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Author Topic: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)  (Read 102628 times)

Offline wissenlander

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #25 on: April 08, 2008, 12:12:49 AM »
An issue with any of these maps or listings are that they're not technically official. 

However, they do bring about some inspiration which is always a positive.  If you like elements of the sites, feel free to use them, but don't be frustrated if the evidence is contradictory.  The best source at the moment for towns would be the reference book, Sigmar's Heirs.  I don't have my copy with me at the moment, so I can't really help out on different town names, but I can tell you that Wuppertal, Loningbruck and Grenzstadt are towns/villages in Averland in the book.

Karl Voss of Averland has based his army in Loningbruck and Wyzer1 at Grenzstadt, guarding the pass. 

Some of the best maps we have at the moment are provided in the first post by Midaski.  It's subject to change, but right now, it's one of the best sources we've got for a map and it goes into decent detail on the locations of the towns, and they're very inclusive.  The best maps I've seen for individual provinces, in fact.
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Offline GamesPoet

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #26 on: April 08, 2008, 11:33:15 AM »
An issue with any of these maps or listings are that they're not technically official.
Figured this was the case. :icon_cool:

Quote
However, they do bring about some inspiration which is always a positive.  If you like elements of the sites, feel free to use them, but don't be frustrated if the evidence is contradictory.  The best source at the moment for towns would be the reference book, Sigmar's Heirs.  I don't have my copy with me at the moment, so I can't really help out on different town names, but I can tell you that Wuppertal, Loningbruck and Grenzstadt are towns/villages in Averland in the book.
I've been looking around for reference books like Sigmar's Heirs, yet haven't found any yet. I checked out several hobby stores with no luck, but I'll keep looking.

Quote
Karl Voss of Averland has based his army in Loningbruck and Wyzer1 at Grenzstadt, guarding the pass. 

Some of the best maps we have at the moment are provided in the first post by Midaski.  It's subject to change, but right now, it's one of the best sources we've got for a map and it goes into decent detail on the locations of the towns, and they're very inclusive.  The best maps I've seen for individual provinces, in fact.
Yes, the map provided by Midaski is the same one posted on the "madalfred" site. And since this is the only map of Averland that I know of at the moment, I'm beginning to sense that this is the map to use, for now. It seems to show most of the decent sized towns in the province being listed on the "Gazatteer Of Averland" (also posted on the "madalfred" site) associated with the map.
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

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Offline wissenlander

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #27 on: April 08, 2008, 11:44:03 AM »
I looked around at a few stores for Sigmar's Heirs.  I did find it at one, but didn't feel like spending the money at that point.  My wife went to a bookstore and ordered it there.  You might be able to find it on ebay or somewhere else if you can't get it at a local store.

You'll really like it.  It goes into greater depth (though not too deep for the most part) on towns populations, main sources of wealth, rulers, etc.  A select few even have blurbs about them that go into greater detail, but it's only about 3 or 4 per province.
Me and Wissenlander had babies!

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finding photographic evidense that Wiss smiles is going to be hard...

Offline GamesPoet

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #28 on: April 08, 2008, 05:02:27 PM »
I looked around at a few stores for Sigmar's Heirs.  I did find it at one, but didn't feel like spending the money at that point.  My wife went to a bookstore and ordered it there.  You might be able to find it on ebay or somewhere else if you can't get it at a local store.

You'll really like it.  It goes into greater depth (though not too deep for the most part) on towns populations, main sources of wealth, rulers, etc.  A select few even have blurbs about them that go into greater detail, but it's only about 3 or 4 per province.
It will be interesting to see if the information matches what I've found on the web with the "Gazetteer of Averland".

It provides information regarding the main towns including size, ruler, population, wealth, source of wealth, garrisons and miltia, and sometimes other notes. Also, it gives a list of the villages underneath each community's jurisdiction, along with similar types of info shown for the towns. Plenty of source info for roleplaying, or WH Fantasy campaigning, or fluff writing when creating an army. :icon_cool:

I've been reading about quite a few other topics, as I continue planning for an Averlander army, and hope to share more eventually. I've used some of the posts on this thread as starting points for my exploration.

