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Author Topic: 8th Edition rule predictions.  (Read 3944 times)

Offline Ambrose

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8th Edition rule predictions.
« on: September 16, 2011, 01:15:46 AM »
Greetings,

I've played only a few games of 8th edition, and have never played any earlier edition, but here are just two predictions for a new Empire Army book;

1 - Knights and Impact hits:  To me it makes total sense that calvary (not fast calvary) have impact hits at the strength of their mount.  It makes sense and I think this would add a lot to the current knights in 8th.  Although not too powerful, I think it fits with the feel and purpose of the knights and their horse mounts.

2 - Shield Parry:  With the new ogres having the ability to purchase an item that allows a parry save while mounted, it makes total sense to me that knights would have the same, if not better, training.  I predict that knights will get their 6+ parry save while mounted.  This would be awsome and again, a balanced, not too powerful addition that would really add to the knights and their abilities.

Well, these are just my preditictions that I think could be added and that are not too powerful, fit with the game, and would make excellent additions.

Ambrose
"Faith, Steel and Gunpowder"

Offline Blauer Nebel

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Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2011, 01:21:33 AM »
I could see the Impact Hits for Bretonnians maybe, give their cavalry some more "oomph" for this edition, maybe even a parry save with an item. But Empire is a combined-arms force. While we have strong magic, strong guns, and decent troops (in numbers), we require a combination to win. All troops won't carry the day being far too cumbersome, while knights can't win in head-to-head clashes anymore. War machines are great but won't blow away an entire army and magic is highly volatile for both caster and target. I think Empire will remain this way.

Offline Ambrose

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Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2011, 03:24:49 AM »
I hope the Empire will remain reliant on all of its options and versatility.  However, I believe the rules I mentioned above have been given to the Ogres in the new book, and can see them transitioning to other armies as well.  I have never played Bretonnia, but a 1 strength 3 impact hit representing your horses crashing into an enemy line makes sense to me.  I don't see it as an over powered rule.  Same with the mounted parry save for the knights.  I see the knights charging in, breaking their lances on the enemy line, drawing their swords and shields and attacking everything in reach.   My hope would be that the knights are trained to fight with their hand weapon and shield, giving them the 6+ parry save (maybe not on the round they charged).
"Faith, Steel and Gunpowder"

Offline Ambrose

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Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2011, 04:39:43 PM »
How about Empire gets impact hits for heavly calvary.
Bretonians can get impact hits with +1 for every rank after the first two if in wedge formation to a max of 3?  That would be a wedge formation 5 ranks (12 models). 
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Offline Athiuen

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Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2011, 03:59:45 AM »
If cavalry was going to get impact hits it would have been in the main rule book.
Maybe next edition.
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Offline Delthos

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Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2011, 04:13:32 AM »
Saying Knights should get impact hits because Ogres got them is kind of odd, considdering Ogres have had impact hits since their original army book in 6th edition. It's not something they've suddenly given them in 8th edition. I really don't think Knights need much more than to get a Lance errata for the main rule book, giving Lance armed units ASF when charging. I think that's the only change they need. I still don't know that I'd ever invest in the points to upgrade Chaos Knights to have lances and loose their ensorcelled weapons, but it would definitely give Knights with Lances just what I think they need. Also, too many things have impact hits in the game now. I don't like seeing more things get them.

As for shield parry while mounted, that starts a bad precident that I don't like as well. Knights already have a 1+ save from being mounted on Barded Warhorse, no need for a Parry save as well. The parry save is a nice bonus for infantry that use it and I think it should stay there with infantry.

While I understand the desire to have Knights be more effective and that you are looking for ways to give them a boost, I think ASF lances are what needs to be there.
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Offline Athiuen

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Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2011, 04:26:16 AM »
Also a 6+ parry would make Bret knights, specifically their lady save, all the more redundant and over-priced.
Quote from: warhammerlord_soth
No beer was wasted.
They fired at a can of Heineken.
The end is Neigh! [sic]
Quote from: Swan-of-War
Curse you clearly-written rules!

