Topic: Making Knightly Orders army lists bit more fun?

[Damar]

So currently Knightly Order armies are bit lackluster and almost carbon copies of each other. I was wondering if some home rules could make them bit more funny for friendly games and this is what I came up with.

Each KO has some special rules for non-knight units and increased/improved access to some magical items as current line of "Knightly Order only" magical items are fairly lackluster.

(Edited on 24.6 to account for certain Cathay items which suit thematically some of these armies, though of course you might want to rename them something else than Crystal of Kunlan for example).

Knights Panther

Knights panther are all about purity, fighting chaos or traveling to distant lands, meeting exotic persons and taking their stuff. As such, some tweaks are included to reinforce this.

Composition

0-1 Greatsword units per 1000pts as Rare Choice (See Foot Knights)

Treasures of the far-away land: Knights Panther are famously rich knightly order and their vaults are full of treasure from far away lands.

All Chapter & Grand Masters of the Knight Panther, may spend 25pts more on magical items rather than their usual amount

In addition to Empire magical items, your army may include 0-1 magical item per 1000 points, for their normal cost, from the armies Bretonnia, Cathay, High Elves or Wood Elves which have been published in Forces of Fantasy or their respective Arcane Journals.
 
The item(s) must be extremely common and you may not have duplicates in the army. So for example, you can have Gauntlet of the Duel (Bretonnia) and Spirit Lantern (Cathay) in 2000pt army but not two Gauntlets of the Duel.

Demi-talons: Demigryph knights may use halberds, they are not required to use lances like other Knights Panthers.

Foot Knights: Greatsword units in Knights Panther army counts as members of the Knightly Order (for no additional cost). Unit champion (if present) counts as Inner Circle Knight and thus gains Magic Resistance (1). Foot Knights may also buy the Panther pelt upgrade as normal.
 
Likewise, a unit of Foot Knights may purchase Banner of the Knights Panther for it's normal cost, ignoring other limitations of said magical item.

Special rules

For the Empire! Every model in the army gains Hatred (Beastmen Brayherds) unless they already have it. (This includes any White Wolf Knights you may have)

Panther pelts: Any unit of knights Panther may buy Panther pelts upgrade for +10pt/unit. This grants the unit +1 save vs. non-magical ranged attacks (up to maximum 2+). All Grand Masters & Chapter Masters in the army automatically have this upgrade for free. This includes Harald Gemunsen if he is part of the army.

Purge the unclean!  At the start of the battle, you may nominate a single enemy character or monster as a special target as per "Worthy of Kournous" rule in Orion's Wild Hunt army list (See Wood Elf Realms: Arcane Journal).
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Why this was done as it was: After Empire AJ, we essentially got anti-Beastmen army with Wood Elf AoI of Talsyn. They got some special rules so they hate beastmen, their trees can ambush, new magic lore and so on. In lore, Knight Panthers are actively hunting Beastmen and only thing they have going for is hatred really.

So what I looked to design, was essentially a "hunting party". I figured that hunting the "leaders" would work and thus they gained appropriate rule from Wild hunt AoI. In keeping up with the theme, all troops in army got Hatred for Beastmen (simulating local troops whose homes have been raided and now join KP in their effort for revenge).

Panther pelts are also big thing in lore and could feature somehow. Rules were taken, again, from elves who had similiar rule with White Lions.

As the lore says KP are wealthy, they gained magic item allowance like Royal Clan/Beastmen Wild Herd. Access to Common items was also opened so you could build a bit more surprising characters by using items such as Ring of Fury. This sort of means KP likely goes for the herohammer route more than other KO lists.

Banner of the Knights Panther in AJ is very expensive and while unbreakable is nice, you do not necessarily look to enter into grinding fight with knightly units with low base strength. So list was given Greatswords with Foot Knights rule and ability to take said banner for a large infantry block.

Couple of minor ideas such as pistoliers getting Ambusher rule and Knight Panthers ignoring Herdstone's Fearsome edifice rule were dropped.

[Damar]

Blazing Suns

This list is essentially Cult of Myrmidia or stand-in army for Estalia/Tilea.

Composition

0-1 Captain of the Empire*
0-1 Empire Engineer

Any number of State Troops or State Missile Troops as special choice (This enables detachments)

0-1 War Wagon as rare choice. (Engineer may be mounted there as normal)

Army of the Blazing Suns has access to Wyrmbreath Vial, Flamestrike Wand (See Arcane Journal: Kingdom of Bretonnia) and Crystal of Kunlan** (See Arcane Journal: Armies of Grand Cathay).

Special rules

Art of War: Pistoliers in Blazing Suns army are not subject to Impetuous rule. Any state troops with shields gain "Shieldwall" special ability.

Blessed Order of True Insight: In scenarios where players roll off to determine who takes the first turn, you may apply a +1 or -1 modifier to the result of your roll.