If anyone knows of other good source material, I'd be interested in knowing?
« Last Edit: April 08, 2008, 05:05:37 PM by GamesPoet »
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline GamesPoet

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #29 on: April 20, 2008, 04:38:33 AM »
Found an interesting source book today that provides alittle info on Averland ...

The book was called "WFRP Companion" put out by Black Industries in 2006, who has been printing some of GW's stuff it seems.  There is a lengthy section inside regarding the river ways of the Empire, including a map with some towns listed on it.  In Averland, the towns listed on the Aver River are Streissen and Averheim, with Pfungzig being listed on the Blue Reach and then further down Schramlen, Sigmarigen (these two are listed on the "home16" site, but not the "madalfred" site), and Bernloch (listed on both sites) as the river gets closer to the World's Edge Mountains.  On the Upper Reik, Wuppertal and Lonigbruck are followed by Steingart (also not listed on either of the previously mentioned sites), Agbeiten, and Hochsleben, along with Grenzstadt guarding Black Fire Pass.  Interestingly, the same map has the Moot covering the rest of the territory between the Aver Reach and Blue Reach rivers.

Haven't seen a copy of "Sigmar's Heirs" yet, although Black Industries does have several other publications that might provide helpful info on other Empire provinces, cities, towns and villages, too.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2008, 01:38:31 PM by GamesPoet »
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline Karl Voss of Averland

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #30 on: April 24, 2008, 04:33:59 PM »
I can't believe I missed these posts  :icon_eek:

I've sought as much fluff about my Province as I possibly could, and I have a few observations:

1) The deep down dirty details in the fluff will vary from source to source. Most confusing is the website - CriticalHit.com - which has literally made up details to fit their own spin on the fluff. To keep things constant, I refer only to data from the Black Library, as it is more official then CriticalHit or the Averland Gazetteers that you have stumbled upon. This is not to say that Black Library doesn't have its flaws (See the debate over when Marius died), but it will keep everyone on a constant base/

2) Sigmar's heirs is a great companion that not only gives you physical details of the province, but also cultural. It has its own Gazetteer and insights into the various towns and villages, as well as Averheim.

3) The Mad Alfred maps are pretty close to accurate, so I attribute the errors on them to the lack of Google Maps in our Imperial Age.

If you have any questions, i'd be glad to talk about various Averlandic topics  :icon_razz:
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Offline GamesPoet

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #31 on: April 24, 2008, 05:44:23 PM »
I can't believe I missed these posts  :icon_eek:

I've sought as much fluff about my Province as I possibly could, and I have a few observations:

1) The deep down dirty details in the fluff will vary from source to source. Most confusing is the website - CriticalHit.com - which has literally made up details to fit their own spin on the fluff. To keep things constant, I refer only to data from the Black Library, as it is more official then CriticalHit or the Averland Gazetteers that you have stumbled upon. This is not to say that Black Library doesn't have its flaws (See the debate over when Marius died), but it will keep everyone on a constant base/
Yes, this is my current view as well.  My understanding is that the Black Library publications are approved by GW so it is as close to the source as possible without quite being there.

Quote
2) Sigmar's heirs is a great companion that not only gives you physical details of the province, but also cultural. It has its own Gazetteer and insights into the various towns and villages, as well as Averheim.
When I find one of these, I'm  definitely going to pick up a copy.

Quote
3) The Mad Alfred maps are pretty close to accurate, so I attribute the errors on them to the lack of Google Maps in our Imperial Age.
:icon_lol:
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline Karl Voss of Averland

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #32 on: April 24, 2008, 05:48:31 PM »
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I sexually violated the cat.  When we have children I will push harder for this time honored and enjoyable tradition

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Offline GamesPoet

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #33 on: May 08, 2008, 05:20:52 PM »
Here's a question ...

I realize Averland's current banner is as pictured in Karl Voss's picture that he uses as an avatar.  Has this always been the province's main symbol or have there been others at an earlier time in the history of WHF or GW :icon_question:
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline wissenlander

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #34 on: May 08, 2008, 05:24:30 PM »
http://www.warhammer-empire.com/library/guide/averland.php

That flag was official at one point or another.  Not sure of the specifics, though I believe it was in a White Dwarf a long while ago.
Me and Wissenlander had babies!

