parrot - or worse, simplify - what's in the army books and doesn't offer any new perspective or insight.

4th ed... I can't pretend I'm not interested, but GW have done a really good job at killing my investment in Warhammer as a property. I loved the Old World, and those maniacs blew it up. Enough time has passed now that I feel I've basically moved on; my attention's been drawn by other things. Going back feels a bit like climbing back into the cellar just as my eyes have adjusted to the light. So I think I'll wait a while and see what happens before getting involved with WFRP4, if I ever do at all.

Offline zak

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #20 on: May 30, 2017, 03:16:49 AM »
My guess is that the normal WFRP will be more like a sandbox game. In fact here are a couple of official news, concerning the future game.

"Hey everyone, here is some news I squeezed out from the guys of C7 in Warhammer Fest concerning the future of WFRP, enjoy!

-Release date is late 2017, will be a starter set, forgot to ask if it will be a kickstarter or not
-Something will be done for TEW as it is its 30 anniversary
-Lustria book(He said:'Definitly!')
-Naggaroth book(He said:' Will make sure filling the gap of no-elf related offical material)
-No reprint for the Realm of Chaos/slave of Darkness books
-Maybe reprint of other books, still up on the air
-AoS rpg will be next year after WFRP was initially released
-D100 system, nth to do with WFRP 3rd ed
-When I ask about Nippon and Cathy, he was very enthusiatic.
As he kept saying nothing is annouced at the moment and pretty close-mouthed, that's all I could get from him"

sweet  :::cheers:::
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Offline jtrowell

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #21 on: May 31, 2017, 11:36:48 AM »
Myself I much prefered the 3rd edition, the first 2 still used an obsolete % system that I never really liked, it was too hit or miss and with percentages your starting character had a much too important chance to fail even simple tasks unless you munchinked combos.

3rd edition use a pool dice system that is much easier to use once you are familiar with it.

True, the initial release came with a lot of stuff with it (card and token mainly), and this made many players angry.

Myself I rather liked it, FFG has always been very good with material components, and having cards with the special rules instead of having to reference a book or printing shits with the exact same information was in fact time saving, but I can understand people prefering more control.

FFG did listen to feeback about it, and later released a resion of the rule without the components but with more text (no card, but pages and pages with the corresponding powers), if they had released like that maybe some players would have liked it better (but then, by printing the information in both the book and the cards, probably some people would have complained that they had to pay for more if they wanted both)

Well, to be fair, after a certain level, the dice pool became unbalanced, a character with a lots of skill levels and a maxed attribut becoming overpowered, but this is not really different than the old system with a character with 95%+ in combat skills, but it can take years of playing to reach this point for most groups, and before that the game is much more fun for the players from my point of view.

Also for information FFG didn't stop there, they used the good ideas from WHFRP 3rd edition and improved even more with the Star Wars RPG.

One big difference is that in Star Wars the dice pools grox smaller : when in Warhammer you add the dice from your ability (Strength for exemple) with the dice from your skill (like Close Combat), in Star Wars the higher of the two value is the number of dice that you roll, and the lower value is the number of dice that you replace with a better die.

So someone with Dex 3 and melee 1 would roll a total of 3 dice, 2 default 8 sided die, and one 12 sided upgraded die

This make player progression smoother, and reduced the delta between a vertan and a beginner or average guy while still letting the veteran feel that he is much better.
Also it prevent dice pools from growing too large.

I would have liked to see FFG do a 4th edition of WHFRP using this accumulated experience, too bad that now we will never get it.

As for the news of a "new" edition still using the old % system, for me it's meh, it's the sign that they are not even trying to improve and just printing money by going after nostalgia.

Well, it's still better than to see them an AoS rpg and completly forgot the Old World I suppose ...

Offline Zygmund

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #22 on: May 31, 2017, 12:12:03 PM »
@jtrowell, thanks for this in-depth look at the differences in the systems (and Star Wars). We're playing with a home-made dice pool system that somewhat resembles what you describe for WFRP 3rd ed, which I never played. Now I maybe, after all, need to take a closer look on the 3rd ed.  :-)

I think C7 going for the classic d100 is indeed hunting for nostalgia. For these older system, nostalgia seems to be what sells these days, so I understand why commercial companies - which are paying salaries for their employees - are playing it safe. My impression is that people who want a different system will use or make a different system. But now that GW doesn't produce their books anymore, having the classic Warhammer Old World setting available on the book shelves will also serve people who do not want the d100 system.

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Offline jtrowell

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #23 on: May 31, 2017, 03:13:48 PM »
One strength of FFG system that I forgot to mention is that the dice use a double system to evaluate success and failure.

In short, you have successes/failures symbols whose total tell you if the action failed of not, and you have boons/banes symbols that tell you if something else happened to help or hinder you.

For exemple you might have failed an attack (no success left after deducing the negative symbols from the positive ones), but got a few boons symbols, allowing for a secondary effect, like maybe your attack missed but it distracted your target, iving a bonus die to the next attack on the same target by one of your allies, or giving a negative die to the next attack of your opponent.

Outside combat, boons and banes can results is things like an action taking more or less time that usual, or in your character accumulating fatigue (physical actions) or stress (mental or social) action.

Note : there are both positive and negative dice of different type, from small d6 with a small effect representing modifiers (for exemple if you are trying to climb a cliff, a bonus white die might represent having specialised climbing equipement for exemple, while a malus black die might represent bad weather or a lack of light. you might even get all of them at the same time, getting both a bonus white die and 2 malus black dice)  to bigger die where some face have multiple symbols representing things that have a greater impact (ability and skill, and negative dice representing the difficulty of the task)

That's one of the main reason why they use custom dice, believe me even ignoring all other components the dice are really worth it for this system.

Myself I have been thinking of borrowing the core dice system to make my own rpg, also taking inspiration from the Old White Wolf's World of Darkness rpgs that already had a similar dice pool philosophy.

Offline Deuce

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Re: Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 4th Edition
« Reply #24 on: May 31, 2017, 06:15:04 PM »
I think the dice pool system for WFRP3 was indeed quite interesting and probably worth another look, although I don't share the inherent distaste for d100 systems which seems to put jtrowell off.

But there were too many other gubbinz associated with the game which added nothing of any value - and moreover which drove up the price of the starter set and also limited the number of players. The decision to have the starter set cater for only GM +3 players was baffling and did the game no favours with existing RPG audiences.