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Author Topic: AoS Naming Conventions: Sensible or Gilding the Lily, a spirited discussion  (Read 1436 times)

Online S.O.F

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More info on the Cursed City:

Quote
.... sanctified mortsilver bullets

Euh it is shit like this that makes me despise AoS stuff. Just say sanctified silver. First because it is alliterative and therefore sounds better and two because adding mort or death if we want to get French about it is just really dumb.

Edited by GP for swearing
« Last Edit: February 02, 2021, 05:48:40 PM by GamesPoet »
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Offline GamesPoet

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2021, 09:55:38 PM »
I agree. :::cheers:::
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline Old Stonebeard

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2021, 10:12:49 PM »
I agree. :::cheers:::

Of course you do  :closed-eyes:

If I could play Sigmar's advocate for a moment, the description says "He also carries stakes carved from Aqshian firewood that burst into flames when they pierce the flesh of undead creatures". Because the properties of even mundane materials change depending on the Realm they're from, it's entirely possible that within AOS, "mortsilver" has its own properties. Not even all real-world silvers are made equal, after all:

Quote
There are many different types of silver. This is because pure 100% silver is soft and malleable. For most practical applications silver is mixed or alloyed with other harder metals, typically copper.

Alex
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Online S.O.F

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2021, 11:15:14 PM »
If I could play Sigmar's advocate for a moment, the description says "He also carries stakes carved from Aqshian firewood that burst into flames when they pierce the flesh of undead creatures". Because the properties of even mundane materials change depending on the Realm they're from, it's entirely possible that within AOS, "mortsilver" has its own properties.

But even in that example firewood will in the French translation of rules be a one to one swap, mortsilver will be what deathargent. Lame...very very lame.

The Enemy Within being filled with bad German puns I'll take, but this sort of adje-noun bullshit gets really old really fast and even worse when you start making it all 'fancy' with foreign languages. That Khorne Bloodreavers carry 'meatripper axes' is a turd of a name that this gun fires 'mortsilver' bullets is a turd covered in gold flakes thus all the more offensive.

Very nice mini and the vibe of the art for the game I can dig but this shit just doesn't fly.
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Offline GamesPoet

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2021, 11:44:18 PM »
I agree. :::cheers:::
Of course you do  :closed-eyes:
It is bad enough there are issues with personalizing in the Back Table area, let's not continue here, eh? :icon_wink:

Quote
If I could play Sigmar's advocate for a moment, the description says "He also carries stakes carved from Aqshian firewood that burst into flames when they pierce the flesh of undead creatures". Because the properties of even mundane materials change depending on the Realm they're from, it's entirely possible that within AOS, "mortsilver" has its own properties. Not even all real-world silvers are made equal, after all:

Quote
There are many different types of silver. This is because pure 100% silver is soft and malleable. For most practical applications silver is mixed or alloyed with other harder metals, typically copper.
Yep, W:AoS is a world where silver isn't enough on the undead. Ok.

If I could play Sigmar's advocate for a moment, the description says "He also carries stakes carved from Aqshian firewood that burst into flames when they pierce the flesh of undead creatures". Because the properties of even mundane materials change depending on the Realm they're from, it's entirely possible that within AOS, "mortsilver" has its own properties.

But even in that example firewood will in the French translation of rules be a one to one swap, mortsilver will be what deathargent. Lame...very very lame.

The Enemy Within being filled with bad German puns I'll take, but this sort of adje-noun bullshit gets really old really fast and even worse when you start making it all 'fancy' with foreign languages. That Khorne Bloodreavers carry 'meatripper axes' is a turd of a name that this gun fires 'mortsilver' bullets is a turd covered in gold flakes thus all the more offensive.

Very nice mini and the vibe of the art for the game I can dig but this shit just doesn't fly.
I agree. :::cheers:::
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline Old Stonebeard

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2021, 01:13:14 AM »
*shrug* Ya'll are gonna see it the way you wanna see it  :icon_rolleyes: :::cheers:::

Alex
you know you can just play 8th, right?