Entrenched positions: Any war machine may deploy with entrenched position rule (See Nuln City-State army list), irrespective of number of engineers you have in the army. Any unit of State missile troops (not detachments) may buy Defensive Stakes upgrade for +10pts/unit (See Bretonnian army list)

Holy Fire: Knights of the Blazing Suns may choose not to use their flaming attacks in melee if they so want. They also gain 5+ ward save vs. any attack with flaming attacks special rule.

Additionally, Characters and Inner Circle knights belonging to order of the Blazing Sun count as having magical attacks.

* Can be upgraded to Battle Standard Bearer or made into a General.

** Suggestion for a new name - Talisman of Solkan
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Why this was done as it was: Blazing Suns is in a weird spot. They are heavy cavalry with reverse gear essentially and that's not what you want. Their Inner Circle ability is nice though, being a cheap war banner.

So this was made into more of an alternative Grand Army for the Empire or Cult of Myrmidia in Tilea/Estalia. Blazing Suns lineup is Grand Army but weaker. So this was looked into by making Pistoliers less crappy and buffing state troopers with shieldwall ability. War Wagon makes for a nice centerpiece and unlike other KO army lists, you can take a griffin to your army by fielding a captain.

Army was also given the bonus for starting rolls, again to account for losing out some of the big hitters like Steam Tank. Magic item access was increased with few fire related magical items which fit with Blazing Suns theme. I also tweaked the KO flaming attack rule slightly so, for example, if you into someone with ton of ward saves against flaming attacks, you can douse your own flames.

[Damar]

White Wolf

White Wolf army is something that really wants to be Cult of Ulric army list from earlier edition but falls short due to lack of unique magical items and units.

Composition

Roadwardens: Army of the White Wolf replaces Pistoliers with Roadwardens.

Warriors of Ulric: All Free Company militias in army of the White Wolf are equipped with light armor for free. In addition they have WS4.

Wolf Kin: Your army may include 0-1 unit of Wolf kin as Rare Choice per 1000pts. These troops function as Marauder Tribe Berserkers (See Warriors of Chaos: Arcane Journal) but they do not have Mark of Chaos Undivided. Characters may not join this unit.

White Cloak is an extremely common magic item in White Wolf army list. In addition White Wolf army has access to Dragon's Eye Banner *(See Arcane Journal: Armies of Grand Cathay) and Seal of Parravon** (See Forces of Fantasy: Kingdom of Bretonnia)

Special rules

Cult of Ulric: Your army may be led by High Priest of Ulric if you so choose. In this case the High Priest gains +1 LD. High Priest may also ride a Demigryph for +50pts a model (this can proxy a direwolf since I know some people want to do it)

Fury of Ulric: Priests of Ulric (including High Priest) in White Wolf army gain 'Suffer not..." rule of the Witch Hunters (See Empire army list). Additionally they may replace great weapons with wolf hammers for free.

Wolf pelts: Any unit of knights of the White Wolf & Teutogen Guard may buy Wolf pelts upgrade for +10pt/unit. This grants the unit +1 save vs. non-magical ranged attacks (up to maximum 2+). All Grand Masters, Chapter Masters & Priests of Ulric in the army automatically have this upgrade for free.

* Suggestion for new name - Banner of Skoll
** Suggestion for new name - Heart of Middenheim
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Why this was done as it was: Back in the day, there used to be Cult of Ulric army. Essentially an army with no wizards, lots of melee power and various magical items to stop the spells hitting you. White Wolf army list desperately wanted to be this but could never achieve it.

One thing to do was to buff priests with Suffer not... rule (you could not take Witch Hunters anyway) as replacement for Crush the Weak rule of the old list. In the same vein, High Priest was given an option to be the general. This increases your magical resistance across the board quite nicely and you still have access to Witch Hunter's Ward for those units that you do not put a priest into.

Warriors of Ulric were a thematic unit so they were given a free armor. I later upgraded their WS to 4 as was in old army book (since Free Company is not a powerful unit). Hunting hounds do not have any suitable stand-in unit for Empire but Wolf-Kin could be proxied with Berserkers.

Old Ulrican army had ton of useful and powerful magical items. Here they were given a White Cloak as extremely common item and access to Cathayan magical banner (High elf Banner of Arcane Protection could also work but I vision every BSB would then carry it by default) as generic anti-magic work and Seal of Parravon as copy of old Heart of Middenheim.

[Damar]

Knights of Morr

Knights of Morr work pretty well as they are but few (mainly thematic) tweaks were in order. Regeneration enables triple save characters and combines better with spells such as Oaken Shield.