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finding photographic evidense that Wiss smiles is going to be hard...

Offline Karl Voss of Averland

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #35 on: May 08, 2008, 05:51:38 PM »
I discovered Averland's flag while exploring the depths of Google Images. Searching Averland or something brought me to Games Workshop Spain site - which with a little exploring lead me to this page:

http://es.games-workshop.com/warhammer/imperio/adicional/colores_01.asp

Full size pic:


It contains flags for each province - which look pretty cool. I figured if it is on GW's site, it must be in Warhammer cannon, but that isn't always true. I like the flag so I stuck with it as my Avatar. It was actualy fun trying to find the flag page again on a website in a different language, see if you can get to it from here:

http://es.games-workshop.com/
« Last Edit: May 08, 2008, 05:56:42 PM by Karl Voss of Averland »
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Offline GamesPoet

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #36 on: May 08, 2008, 06:09:03 PM »
http://www.warhammer-empire.com/library/guide/averland.php

That flag was official at one point or another.  Not sure of the specifics, though I believe it was in a White Dwarf a long while ago.
Ah, yes, I vaguely recall seeing this previously.  Good to be reminded.  I remembered seeing something with a yellow sun, and I like the griffon inside a crown with the warhammer, too.  Thanks :icon_exclaim:

Three new questions:

1.  I'm wondering what the griffon inside the crown with the warhammer is all about :icon_question:

2.  Anybody know how old the those are, and if there is anything further back than that :icon_question:

3.  Does anyone know if there were any symbols used with the Mordheim Averlanders :icon_question:
« Last Edit: May 08, 2008, 06:31:30 PM by GamesPoet »
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline GamesPoet

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #37 on: May 08, 2008, 06:28:57 PM »
...

Full size pic:


...

White Dwarf 325 has an article on "Colors of the Empire" that provides the above banner for Averland, along with banners for the other provinces and city states in the Empire.

Also, I just noticed a reference to the symbol of a "blazing sun" in the write up for Averland in the same article, and reference being made to this having been brought over by "displaced nobles" moving from Solland after Gorbad Ironclaw's destruction of that area.  The current banner is suppose to symbolize Averland's "sense of union with Karl Franz's Empire".
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline rufus sparkfire

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #38 on: May 09, 2008, 12:34:30 PM »
I don't like these threads being tucked away on this forum.  :icon_evil:


1.  I'm wondering what the griffon inside the crown with the warhammer is all about :icon_question:

2.  Anybody know how old the those are, and if there is anything further back than that :icon_question:

3.  Does anyone know if there were any symbols used with the Mordheim Averlanders :icon_question:

1. It's on all the flags. It represents The Empire.

2. UK White Dwarf 146/147. The New Empire list that arrived in late 3rd edition (1991ish). There are no provincial flags from before that.

3. There were not.


That new banner looks awful.
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Offline Karl Voss of Averland

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #39 on: May 09, 2008, 02:22:00 PM »
That new banner looks awful.

*Gasp* Are you refering to my Avatar? Do you wish the quarrel? I do bite my thumb at your sir!
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Offline rufus sparkfire

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #40 on: May 09, 2008, 03:41:44 PM »
It looks good on you, needless to say.  :icon_wink:
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Offline Karl Voss of Averland

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #41 on: July 19, 2008, 07:43:38 PM »
Check out this cool "Google Maps" version of Averland:

http://www.malleus.dk/media/resources/averland.pdf
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Offline Irisado

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #42 on: August 15, 2008, 12:56:51 PM »
I've never got around to painting any of my Empire army, which I've been collecting since the early 1990s, but this has actually turned out to be a good thing  :icon_eek:!  This is because I had never considered that my army would be an Averland force, but having read the background on this site, my army preferences and style fit with Averland more than any of the other provinces.

I really like Halberdiers and Handgunners, Knights of the Blazing Sun are my favourite Knightly order, I also like to field Crossbowmen, and I am a big fan of Tilea as well.  As a result, Averland seems best suited to my army structure and playing style.

I realise I've come to this conclusion rather late in the day, but I hope you won't hold that against me  :icon_biggrin:.

Now that I have decided which Empire province my army comes from, I actually might get around to painting some models one day.
Soņando con una playa donde brilla el sol, un arco iris ilumina el cielo, y el mar espejea iridescentemente.

Offline Karl Voss of Averland

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #43 on: August 16, 2008, 11:42:03 PM »
Welcome aboard!  :::cheers:::

Glad to have another Averlander!
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I sexually violated the cat.  When we have children I will push harder for this time honored and enjoyable tradition

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Offline GamesPoet

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #44 on: September 30, 2008, 01:09:20 AM »
Haven't checked this in so long, not since the Marienburg Crisis campaign started back in July, but ...

Welcome Irisado! :::cheers:::  Hope your painting is coming along well. :icon_cool:

I've been slowly modeling what I'm calling the Aver River Regiment with the base units including spears (since Averland is known for it's pikes and half pikes), militia, crossbows, archers, handgunners, cannon., and pistoliers.  For knights, I'll be having units for the Gold Lion, the Black Bear, and maybe even my own creation, the Knights of the Aver River.  I'll likley be adding more, too.

I'm also creating background info for where these soldiers are based out of, which will be at a town and it's immediate surroundings that I'm creating for the area north of Bieswang just below the Aver River, and tucked in between the woods to the west, the Moot to the East, and incorporating the hills to the south.  The main town will have a few villages under its jurisdiction as well.  I've also begun to review information regarding Stirland, and discovered there is a town called Scheibbs with a ferry that seems to cross the Aver River right where I'll be likely placing this town, which I've not finalized a name for yet.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2009, 11:56:51 AM by GamesPoet »
"Not all who wander are lost ... " Tolkien

"... my old suggestion is forget it, take two aspirins and go paint" steveb

"The beauty of curiosity and creativity is so much more useful than the passion of fear." me

"Until death it is all life." Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra

Offline Irisado

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #45 on: September 30, 2008, 09:05:33 PM »
Thanks for the welcome!

Sadly, I haven't painted a single model, and it's not looking like I'm going to anytime soon, since I have returned to university after a four year gap to study a Masters.  The things I do to get out of painting models  :laugh:.

I'm very interested in background, so I look forward to reading more about that as you get more involved with your project.
Soņando con una playa donde brilla el sol, un arco iris ilumina el cielo, y el mar espejea iridescentemente.

Offline DonKarst0n

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #46 on: October 27, 2008, 09:53:00 PM »
If one reads the Brush and Palette these days one might get the impression of Averland's dominance over every other part of the Empire.

Gut gemacht Averländer, well done.

But we wouldn't be good Averlanders if we now lean back and let those Reiklanders catch up with us.
Therefore I suggest we do a 'Averland's armies' thread where every player posts pictures of their Averland units.
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Offline Karl Voss of Averland

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #47 on: October 27, 2008, 10:59:15 PM »
If one reads the Brush and Palette these days one might get the impression of Averland's dominance over every other part of the Empire.

Gut gemacht Averländer, well done.

But we wouldn't be good Averlanders if we now lean back and let those Reiklanders catch up with us.
Therefore I suggest we do a 'Averland's armies' thread where every player posts pictures of their Averland units.

I was thinking the same thing earlier today.
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I sexually violated the cat.  When we have children I will push harder for this time honored and enjoyable tradition

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Offline rufus sparkfire

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #48 on: October 27, 2008, 11:26:45 PM »
Good idea. I'd post mine.

I recently repainted my Marius Leitdorf model, and he is definitely not dead. Not even slightly.
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Offline Karl Voss of Averland

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Re: The Province of AVERLAND (+ The Moot)
« Reply #49 on: October 28, 2008, 03:26:45 AM »
The deed is done!

All Averlanders - if you have an Averland themed model(s) you'd like to share, post it up in this thread:

http://www.warhammer-empire.com/theforum/index.php?topic=25323.0
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I sexually violated the cat.  When we have children I will push harder for this time honored and enjoyable tradition

Remembering what Rufas started and endures in us all