Topic: Up-to-date Empire Army Book Rumor Compilation

[Kolin 1757]

That's an odd thing to say, considering the current book doesn't support the Cult of Ulric either

The Cult of Ulric is a stand-alone army list. The status of the Empire army book has no bearing on it.

Dear General 

This response make my SICK !!!!!!!!!!

Come on, you know exactly what I mean. Besides the current Empire book does support the Cult of Elric! Page 79, complete with army list restrictions and that was EVEN BEFORE they launched those cool army lists, history (and miniatures)  in Storm of Chaos !

So the new Empire book MUST inlude the Ulric culture IF they want to represent the Empire and it's history. It show that Games Workshop doesn't even (re)read their own stories !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It would have been very easy to just copy the two pages of Empire Army list of Storm of Chaos in the new book and at least follow their own "history".

Look at the present Empire website: IN BIG RED colours the Cult of Ulric is being promoted as a complete side branch of the Empire. Beautiful story line.

And like I stated, an Ulric Priest NEVER will fully support Sigmar. Let alone they will fight along Sigmar priests.

It just shows that GW is only selling new books and miniatures without ANY respect for their custumors.

Come and see the next edition of Lord of the Rings where Legolas will be ommitted ... and the story will be completely changed.

If you want to create a fantasy world with thousands of players, at least be faithfull to your own history line !!! It's the only thing we have to escape now and then from this real world where 99.9% of us have nothing to say and have a weekly working 40 hours live span.

I'll give GW the benifit of the doubt until Dec 20th, but if they left out the Cult, I'll leave and be a GW basher till the end of my days!!!

[General Helstrom]

OK, somebody needs to take his chill pills

Don't get me wrong, GW pisses me off as much as the next guy. Maybe it's from having over a decade of experience with this that I - and many like me - have come to "do things my way". You have to take a step back and look at what you want from the hobby, then see to what degree GW's rules and models allow you to do this. Then you can even bend or carefully break a rule or two (see, for example, the discussion on 40mm bases for mounted characters). You shouldn't expect everything you want to be served up on a silver platter, but if you're a bit creative you can go pretty far and still have a "legal" army. Marcus Octavius' Reman Legions stand as a grand testament to this approach, as do creative players' armies across the world.

Your case is, frankly, really simple. You want to play with the Cult of Ulric. The 2004 Annual list allows you to do that. The new Empire book won't change that. I honestly don't see the problem. The "back of the book" lists you refer to are specifically noted as being for fun, not balanced, and to be used only with your opponent's permission - hardly a match for a completely legal stand-alone army like the Annual one.

Where I think you're making a mistake is that, for no reason other than... Uhm... Why, anyway? Well, for whatever reason, you also want that list in the new book. Take a deep breath and ask yourself why it matters whether the same list is in the Army Book or the Annual. It doesn't. Except at the UKGT, and that's rubbish anyway.

The bottom line is, in dealing with GW and changing editions, you have to think in practical terms - what you want - instead of pinning yourself down onto exactly how you want it presented. In your case, the new Empire book does not make a practical difference, so lighten up already

[Rune]

I have to agree here, even though I know what General's aiming at. That's true that neither this coming one, nor the 6th edition army books supported the Cult of Ulric, and concearning the game mechanics it's a stand alone, without references to any army book, save the magical items. But General, you have to agree, that CoU is an Empire list in the end. It even uses, as stated, the same magical items. Middenheim was even more so an Empire list at heart.

Even though I'm still going to use my Cult (I started collecting the army a year ago, dammit) here where I play, and in most tournaments around too, since they seldom refuse to accept lists like CoU, and it won't be a problem, it does kinda piss me off that they're dumping two whole lists with special miniatures made for them that easily. Making a little revision and adding two or three pages to the future Army book wouldn't have been that much of an effort, now would it?

What I'm going to do, is either continue playing with the CoU list, or possibly switch to a Ulric themed Empire army. Flagellants as Wolf-kin, Teutogen Guard as Greatswords, Knights as knights, swordsmen as Warriors, and... Oh, right, where did my huntsmen and hunting hounds go again? It won't work that well, in any way.

In my honest opinion GW is making another mistake here. Not a total failure, really, since they're not doing anything wrong this time, but instead they're leaving something undone. I'm with Kolin here, with leaving out something that's so close to Empire and a part of the fluff, history, spirit, and pretty much everything Empire is all about, out of the army book and forgetting the players so in love with the scheme and background stories.

They Are letting us down.

Tehcnically CoU is a stand alone. But in my bloody honest opinion, it shouldn't be. That's where GW makes the mistake.