Composition

0-1 Priests of Morr (use rules for Priest of Sigmar) per 1000pts

Any number of State Missile Troops as special choice (Regular State Troops are still 0-1 per 1000 pts)

0-1 Greatswords units per 1000pts as Rare choice (See Foot Knights)

Foot Knights: Greatsword units (Black Guard of Morr) in Knights of Morr army counts as members of the Knightly Order (for no additional cost). Unit champion (if present) counts as Inner Circle Knight and thus gains Magical Attacks & Fear.

Blade of Silvered Steel & Slayer's Hourglass are extremely common magic items for Knights of Morr army list. In addition they have access to Lucky Heirloom* (see Arcane Journal: Kingdom of Bretonnia) as common item.

Special rules

Beware the touch of a revenant: Any unit of State missile troops (not detachments) may buy Defensive Stakes upgrade for +10pts/unit (See Bretonnian army list)

Fellowship of the Shroud: Any unit joined by Witch Hunter in the army gains Immune to Psychology.

Grim Determination: Pistoliers in Knights of Morr army lose their Impetuous rule.

Priests of Morr: Warrior Priests in the army count as Inner Circle members of the Knightly Order. They must be armed with Great Weapon (Scythe) and may not buy shield (though they can buy armor & mounts as normal).

Unholy Vigor: Instead of a ward save, Knights of Morr have a 6+ regeneration save against all damage.

*Suggestion for a new name - Talisman of Forsagh
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Why this was done as it was: Knights of Morr are fairly interesting option and one could argue they are already quite strong by being, what are essentially semi-undead knights. In Warhammer Lore, they have all kinds of little things which are mainly flavorful. Knights of Morr often fight on foot as they need to clear graveyards etc. so Greatswords fit the bill (crossbows were not given though).

In an undead hunting religion, with members being particularly somber with stuff like 'dooming', having troops with Impetuous seemed bit out of place. So this was removed from Pistoliers.

Priest of Morr are not wizards but list allows wizards anyway. According to Lore the priests don't venture out much but when they do, they use either dagger or scythe. Giving them Inner Circle rules also seemed like a good idea.

And since Morr is also favored by oracles, I gave access to Lucky Heirloom since Blazing Suns already had a bonus in this regard. Main change was to swap their ward save for regeneration so the army and characters could take more advantage of various ward save items and spells since 6+ regeneration or ward save is not too strong anyway.

[Damar]

Fiery Heart

Fiery Heart also work pretty well as they are, representing Cult of Sigmar. Changes were mainly thematic to reinforce the whole idea of Sigmarite Zealots marching to war.

Composition

0-1 Greatsword units per 1000pts as Rare choice. (See Foot Knights)

Foot Knights: Greatsword units in Knights of Fiery Heart army counts as members of the Knightly Order (for no additional cost). Unit champion (if present) counts as Inner Circle Knight and thus gains re-rolls in combat as normal. If this unit is joined by Priest of Sigmar, unit gains Immune to psychology.

Shroud of Iron & Slayer's Hourglass are extremely common items for armies of the Fiery Heart. In addition Knights of Fiery Heart have access to Maw Shard* (see Arcane Journal: Armies of Grand Cathay).

Special Rules

Ancient Enemy: All models in the army of the Fiery Heart gain Hatred (Orcs & Goblins) unless they already have it.

Strong in Faith: All Priests of Sigmar & Harbinger of Doom models in the army of the Fiery Heart gain +1 LD. Lector of Sigmar can be your general instead of Chapter/Grand Master of the Fiery Heart.

In addition Flagellant units (and any priest that has joined them) and Harbingers of Doom in the army increase their maximum possible charge range by 1" and, when they make a Charge roll, may apply a +1 modifier to the result.

Your existence offends Sigmar! At the start of the battle, you may nominate a single enemy model as special target as in "Striking a Grudge!" rule in Dwarven Royal Clan army list (See Dwarven Mountain Holds: Arcane Journal).

*Suggestion for new name - Prayer Icon of Sigmar
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Why this was done as it was: Fiery Heart has a surprisingly good bonus with +1 initiative bonus as they can go first or simultaneously with many other elite troops (apparently they are popular as GA addition). As such the army likely wants to use them as much as possible. Much like Knight Panther, they were given an option for special target to kill. Priests get an overall buff with +1 leadership, making those prayers hitting their mark so much more likely.

Since FAQ made War Altar useful, option of Lector being a general seemed like a no-brainer as well. All in all Fiery Heart looks like an army which can really go in your face and do lots of damage. To support using Flagellants, they were given Crusaders Zeal rule from Errantry Crusade list.

[Tiberius]

Love it!  These are great!  I would absolutely want to play a knightly orders army if they had these rules.

Not getting roadwardens in the armies really pissed me off. If I have to have an all cavalry army at least give me some good like cavalry too.

[Damar]

Thank you.

I had few other ideas too such as giving Pistoliers in Knights Panther a possibility of using Ambushers rule or giving Warriors of Ulric Furious Charge but maybe those come later.

If someone does any playing with these lists, do let me know in this thread.