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Author Topic: Floods in Europe  (Read 233 times)

Offline KTG17

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Floods in Europe
« on: July 19, 2021, 01:59:36 PM »
I haven't followed this that closely, and I am not really familiar with the areas affected, so I was wondering if anyone knew if this is like a 100 year event, or were these areas prone to flooding and this was just a really bad one?

Offline Henerius

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2021, 02:45:09 PM »
Op sommige plaatsen in Limburg is op dinsdag 13 juli en woensdag 14 juli meer dan 150 millimeter gevallen

translation:  in Limburg (river meusse/maas) on tuesday 13-7 and wednesday 14-7 there fell 150mm rain which more then twice the ammount that normally falls in the entire month (source KNMI - dutch weather officials)


Global warming is making weather more extreme. what normally falls in a month now falls in a day or just two.  rivers are not made to handle that ammount of water in such a short time period.  Germany and Belgium prepared themselves just like the Netherlands after the floods of 1995 and 1996.

Deepening the rivers, deepening the "uiterwaarden" (plains between the river and the river dykes) increasing the volumes the rivers can handle. removing dykes to make extra flood areas and making lakes close to the river that can be used to store water.  Everything that helps to hold the water on the land and flow slower to the river helps. 

But it does not help if the weather changes and the rain of one month falls in just one day.

New plans are already made.  I am curious what they come up with.

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Offline Fidelis von Sigmaringen

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2021, 03:41:30 PM »
It is an extra-ordinary meteorological event, aggravated by human incompetence. Various governments were forewarned when and where this would happen, but failed to take precautionary measures or even to warn the population.

Global warming has little to do with it, except as an useful political tool.

For Germany:

Umweltbundesamt, [Federal Office for the Environment] Monitoringbericht 2019 zur Deutschen Anpassungsstrategie an den Klimawandel



Die Zeitreihe zum Hochwassergeschehen ist durch einzelne wiederkehrende Hochwasserereignisse sowohl im Winter als auch im Sommerhalbjahr geprägt. Signifikante Trends lassen sich nicht feststellen. Je nach Witterungskonstellation ergeben sich räumliche Schwerpunkte des Hochwasserauftretens. In der Regel sind aber mehrere Flussgebiete betroffen.

The time series for flood events is characterized by individual recurring flood events both in winter and in the summer half-year. Significant trends cannot be identified. Depending on the weather constellation, there are spatial focal points of the flood occurrence. As a rule, however, several river basins are affected.

Deutscher Wetterdienst:  Klimareport 2020, 38-39:
Für den Sommer lassen sich derzeit mit den vorhandenen Beobachtungsdaten und den bekannten Methoden keine Trends der Anzahl von Tagen mit hohen Niederschlagsmengen identifizieren. Hier dominiert eine kurz- und mittelfristige zyklische Variabilität.

For the summer, no trends in the number of days with high levels of precipitation can currently be identified with the available observational data and the known methods. Short and medium-term cyclical variability dominates here.

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Offline GamesPoet

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2021, 05:11:18 PM »
Lets be careful, and not move into political discussions, thanks! :icon_cool: :::cheers:::
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Offline Fidelis von Sigmaringen

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2021, 09:34:27 PM »
Regarding what constitutes a 100 year event, this should prove to be interesting reading: https://training.fema.gov/hiedu/docs/fmc/chapter%204%20-%20flood%20risk%20assessment.pdf
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Offline Padre

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2021, 04:31:22 PM »
Global warming has little to do with it, except as an useful political tool.

Careful now. Your comment seems to give the strong impression that there is no significant link between global warming and increased 'heavy precipitation events', yet there are reliable sources that make projections indicating exactly that.
 
A quickly found example, in terms of the USA but definitely making the case for the connection between global warming and heavy precitipitation events, can be found on the NASA website:  https://climate.nasa.gov/effects/?_gl=1

Quote
Changes in Precipitation Patterns Average U.S. precipitation has increased since 1900, but some areas have had increases greater than the national average, and some areas have had decreases. More winter and spring precipitation is projected for the northern United States, and less for the Southwest, over this century.

Projections of future climate over the U.S. suggest that the recent trend towards increased heavy precipitation events will continue. This trend is projected to occur even in regions where total precipitation is expected to decrease, such as the Southwest.
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Offline Fidelis von Sigmaringen

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2021, 10:03:07 PM »
Well, I could respond a lot to that, backed up by (official!) facts and figures (as above), but that would be deemed political and thus would be deleted, so I'll pass. 
It is not enough to have no ideas of your own; you must also be incapable of expressing them.
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Offline Padre

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2021, 10:50:39 PM »
Not a problem. I mean, who cares? We live in a post truth age.
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Offline Padre

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #8 on: July 24, 2021, 11:09:25 PM »
Although a link to nasa information is more science than politics. And global warming / precipitation is also, really, about facts not opinions. Politics really shouldn't come into it.

Oh hang on. For a moment there I forgot. Post truth and populism, and this wing and that wing.

Yet ... If we couldn't discuss the topic, as per the OP, then surely the thread would have been euthanised long before now?
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Offline Grutch

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2021, 06:59:35 PM »
You can take this to the Back Table.  Let's see how it goes! 

Offline Padre

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #10 on: July 26, 2021, 07:59:35 PM »
Like I already indicated, we don't need a back table for this topic. It's about science and facts, not politics, religion or conspiracies. Anything else would be off topic - a case of make believe, wishful thinking and whining.

I posted a NASA source. Pretty scientific I'd say.

If you don't think NASA 'does good science', then yeah, go to some 'back table' place and babble majestic.

(Edit) It just occurred to me that as the site owner you could move the thread to a newly created 'back table'. If so, woop de back table ucking do. Being the sort of comment permissible on a back table, so I hope you do move it. Asap. Or better than that, move even before now.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2021, 09:29:12 PM by Padre »
Photobucket has now re-destroyed my pictures, so the first half of my collected works thread is no longer working again. To see my website version of the campaign thread, with fully functioning pictures, please go to https://bigsmallworlds.com/

Offline GamesPoet

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #11 on: July 26, 2021, 09:36:59 PM »
Lets be careful, and not move into political discussions, thanks! :icon_cool: :::cheers:::

Wrote the above further back on this thread, and before the Back Table was reopened.  However, that doesn't mean inappropriateness will be tolerated.  Thanks! :::cheers:::

See the "READ BEFORE POSTING ... " that has been stickied in the new (and unknown if improved yet) Back Table area ... http://warhammer-empire.com/theforum/index.php?topic=55317.0

Feel free to use some discretion in continuing with this topic, and although this "Floods in Europe" thread has been given a bit more leeway of breadth for the topic, that doesn't mean it is a complete free for all. :icon_wink: :icon_cool:
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

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Offline Zak

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Re: Floods in Europe
« Reply #12 on: July 26, 2021, 10:54:37 PM »
yeah the world has a lot of things happening all at once hahaha
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