And I'm terrribly sorry for the tone, since this is nothing to be ranting over too much, since the only problem is in some 'official' GW-tournaments, which I won't be ever attending anyways, but I hope everyone knows the reason for the frustration. I think it's justified.


edit\\ Damn, now I'm so obligated to post my revision project here too.  God save Cult of Ulric! Or, if not god, let it be men.

[Midaski]

Firstly - I have done what I said I was going to do, and wrote a civil letter asking them what the plans are for the CoU.
Not heard back yet - will post up the reply when it arrives.

Secondly it occurs to me that the way we have been looking at the new prospects of 'priestly' armies as a result of the NEB changes, is some way towards a merging of Old Empire and CoU.

Ok that doesn't give us TTG and Hounds etc, but there is something to see there.

[Clarkarias]

The new book definitly doesn't have any CoU stuff in it.  Also, I feel that priests of ulric are practically obsolete since Sigmarites hate EVERYONE now.

That being said, I image that the CoU will go the way of the dodo like all of the other lists will, when a new army book comes out.  That being said, this only applies to tournaments...

[garbod]

Just thought I would say that i have seen the book and alll on here is correct (except the corrections). Many thanks to cripple and co.  However a few questions and thoughts.....

1) Now that the Sowrd of MIght, Battle and Striking are all 15pts which will be your first choice?

2) Is it just me or has the steam tank been weakend too much to the point of being nerfed. Bsically (for those who haven't seen above) to do anything with the steam tank you need steam points generated by chossing between 1-5 SP and then roll a D6 adding the two together. If the result is over the steam tanks remaining moves then it takes a wound and dosen't generate any SP! Well fine with 10W to begin with 4SP is safe and 5 a 1/6 chance of failing so it is useful. The big problem to me is though that lose 3 wounds and all you can generate is 1 SP safely  . So while one cannon hit may not kill your 300pts investment it may easily turn it in to a useless 300pts unit!  ) There is one thing that could mitigate that and that is if the healing prayer can heal the steam tank - would be very surprised as now of the spells can heal machines! (Could someone look into that?)

3) We can generate a really reliable and powerful magic phase. What I am considering is (relevent items only):

Arch Lector, War Alter, Orb of Thunder
Warrior Priest, Doomfire Ring
Lvl 2 Wizard (Light)
Capt on Peg, Alfred's Casket

That gives us 3 lore of light spells (2 on 2 dice and bound 5), 3 Prayers, Oot (BS 4) and burning head. With a 50:50 chance of the casket. So a fairly dependable 8 spells a turn which means some are oing to go through . Fair enough it is expensive, but these charictors have other roles (ie the arch lector is a US chariot, the WP will make ICK hate or perhaps my spearmen, the wizard is scroll caddy and the captpeg has loads of uses!) and so I think are really worth thier points.

4) Lastly the prussure on the rares have been reduced. After all Flagies can be common, the Steam tank is nerfed and the Hellblaster hasbeen suriously toned down I think Giants could be a much more common sight. Especially as we will probably be able to heal them! (Could someone look into that?)

[Mark Perry]

With regard to the steam Tank, the current system of armour points is in essence the same

25 Armour Points roll D 6 for each point and add the total if less than armour points then fine if over then damage.

The new system may be less complicated, but we will have to wait to see the details before we know how the tank has been affected.

With such an expensive unit you need to protect it until it can get into a position it can hurt the enemy ie impact hits and firing into combat. I use a unit of Nilla Knights to screen it until it can get into battle.

I suppose you could use a Lore of Light Spell to give it a Ward save?

Warrior Priests and the Arch Lector are going to be the mainstay for most players I think the wizard will depend on who your facing as to if you use him or not, the same for the Captain on a Pegasus with the Casket.

I like the idea of using the War Alter and the Stank as 2 units that can give impact hits, I think the tactics will have to be thought through tho. With Hatred I will be attacking more as we have a greater chance of inflicting damage on our opponents and still benefit from the supporting charge of the Detachment.

Against Skaven and Horde army's I think the tactics will stay the same but I think I will try a few co-ordinated charges across the battle line just before I'm charged as I think the new hatred rules will give us a better chance of success.

With the HBVG seriously down graded I will use either 2 cannons or 2 mortars.

[Rune]

Firstly - I have done what I said I was going to do, and wrote a civil letter asking them what the plans are for the CoU.
Not heard back yet - will post up the reply when it arrives.

Secondly it occurs to me that the way we have been looking at the new prospects of 'priestly' armies as a result of the NEB changes, is some way towards a merging of Old Empire and CoU.

Ok that doesn't give us TTG and Hounds etc, but there is something to see there.

Cheers!

I trust you'll bring us to know how it turns out without asking. I hope they'll answer.

[clausewitz]

Browsing the new book tonight I noticed a couple of things that I hadn't spotted elsewhere (they might be there I just haven't seen them..).

Icon of Magnus, only 25 points, but no longer Immune to Terror, instead Terror becomes Fear.

Ludwig Schwarzhelm.  Gives a bonus +1 CR to all units within 12" (including his own, and in addition to the +1 for being a BSB).

Kurt Hellborg is good (except for some reason he doesn't have a shield).  Makes his unit ItP and Stubborn.  And as mentioned elsewhere has WS7 A4 Runefang and Laurels.

[New ultimate hammer unit: Kurt and Ludwig in a unit of IC Knights with Warbanner.  Static CR of 4 plus 2x Kurts Runefang kills... got to be good!]

[Patch]

Icon of Magnus, only 25 points, but no longer Immune to Terror, instead Terror becomes Fear.
Kurt Hellborg is good (except for some reason he doesn't have a shield).  Makes his unit ItP and Stubborn.  And as mentioned elsewhere has WS7 A4 Runefang and Laurels.
[New ultimate hammer unit: Kurt and Ludwig in a unit of IC Knights with Warbanner.  Static CR of 4 plus 2x Kurts Runefang kills... got to be good!]

I seem to remember that the Icon made you immune to fear in to old book - and Terror was downgraded to fear, so no change there, I think. Cheaper, mind.

Kurt has always been a favourite, but his old combo of Dawn armour, runefang and Rod of command was maybe a bit better - you can't have two lots of Laurels of Victory in an army, when I would have happily avoided the other three. I looked at the old model - he didn't have a shield then, either!

[Dain of the Border Legion]

With such an expensive unit you need to protect it until it can get into a position it can hurt the enemy ie impact hits and firing into combat. I use a unit of Nilla Knights to screen it until it can get into battle.

I suppose you could use a Lore of Light Spell to give it a Ward save?

If only....you can't screen the stank, its a large target unfortunately. Also unfortunately the stank is immune to all friendly and hostile magic unless it has a given strength value, so no Celestial Shield or any other 'buff spell' for the Stank.

The Stank isn't worth using for firepower now, however being 1" away from the enemy and being able to generate 6D3 impact hits is VERY powerful. I intend to use mine as a battering ram if I include it in an army.

Dain

[Dendo Star]

Are there any pictures of the new Rocket yet?

[Mark Perry]

If only....you can't screen the stank, its a large target unfortunately. Also unfortunately the stank is immune to all friendly and hostile magic unless it has a given strength value, so no Celestial Shield or any other 'buff spell' for the Stank.

The Stank isn't worth using for firepower now, however being 1" away from the enemy and being able to generate 6D3 impact hits is VERY powerful. I intend to use mine as a battering ram if I include it in an army.

Dain

Nuts

[General Helstrom]

Dendo, check out this page. There's some blurred-out pictures of the rocket launcher and, for some silly reason, of the old War Altar there.

[Dendo Star]

Oh, wow!  It's a series of rockets!  I thought it was going to be one big one...

Grand!   

[Patch]

Looks like the result of an unholy union between the HBVG and a Space Marine old-style whirlwind launcher....

[The Chosen of Sigmar]

Only saw Luthor huss for special heros, didnt have time to see other one.

It's Ludwig. I can't remember what he does, though - I spent most of my time drooling over the colour section.

Amongst others Ludwig has killing blow (using sword of justice). A nice combo if tou ask me...

[Patch]

Wow! Your kidding!
Guess I'm going to have to get the old model of that guy out for a quick repaint!

[General Lee Stupid]

Sorry if this has already been discussed but when is all of this new stuff going to be released?

[erik maas]

on m,y birthday:

3th of january

but the army box will come out somewere in december

[Will Waddington]

yeh it's rubbish because the army set which costs £135 comes out before christmas and the rest come on in january.
What are Games Workshop doing?

[Dendo Star]

Being damn good capitalists. 

Oooooooo...they just don't play fair.

Remember rule #1 of Capitalism - somebody gets shafted.

[Siamtiger]

Short question about the new HBVG. So the S5 is for the whole range up to 24", but for the fact that there are no more autohits is there a longe range penalty for the HBVG?
Some say yes, some say no. Any proofed information? Because if there isn´t, it aint got nerfed that bad.

[yeltsins_liver]

Don't know if anybody has noticed yet but I just saw someone is selling some of the new Empire stuff (search for unreleased in empire) on Ebay for about double the price. Hmmmmm.

[Siamtiger]

Don't know if anybody has noticed yet but I just saw someone is selling some of the new Empire stuff (search for unreleased in empire) on Ebay for about double the price. Hmmmmm.

Mostly people splitting the army deal.

Link?