Offline Spiney

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2021, 10:33:40 PM »
More info on the Cursed City:

Quote
.... sanctified mortsilver bullets

Euh it is shit like this that makes me despise AoS stuff. Just say sanctified silver. First because it is alliterative and therefore sounds better and two because adding mort or death if we want to get French about it is just really god damn dumb.

What can I say, you can either learn to tune out the gameís frankly imbecilic naming conventions or you canít, itís the dwarf armies that make me laugh, each one is hankering after their own unique brand of gold (ur-gold for the slayer dwarfs or aether-gold for the airship dwarfs). Likewise Iíve got no idea why my Squig knights use Ďpokiní lances instead of just lances or why my savage orcís choppas suddenly became Ďchompasí (originally I thought it was just a typo, but sadly not).

All I can think is that person whose job it is to come up with these names must be related to the CEO or something because for some reason his job appears to be untouchable.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2021, 10:37:27 PM by Spiney »

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Offline Jmash

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2021, 10:40:25 AM »
More info on the Cursed City:

Quote
.... sanctified mortsilver bullets

Euh it is shit like this that makes me despise AoS stuff. Just say sanctified silver. First because it is alliterative and therefore sounds better and two because adding mort or death if we want to get French about it is just really god damn dumb.

What can I say, you can either learn to tune out the gameís frankly imbecilic naming conventions or you canít, itís the dwarf armies that make me laugh, each one is hankering after their own unique brand of gold (ur-gold for the slayer dwarfs or aether-gold for the airship dwarfs). Likewise Iíve got no idea why my Squig knights use Ďpokiní lances instead of just lances or why my savage orcís choppas suddenly became Ďchompasí (originally I thought it was just a typo, but sadly not).

All I can think is that person whose job it is to come up with these names must be related to the CEO or something because for some reason his job appears to be untouchable.

I was actually browsing the GW site the other day and was looking at 'Orruks' as some of the bigger beefy ones nowadays look pretty cool, albeit garishly yellow...

Anyway, the one which really cracked me up was this line from the 'Loonsmasha Fanatics'...

Quote
Spinning madly, Sporesplatta Fanatics swing THWACKWHEEZER PUFFSHROOMS attached to heavy metal chains...

I mean come on! :icon_confused:

Offline GamesPoet

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2021, 01:37:35 PM »
When they first started showing that they were changing the names of the various groups from things like Orcs to Orruks, I knew we were in trouble.  Little did I know.

And I continue to call Orcs ... Orcs. :icon_mrgreen:
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline Artobans Ghost

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #9 on: February 01, 2021, 02:33:32 PM »
Quote SOF:
Quote
Spinning madly, Sporesplatta Fanatics swing THWACKWHEEZER PUFFSHROOMS attached to heavy metal chains...

I mean come on! :icon_confused:

Think of the courage of the person who came up with that lol
There must be newer, mind expanding drugs on the market now 😺
Mathi Alfblut Feb 4,2017 Simple, You gut the bastard with your sword, the viking way.
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Offline Jmash

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #10 on: February 01, 2021, 02:38:42 PM »
I guess it depends on just how fantastical people like their fantasy, people will always have their different opinions, some will love it, others won't.

For me I always liked my fantasy to be quite tangible, yes there's magic and monsters but the Old World itself was always something I could relate to and could fully imagine these things existing in a real-world setting so to speak. As soon as everything goes all multi-realm and gets crackpot names IMO it loses that tangibility. What's wrong with silver bullets? Orcs? Poison Mushrooms?...

AoS is just that one step beyond for me I'm afraid, so long live the Old World and I eagerly anticipate it's return!

Offline GamesPoet

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2021, 02:43:04 PM »
I was actually browsing the GW site the other day and was looking at 'Orruks' as some of the bigger beefy ones nowadays look pretty cool, albeit garishly yellow...

Anyway, the one which really cracked me up was this line from the 'Loonsmasha Fanatics'...
Quote
Spinning madly, Sporesplatta Fanatics swing THWACKWHEEZER PUFFSHROOMS attached to heavy metal chains...
I mean come on! :icon_confused:

Think of the courage of the person who came up with that lol
There must be newer, mind expanding drugs on the market now 😺
The writer was probably doing too much Thwackweezer Puffshrooms.  I'm sure.
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline Old Stonebeard

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #12 on: February 01, 2021, 06:09:27 PM »
I didn't realize that dunking on AOS naming conventions was important enough to warrant its own thread, GP  :dry:

Quote
AoS is just that one step beyond for me I'm afraid, so long live the Old World and I eagerly anticipate it's return!

