Topic: It gets worse ! What is it? WTF NOW???!

[Zygmund]

The new terrain pieces have very nice and detailed components I'd love to use in my terrain kitbashes and conversions. Just that I won't buy a new box at their current prices.

The new gunman is in line with what was rumoured: the sigmarite faction has black powder weapons. Just not what you expected. Someone thought that was a Grey Knight Psycannon. Nothing to do with Warhammer as we knew it.

Warhammer: Age of Sigmar doesn't even pretend to be old Warhammer. There's the name, yes, but neither does the present Final Fantasy have much to do with older games with the same name. Fans of the old need not be taken back by the new. Instead, just stop following their updates and commenting on the new stuff & new prices. Instead, use eBay and alternative manufacturers to please your aestethical and gaming needs. Don't waste your time for even thinking - in a demonstratively joyful way - of writing to GW. Use your time for productive & fun stuff, not for despair.

Unless public despair is fun to you. 

-Z

[Darknight]

Unless public despair is fun to you. 

I would urge against it even then - but, then again, I'm not the kind of guy who says "Do what thou wilt" ...

Stormcast don't have blackpowder, as I understand it - that is some kind of "Heaven Energy Weapon" thing. It fires lightning bolts. They are, after all, magical lightning warriors.

[mr chumley warner]

Hi Dark , I appreciate much o the older sculpts were less than ideal, in the 80's , but there were so many gems.

Just look at Marauder range in 1987, amazing.

These AOS models are categorically obscure.

I could agree however, that if GW released a separate game , nothing related to WHFB, and called it ''Age of Gods'' or something like that , it might make sense ,

[Zygmund]

I could agree however, that if GW released a separate game , nothing related to WHFB, and called it ''Age of Gods'' or something like that , it might make sense ,

So, you're basically annoyed by the thought of you telling that you play Warhammer (FB), and someone confusing that to Warhammer (AoS)? It's like you say you're playing RPGs (tabletop), and someone confuses that to RPGs (MMORPG)? 

For my part, I hate it that MMORPGs incorporate the words role-playing, and that they are so well supported and so much in vogue, because I have hard time explaining people my niche hobby of role-playing (immersive tabletop or freeform), and I see the market filled with new stuff for MMORPGs, but have to do my own stuff from scratch to achieve the feeling and standard I crave from my role-playing. I whine every time some company publishes a patch or addition to their MMORPG, because its obviously not my beloved role-playing. 

I'm. so. en. raged.!!! WTF NOW???! 


Come on, did you loose something when WH: AoS and its new figures and terrain came out? Does it change something in your life and hobby? Were you so depending on GW for your hobby, your life?

It surely doesn't look like that when seeing your hunt for OOP minis, your great painting and playing the game you do have the books for. 

BTW, did you know the sculptors who sculpted most of the stuff you like are still alive and kicking? Kev Adams, the Perry brothers, they are many, and they are doing similar style sculpts for other companies or for their own, without the emblems or price tags of GW.

I suggest everyone to follow the creative people and their style of products, not a company and its IP. 

-Z

[mr chumley warner]

Hi Z,

I have to disagree with you entirely.

GW has been hijacked.

WHFB should have gone on to 9th edition and beyond.

No one is now going to take it forward.

It's an institution, and a dam finely evolved game.

Of course we are upset with it.

[Zygmund]

You're putting on a good show! 

GW has been hijacked.
By a market principle that has been clear for 10 years. It didn't happen yesterday.

WHFB should have gone on to 9th edition and beyond. No one is now going to take it forward.
But maybe we, who love it?

It's an institution, and a dam finely evolved game.
I fully agree. That's why I think I'll play it also in the future.

Of course we are upset with it.
You're upset with GW, not with the game.
And you're upset with your own expectations.

Any time. 

-Z

[Xathrodox86]

AoS fluff would be decent if it would not be connected (and being an heir of sorts) to WFB. As a standalone, spin-off game it would be... average. I mean, the rules are atrocious, but the fluff can be passable. As a direct descendant of WFB it's a mess. Also they've blew up the Old World and I'm kinda upset about that.

So... we are upset just because this is the replacement to the Empire?

As it stands, the background is better than WFB was at this stage in its release (as in, there is some of it).

Are you actually saying that a poor-man's 40K knock off has a better background that one of the most original and inspiring fantasy settings ever made?

Also no, I'm not upset because of the Empire. I'm upset because they've blew up the entire thing and replaced it with... this thing.

[mr chumley warner]

There seem to be people on this forum defending AOS.

They must know something I don't.