Offline Delthos

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Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2011, 05:38:10 AM »
In the case of Bretonnians it wouldn't necessarily be redundant. They would still get their 5+ against ST 5 and higher attacks, and they'd still get their Blessing save to the sides and rear. While they would still end up with a 6+ Wardsave to the front if they lose the Blessing of the Lady. I see your point though and still don't think Cav should get it. Ward Saves are too common for non-character models in the game already. Don't add more.
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Offline Ambrose

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Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2011, 08:33:25 PM »
People make some really good points and I appreciate the discussion.  My thought of having impact hits was not based on ogres having them, the idea just came to me while playing ogres.  It seemed fitting to me, as heavy calv. was used to smash into enemy lines and inflict massive damage on the charge.  My thought is any army with heavy calv. would have the impacts as it is fitting for their role.

Parry saves while mounted would make them too powerful/expensive for what we would get in return.  It is true that this really adds to the infantry that can get them.

Again, good thoughts.

Thanks,
Ambrose
"Faith, Steel and Gunpowder"

Offline Orcslayer

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Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #9 on: October 03, 2011, 09:27:26 PM »
Methinks that even if GW gave Bret knights impact hits, they would still suck. I honestly can't see Games Workshop keeping the Brets around for this edition. With the new emphasis on ranked infantry in steadfast and horde formation, their army just makes no sense. The only things that could possibly repair the weak Bret book is a drastic point cut to all knights and a revamp of the lance formation.

To be honest, I would like to see Bretonnia dropped completely and a new race added instead. Can you say Kislev or Araby? Hell maybe even bring back some Chaos Dwarves. Better for GW because everyone will have to buy completely new models to play the new army, and we will be happy because of the new shinys to stare at.
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Offline finngoalie

  • Posts: 321
Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #10 on: October 04, 2011, 01:15:05 AM »
I think there are still enough Brets players to want to make them happy. I love the pegasus knights for appearance, and intend to use one in the coming "Empire of Wolves" campaign as the 60 pt barded pegasus. It's perfect for that. The Brets just need some rules adjustments and a new core infantry...maybe foot knights. A 15 man block of their current cheap grunts are a good sacrificial/bait unit. HOWEVER, I agree with many that wood elves should be next to get fixed, then Brets, then us. Reintroduce Kislev and dogs of war this edition.

Offline towishimp

  • Posts: 1678
Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2011, 02:42:06 AM »
I agree that Brettonia would best be fixed by improving its infantry, as well as a little something to bump up their cavalry - maybe something to make the lance formation matter more.  But it looks like GW may just ignore them this edition, rather than try to fix them...which suits me fine, as me and my brother just re-wrote the book in one evening on our own. 

As for Empire cav, I like them as they are.  They're definitely not the steamrollers that they could be in the last edition, but they're still very useful.  They make good, tough, shooting-resistant flankers and warmachine hunters.  I've even had some luck with them in a frontal charge or two, as long as you know what you're getting into.

Mostly, I'd like to see detachments revamped to make them more useful again.  They were one of the things that drew me to Empire in the first place, and are a uniquely Empire thing, so it makes sense to me to make it a useful rule again.
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Offline Obi

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Re: 8th Edition rule predictions.
« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2011, 08:02:24 AM »
Methinks that even if GW gave Bret knights impact hits, they would still suck. I honestly can't see Games Workshop keeping the Brets around for this edition. With the new emphasis on ranked infantry in steadfast and horde formation, their army just makes no sense. The only things that could possibly repair the weak Bret book is a drastic point cut to all knights and a revamp of the lance formation.

To be honest, I would like to see Bretonnia dropped completely and a new race added instead. Can you say Kislev or Araby? Hell maybe even bring back some Chaos Dwarves. Better for GW because everyone will have to buy completely new models to play the new army, and we will be happy because of the new shinys to stare at.

:icon_evil:

Bretonnia is fine. Cavalry got nerfed, so the old 'point and click' army won't work anymore. But two trebs, 40-60 archers, 40 M@A with the prayer icon and two lances will do fine. I tried it at the EB, did pretty decently (versus EMPIRE, that is). They may not access to all lores, but they have access to the best lore.
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