And I'm afraid The Old World is DOA to me. What sold me on AOS was the welcoming, enthusiastic community. One needs look no further than the comment section on any Warhammer-Community tease of The Old World to understand that's a group I want nothing to do with. If putting up with everything being named storm-this and blood-that is the cost of admission, I'll gladly pay it  :::cheers:::

Alex
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Offline GamesPoet

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #13 on: February 01, 2021, 06:37:29 PM »
I didn't realize that dunking on AOS naming conventions was important enough to warrant its own thread, GP  :dry:
This must be a joke.  Unless of course you're unfamiliar with where these posts were originally happening. :icon_wink: :icon_lol:
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline Artobans Ghost

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #14 on: February 01, 2021, 07:15:30 PM »
I didn't realize that dunking on AOS naming conventions was important enough to warrant its own thread, GP  :dry:

Quote
AoS is just that one step beyond for me I'm afraid, so long live the Old World and I eagerly anticipate it's return!

And I'm afraid The Old World is DOA to me. What sold me on AOS was the welcoming, enthusiastic community. One needs look no further than the comment section on any Warhammer-Community tease of The Old World to understand that's a group I want nothing to do with. If putting up with everything being named storm-this and blood-that is the cost of admission, I'll gladly pay it  :::cheers:::

Alex

I have to say that at the TGA forum, the community is great and enthusiastic. I have no issue with the wacky names or the resulting eye rolling at them as there is still a hurdle between the 2 worlds. I think Iíve invested enough time and energy to AoS to say I wonít probably head back to the old world but Iíve been in both worlds for about the same time (5 year sabbatical taken out) 6 yrs wfb , 5 AoS. I like both but prefer the AoS setup as it allows for everything in it. Zero magic if you wish to fantastical on the other end. But the names are crazy for sure.
Mathi Alfblut Feb 4,2017 Simple, You gut the bastard with your sword, the viking way.
Questions?


GP Jan 4, 2020
Yes, even W:AoS.

Online S.O.F

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #15 on: February 01, 2021, 10:04:15 PM »
I'm afraid The Old World is DOA to me. What sold me on AOS was the welcoming, enthusiastic community. One needs look no further than the comment section on any Warhammer-Community tease of The Old World to understand that's a group I want nothing to do with. If putting up with everything being named storm-this and blood-that is the cost of admission, I'll gladly pay it  :::cheers:::

Alex

Wait there is a comment section, is it on that book of face deal since I never see it on the GW site. Anyway I thought comment sections in general were regarded as look hear if you want to illicit the Farnsworth "I don't want to live on this planet anymore" response?
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Offline GamesPoet

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I see the thread title was changed! :icon_lol: :::cheers:::
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Online S.O.F

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I see the thread title was changed! :icon_lol: :::cheers:::

Well it was my post, I reserved the right to name it something more amusing.  :wink:
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Offline Warlord

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #18 on: February 02, 2021, 09:57:49 AM »
I didn't realize that dunking on AOS naming conventions was important enough to warrant its own thread, GP  :dry:

Splitting off topic discussion into its own thread is called moderating :wink: a lost art I know...
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Offline GamesPoet

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I see the thread title was changed! :icon_lol: :::cheers:::
Well it was my post, I reserved the right to name it something more amusing.  :wink:
No complaint from here on the renaming.
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline Old Stonebeard

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #20 on: February 03, 2021, 03:34:42 AM »


So, I checked the AOS Warscrolls for Skaeth's Wild Hunt and Grashrak's Despoilers, the two Underworlds warbands in the Beastgrave set GamesPoet just bought, and despite being satyr/centuar aelves, I realize we're not talking about the wild, wacky weapon names they have, like... "Javelin of the Hunt"? That's not so bad, but they also carry "Seeker Bows"! Atrocious! And what's this? A "hunting weapon"? Will this violence done upon our youth's pasttime never end!
https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls/aos_skaeths_wild_hunt_en.pdf

Shall we see what miscarriage of conventionality they've done to the Beastmen, then, these staples of gritty, low-fantasy Warhammer? Ah, there it is! A "ripper axe"! Not to mention their "shortbows" and "flint weapons":
https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls/aos_grashraks_despoilers_en.pdf

Wait there is a comment section, is it on that book of face deal since I never see it on the GW site. Anyway I thought comment sections in general were regarded as look hear if you want to illicit the Farnsworth "I don't want to live on this planet anymore" response?

