The Empire at War ... The Gamers Guild > WFB 8th & EoT

When do Shields contribute to Armour Save?

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Timrath:
Or more importantly: when don't they?
I've googled many threads, including in this forum, that claim that Shields become dead weight when combined with any weapons that require two hands. I'm scouring the BRB for anything that would support that claim, but I can't find anything.

The BRB reads:
"If a model carries a shield, the score it needs to save is reduced by 1"

It doesn't say "except when the model also carries a Halberd, additional Hand Weapon, Great Weapon, etc." In fact, you don't even need a free hand to use a shield, because - both IRL, and on Warhammer artwork - shields are fastened to the forearm. Why do so many people believe that you lose the 6+ Armour Save when you combine the Shield with, say, a Halberd? What passages in the BRB support that opinion?

Please note that I'm not asking about Parry Saves. The BRB is very clear about when a Shield grants you a Parry Save, and when it doesn't. I'm strictly asking about Armour Saves.

Darknight:
I think you may be technically correct. However, you are limited with what you can equip your models with. Very few, if any, models carry a two-handed weapon and a shield. Those that do (or did) invariably have explicit rules which say shields cannot be used in conjunction with a two-handed weapon. When equipping characters, the weapon choices do not include the option to take both shield and two-handed weapon, I think.

Baron von Klatz:
Still get the armor save against missiles so it's not all bad. :-)

Naitsabes:
The weapons are listed on page 90 in the BRB. Some (like halberds) have the special rule 'Requires two hands'. You can look that up in the list of special rules (go figure) and will find that it prohibits use of shields in close combat. Pretty straightforward.

Timrath:

--- Quote from: Darknight on October 12, 2016, 01:57:48 AM ---When equipping characters, the weapon choices do not include the option to take both shield and two-handed weapon, I think.

--- End quote ---
Let's take the General (or Captain) of the Empire as an example. They can take an additional Hand Weapon (unless mounted), and they're also allowed to take a shield. Together with their native Light Armour, they should have a 5+ Armour Save. As far as I can see, nothing in the BRB or AB suggests that they wouldn't get that 5+, despite their also wielding two Hand Weapons at the same time... not only against missiles, but also in close combat.
Even characters that don't get these options, can still obtain magical equivalent combinations, like for example Enchanted Shield + Fencing Blades.
And let's not forget the lowly Halberdier, who explicitly gets the option of taking a Shield.
It seems to me that the only reason why Shield + Two-handed is so rarely seen, is that people erroneously believe that the Shield is useless in close combat when wielded alongside a Two-handed weapon.

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