==================================

If GW had announced they would scrap WHFB and replace with a Space Sigmarine Heman game for 3 year olds, then I assume you guys would have also defended such an announcement?

 

[The Real Rick Salamone]

You belong on the EEFL forum...


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[mr chumley warner]

You belong on the EEFL forum...


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Why?

I thought this was Warhammer Empire..

AOS is neither warhammer or empire,

[The Real Rick Salamone]

I have read all of your concerns and I agree with them 100% sir. I am with a large group of like-minded gamers but our response isn't one of frustration and despair (it started there though). Now we are proud custodians of an abandoned but beloved game system.


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[Lord_Crom]

There seem to be people on this forum defending AOS.

They must know something I don't.

==================================

If GW had announced they would scrap WHFB and replace with a Space Sigmarine Heman game for 3 year olds, then I assume you guys would have also defended such an announcement?

 

I like playing AoS as I think it is a fun game. I used to play warhammer fantasy battle but things move on (or not if you continue to play 8th). The fluff around AoS is a little disjointed but it will flesh out in later editions. I really like the speed at which the new game can be played at and I have even managed to find tactics to be used within the game. They are more risk reward base tactics than positioning like the old game but the old game used to take too long.

I have even started designing my own scenarios for AoS which are pretty easy to do based on the format in the book. So far I have a sea battle scenario and an assignation one. I don't really understand the need to blast the game, if you aren't going to play it then that is that, complaining about it really isn't going to make GW listen. I did understand the initial upset but AoS is here and they are releasing regularly unlike what they used to do with fantasy battle.

Anyway, that is my somewhat garbled opinion. 

[mottdon]

I totally agree with Rick.  You need to be on the EEFL forum.  That sounds like the place for you.  Because of that forum, I don't feel as though I've been left behind with a system that nobody plays anymore.  8th Edition is alive and well there.  I will continue to come here and contribute, too, but I also want 8th edition to still thrive, so I support it. 

They are also making rules and play testing for the new sculpts that come out so that you can play with them in 8th edition, if you so choose.  Nobody (newbies) will be left out that way.  They also have veteran writers composing books for any older editions (Like Bretonnia) as well as making campaign books to keep things fresh. 

Your support is needed!   

[The Real Rick Salamone]

We'll said Don.


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[Darknight]

I thought this was Warhammer Empire..

AOS is neither warhammer or empire,

So quit talking about it, then.

Seriously. As I have said - and others have said - repeatedly; this is Warhammer Empire. AoS is neither Warhammer nor Empire. Neither is it 40K or Magic or etc. etc. - which is why those games have separate threads and fora.

You don't see people posting in the 40K fora bitching up a storm about a subjective issue which - frankly - your collection is more guilty of.

If you don't like AoS, fine. I don't expect Warhammer Empire to BE about Age of Sigmar at all - it would be nice to give it its place in the Counts Tavern, or to tag threads or something.

They must know something I don't.

They might have actually played the game. Have you?

If GW had announced they would scrap WHFB and replace with a Space Sigmarine Heman game for 3 year olds, then I assume you guys would have also defended such an announcement?

No - but, straw man! The game isn't a "He Man" game - you keep saying that, and it's absolute twaddle. The aesthetics of the Stormcasts is - when you see the models in the flesh - absolutely beautiful. It really is. The Prosectors are lovely. The guy on Dracoth is magnificent. The Khorne faction are some of the finest Chaos models I've ever seen - I am seriously considering a Chaos force merely because of them.

You don't like 'em - fine. You know what? I think the models you fawn over are ugly, missculpted monstrosities for the most part - but I don't start threads bitching about it.

Seriously - let it go. This is Warhammer Empire. Talk about Warhammer or the Empire. And talk about "the hobby" in general in positive terms. I don't like Magic - I don't post in the thread. I don't play in most of the RPGs run on the forum - I don't jump into the threads and make sarcastic double entendres and other disruptive things. I stay out of the back table because it's a damn cesspool.

Are you actually saying that a poor-man's 40K knock off has a better background that one of the most original and inspiring fantasy settings ever made?

Read what I said and realize why your question is unfair. I am saying that, two weeks after the release of 1st ed WHFB, the background was less well-developed than the AoS background.

I get it - you're upset because GW isn't talking about WFB any more. And so .... you talk about AoS. Rather than WFB.

I don't understand you people. Does bitching really help?

[Alexis]

Come on, did you loose something when WH: AoS and its new figures and terrain came out? Does it change something in your life and hobby? Were you so depending on GW for your hobby, your life?

A someone who has embraced AoS (albeit using the new rules with the old fluff) I disagree with this point.

True, the old books and what not are there, but it's a certainty that once a game stops being officially supported it loses a lot of momentum. There will be pockets of resistance, EEFL etc, and although what they do is certainly commendable, I very much see it increasingly becoming a game for those who played it, and an ever decreasing circle of hobbyists making a valiant last stand. (largely due to the fact that it will no longer be for sale in the mainstream and thus will get much less attention from fresh blood.)

The models that will inevitably be replaced will become increasingly difficult to buy and likely more expensive via third party. If you are buying on eBay, you will have to wait for that sale and may lose out. You can't just go and buy it.

It may sound naff, but yes, the storyline change did alter my hobby. I can't really explain it, perhaps I get too involved with the narrative, but knowing it all ends as it does put a blotch on it for me and I bet many others. You can claim to deny it and make your own world but it will never be the real deal.

It's possibly unrealistic of me and others to get so annoyed at a company making their own decisions. They have a right to do it, true. Whatever the reason, they will live or die by their own practices, but that doesn't mean that these practices aren't dramatically effecting many players enjoyment of the game. I think everyone should be quite open to the views of fellow posters who may like the new game or may not like it.

[Lord_Crom]

With the new rules old fluff idea I think it would be interesting to play an 8th ed historic battle such as Black Fire Pass, then repeat with the same forces but using the new rules and see which game was the most fun and for what reasons.

The thing I miss from the new fluff is that it is very black and white so far. Old fluff everyone was out for themselves.

[harv]

I think we can all agree on one thing, Age of Sigmar is a turd and watching Games Workshop staff attempt their best at selling it to their wide eyed devotees is a hilarious spectacle.

One Games Workshop underling tried to describe it as the best part of every game rolled into one     

[The Real Rick Salamone]

See Harv, there's the issue..:some people actually like it and we are now at odds with them. It's a messy divorce.


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[Alexis]

See Harv, there's the issue..:some people actually like it and we are now at odds with them. It's a messy divorce.


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I want weekend access and the dog.

[Darknight]

I think we can all agree on one thing, Age of Sigmar is a turd and watching Games Workshop staff attempt their best at selling it to their wide eyed devotees is a hilarious spectacle.

I agree with none of this.

Why do people lack empathy? That is, the ability to see that other people might not think the way they do? I recognize people like (for example) CCG games - I don't like them myself, but when someone plays a CCG or talks about it I don't immediately jump in and trash it, posting things which seem to suggest those who say they like it are delusion, lying, in the pay of GW or some combination thereof.

Because that is what it is - "we can all agree this game sucks" being posted after people have said they do like it is akin to calling people liars.

Quit it, please.

[mr chumley warner]

Go Harv, don't quit it,

Just look at the new AOS Eldar Warp Spider model and you know in yor heart something very fishy has happened !

[Lord_Crom]

For all the talk about this being a warhammer forum or an Empire one there aren't many new posts about the Empire or Warhammer. Perhaps I missing it but people seem to just want to shout about AoS both for or against.

I can't go back to 8th as I've sold my Empire Army and based my new one on round bases. When they look half decent I hope to post lots of battle reports. Lots of people on this forum have been posting a lot longer than me but don't actually seem to be posting about their games...maybe that is why 8th died.

[GamesPoet]

I would add a picture of your armies to underscore the 30.000 spent.

Can you just do that anyway? 

And that's the story of how the brush and palette section blew up.

Regarding Chumley's fluff question, the Eternals are warriors/barbarians of the mortal realms that were killed by the forces of chaos and their spirits reforged by Sigmar into demi-god warriors. When they die Sigmar can reforged them again but the process robs them of their soul each time. (It's also a painful and horrific process that scars their new body, the shiny armor is to help differentiate them from the chaos warriors as without it they would look somewhat similar in their mangled appearance.)

I'll simplify this. Regarding Chumley's fluff question, the Eternals are SHIT.

Well that was less helpful than the Baron's response.

[GamesPoet]

To be perfectly honest - if the scale was right at slightly-smaller than the 28mm we have now - I think if you painted those up using your technique and based them etc. people unfamiliar with the GW releases of the period would be hard-pressed to tell the difference between those figures and the old school ones you have in your collection. The aesthetic of mis-proportioned heroic models with stereotyped and exaggerated weapons and simplistic (even poor) sculpting is better represented in the older models you are so very enamored with, and less in the current models.

I disagree.  The "old school" GW figures I have in my collection look nothing like either.