Correct, feedback both on facebook and, to a lesser extent, Twitter. For example, some nuggets from the WarCom article about the new Kislev in The Old World: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/03/23/the-old-world-ice-guard-of-kislevgw-homepage-post-4fw-homepage-post-2/

Quote
Are these going to be scaled as per Warhammer Fantasy or oversized AoS minis? Be nice to know if its worth bothering to get excited but if donít fit with old world collections wont bother outside of books.

Quote
Well, I am happy we are going back to the old world. But I would have liked it to be more in line with the Lore of the older editions with them being low fantasy. maybe something like white Scars blended with the dark grittiness of Death of Hope. OR Less Disney and more Sabaton Winged hussars. As this unit is sort of taking away form the Tsarina. As it was in the lore that only her could do that.

Quote
These models looks like if kislev survied the end times and made it into AOS

Quote
Slow down with magic, old world is not age of sigmar

Quote
cool Chinese woman, but where is Kislev?

Quote
What about bretonnians? 🙁

Sadly, the most toxic comments are quickly deleted by WarCom interns, so you really have to be watching in the hours after the article drops to save the creme de la creme.  But, at the end of the day, I get it. AOS is just too different from what we knew and loved, what with it's flying airships and kangaroo cavalry. I mean, just look at this historically inspired WHFB art from John Blanche...



Splitting off topic discussion into its own thread is called moderating :wink: a lost art I know...

Ya'll sure do have curious notions about what needs moderating  :closed-eyes:

Now, I wouldn't want GP to have to moderate this down into yet another thread, so I'll close by putting us back on topic with another comment from that Kislev article...

Quote
Super stoked about this. I do worry that every new unit will have a ridiculous bloody magic-the-gathering-card name like the units in AoS. You can just call a miner a miner or a halberdier a halberdier GW.

Alex
you know you can just play 8th, right?

Offline Jmash

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We get it, you like AoS, some of us do not.

You're quick to dismiss anyone who's bashing AoS as a cretin who's stuck in the past, but I think you need to consider that a lot of the older players and collectors (I don't know how old you are Old Stoney) grew up with WFB, it kind of mirrored other things that we grew up with too like maybe Robin Hood, King Arthur, LOTR, dare I say all conventional, somewhat grounded versions of fantasy mixed with historical realism, and this is what WFB was born out of in the beginning.

I do fully understand why GW made such the monumental shift. IP was difficult to protect, their fanbase for Fantasy was maybe stagnating and ageing and the rule set (I don't play so can't be 100% certain) was I believe getting more and more complex, putting off the younger generations as it was too difficult to get into. The youth of today has grown up with technology and Marvel superheroes, not swords and bows so yeah pseudo dwarves with lightning rifles and massive beefcake golden boys are maybe a little more relatable to them. Bright lights and colours and all that.

It's the fact that it was so massive a gulf between the old and the new, nothing is familiar anymore, silly names included, probably what GW were going for. It is aimed at the youth and if you are into it then that's great, more power to you, but it understandably closed the door on a lot of other people. You can't replace LOTR with Flash Gordon and expect your fans to lap it up and not rip it to shreds.

Finally the comments on the new Old World are entirely valid, what's the point in reviving the Old World if any new models are a full head and shoulders above their counterparts from yesteryear? Why bother going back in time if everything you produce is going to be more magical and whimsical than it previously was?
« Last Edit: February 03, 2021, 11:06:14 AM by Jmash »

Offline Jmash

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Rant over :biggriin:

Offline Artobans Ghost

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Rant over :biggriin:

Good rant jmash. AoS is here and has its fanbase. To bring back the old world is going after that fanbase - speak to it. Thereís room for everyone as long as people keep sending cash their way.
Mathi Alfblut Feb 4,2017 Simple, You gut the bastard with your sword, the viking way.
Questions?


GP Jan 4, 2020
Yes, even W:AoS.

Offline GamesPoet

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Re: Warhammer: Age of Sigmar Vocabulary
« Reply #24 on: February 03, 2021, 01:07:53 PM »


So, I checked the AOS Warscrolls for Skaeth's Wild Hunt and Grashrak's Despoilers, the two Underworlds warbands in the Beastgrave set GamesPoet just bought, and despite being satyr/centuar aelves, I realize we're not talking about the wild, wacky weapon names they have, like... "Javelin of the Hunt"? That's not so bad, but they also carry "Seeker Bows"! Atrocious! And what's this? A "hunting weapon"? Will this violence done upon our youth's pasttime never end!
https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls/aos_skaeths_wild_hunt_en.pdf

Shall we see what miscarriage of conventionality they've done to the Beastmen, then, these staples of gritty, low-fantasy Warhammer? Ah, there it is! A "ripper axe"! Not to mention their "shortbows" and "flint weapons":
https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls/aos_grashraks_despoilers_en.pdf
Beastgrave is certainly proving to be quite the education.  Thankfully they haven’t started molding the figures to the bases for us yet.  And it is interesting to see that you seem to point out your disappointment in them naming some of these weapons one way, and others another.  Yes, the inconsistency does exist.

Quote
Wait there is a comment section, is it on that book of face deal since I never see it on the GW site. Anyway I thought comment sections in general were regarded as look hear if you want to illicit the Farnsworth "I don't want to live on this planet anymore" response?
Correct, feedback both on facebook and, to a lesser extent, Twitter. For example, some nuggets from the WarCom article about the new Kislev in The Old World: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/03/23/the-old-world-ice-guard-of-kislevgw-homepage-post-4fw-homepage-post-2/

Quote
Are these going to be scaled as per Warhammer Fantasy or oversized AoS minis? Be nice to know if its worth bothering to get excited but if don’t fit with old world collections wont bother outside of books.

Quote
Well, I am happy we are going back to the old world. But I would have liked it to be more in line with the Lore of the older editions with them being low fantasy. maybe something like white Scars blended with the dark grittiness of Death of Hope. OR Less Disney and more Sabaton Winged hussars. As this unit is sort of taking away form the Tsarina. As it was in the lore that only her could do that.

Quote
These models looks like if kislev survied the end times and made it into AOS

Quote
Slow down with magic, old world is not age of sigmar

Quote
cool Chinese woman, but where is Kislev?

Quote
What about bretonnians?

Sadly, the most toxic comments are quickly deleted by WarCom interns, so you really have to be watching in the hours after the article drops to save the creme de la creme.  But, at the end of the day, I get it. AOS is just too different from what we knew and loved, what with it's flying airships and kangaroo cavalry. I mean, just look at this historically inspired WHFB art from John Blanche...

What is WarCom?  Is it affiliated with GW?  Or maybe it is some other hobby website?

Quote
Splitting off topic discussion into its own thread is called moderating :wink: a lost art I know...
Ya'll sure do have curious notions about what needs moderating  :closed-eyes:

Now, I wouldn't want GP to have to moderate this down into yet another thread, so I'll close by putting us back on topic with another comment from that Kislev article…

Quote
Super stoked about this. I do worry that every new unit will have a ridiculous bloody magic-the-gathering-card name like the units in AoS. You can just call a miner a miner or a halberdier a halberdier GW.
We’re aware ya don’t like the moderating here, so “curious” seems an understatement. :icon_wink:

And the idea that your viewpoint here would be moderated by me into a separate thread, isn’t making much sense to me, so feel free to explain.  So far it has convinced me that you're not familiar with where the topic came from.

That's ok, suffice it to say for the moment that the topic of this thread started with one post on another thread, and developed into a discussion of many posts on the other thread.  The digression seemed worth enough and different enough, to have it's own thread for folks to debate and enjoy, without cluttering the topic of the other thread.  And as you can see, the new thread topic has continued here accordingly.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2021, 01:11:08 PM by GamesPoet »
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra