Topic: Skaven rumors ( booo) End of Times, new pics + spoilers, Skaven 40k ?? WHAT!

[ZeroTwentythree]

No problem, I would rather be corrected than state the wrong thing. 

[Finlay]

Maybe Karl Franz will get into an epic battle with Archaon, and will be mortally wounded.  But the priests of sigmar will secret away the dying body and use some sort of dwarven/skaven contraption to keep him alive.  It will be made of gold.

And for convenience sake it will be in the shape of some sort of chair.

[Jomppexx]

Maybe Karl Franz will get into an epic battle with Archaon, and will be mortally wounded.  But the priests of sigmar will secret away the dying body and use some sort of dwarven/skaven contraption to keep him alive.  It will be made of gold.

And for convenience sake it will be in the shape of some sort of chair.

Hmmm...
Somehow that sounds familiar.

[Dosiere]

Those new Skaven.... things went a little bit too far.  It's certainly been the trend for years now, but still this seems over the top.  The models are so well done, but just don't fit what I consider to be the warhammer aesthetic.  They seem to belong to a different game, and not the fantasy setting I have built up in my head.

But since these are indeed Warhammer miniatures, I must be wrong.  I am trying to wrap my head around the new Warhammer stuff since I have loved and played the game for almost two decades now, and I am hoping against hope that the next edition is a game I will want to play when it comes out.

[SorenJ]

Just for the record, ratling canons (the Gatling/assault canon spoof) aren't as such a new concept, are they?

[WoT]

I've said elsewhere but they look like Skaven Ogryns now, the whole armour style and the way they painted them made them look wrong, they didn't look grity enough as if they've been cobbled to together.

[Baron von Klatz]

I don't think they were cobbled together. Since the Skaven conquered Nuln they probably had a lot of new toys to use to create those things. Regardless, theycould have been given a grittier paint-style but are obviously made to encourage 40k players fo get into fantasy.

[WoT]

I don't think they were cobbled together. Since the Skaven conquered Nuln they probably had a lot of new toys to use to create those things. Regardless, theycould have been given a grittier paint-style but are obviously made to encourage 40k players fo get into fantasy.

Yeah I meant they should look more like traditional skaven technology and not so clean and precise.

[Baron von Klatz]

I don't think they were cobbled together. Since the Skaven conquered Nuln they probably had a lot of new toys to use to create those things. Regardless, theycould have been given a grittier paint-style but are obviously made to encourage 40k players fo get into fantasy.

Yeah I meant they should look more like traditional technology and not so clean and precise.

Could be GW's "take that" to the warmachine franchise by showing their fans they can make models like that too. You would be surprised how quickly a "my fantasy is better that yours" debate declines into "look how better my models are" or " well, my game has more impressive looking tech so curbstomps yours".  Lot of competition today for GW to put up with, I'm still rooting for them though.

[Baron von Klatz]

That's assuming that either Karl Franz or even Sigmar are still standing when the dust settles.

So long as at least one Empire halberdier rolls an attack die in Sigmar's name against 9th Edition opponents, the Empire and Sigmar will never truly die.

Hear hear, well said! 

Long live the Empire and Sigmar!

Ah, ok. I stand corrected. I only remember a few bits & pieces from when I was regularly blogging & following other gaming blogs.

Not trying to bust your chops, I just like to spread the good word. 

If bubblehammer becomes reality I think the moderators should change the name of this forum to
Oldhammer-Empire.

If the rumors are true about a new combined human faction then they may make a new name for it, probably something like bestellen bastion. So we can probably keep the site name as is.

[psychichobo]

Archaon has Ghal Maraz? Pff. Well done Valten, you useless sack of nothing.

I'm really not happy about the quick squatting of Lizardmen though. And I'm kind of worried as to what'll happen to the Ogres too, being the other 'outlier' race...

[iatroblast]

hahaha  *Wight King von Klatz  the hero of Sylvania

[Baron von Klatz]

hahaha  *Wight King von Klatz  the hero of Sylvania

I like the sound of that.

Now I'm going to have to make a undead version of my general and make some house rules for the End Times. "Whenever Baron von Klatz falls in battle, have him and the regiment he's with replaced with Wight king von Klatz and undead units with a similar strength to the lost regiment. (Example: swordsmen-zombies, greatswords-grave guard)

Archaon has Ghal Maraz? Pff. Well done Valten, you useless sack of nothing.

I'm really not happy about the quick squatting of Lizardmen though. And I'm kind of worried as to what'll happen to the Ogres too, being the other 'outlier' race...

Could be symbolic as well actually, in that warhammer is in the hands of chaos. I'm kind of hoping that 9th editions ends up pitting a world controlled by chaos against a world controlled by order. It would definitely be a big change to the setting with lots of warring opportunities,  the worlds first at war within themselves to see who gets what lands and early battles of stragglers within the chaos world trying to etch out a living.

Icing on the cake of this being if GW made tournaments where players could decide who got what lands in the new worlds, we'd be responsible for the setting of a new warhammer world.

[Xathrodox86]

Ulric is dead, probably obvious but yes actually dead.

Monotheistic worship of a divine God-Emperor here we come...wait that all sounds familiar...

Whatever gave you that idea?

[Philhelm]

Ulric is dead, probably obvious but yes actually dead.

Monotheistic worship of a divine God-Emperor here we come...wait that all sounds familiar...

Whatever gave you that idea?

That's clearly a griffon sculpted on his left shoulder.  I had always thought those were eagles, so this is a revelation.

[mottdon]

Yeah, I've stopped even trying to keep up with what's going on in EoT.  It's all utter rediculousness.  I don't know of a single player (Order or Destruction) who likes what is happening.  Everyone I know says that they'll see what happens to 9th, and unless GW absolutely completely surprises everyone and bucks the trend of EoT to create an amazing 9th edition where all our current armies are still available, then they will simply continue to play 8th as if none of this ever happened.

If I, as a business, saw my customer base saying and doing that, I would fire the entire staff that took my company in that direction and do whatever it took to hire back the origional creators and immediately produce an 11th edition that returned to the previous world, rules and armies with a very humble apology letter tacked to the opening page of my website.

[Darknight]

The fact that there is so much (anecdotal) evidence of the rejection of 9th and adherence to 8th, and that (very accurate) psychology, suggests one of a number of things;

1) GW have snails in their brains (as much as we might like to say this, I don't think this is entirely likely)
2) GW know all this 9th-ed-hate is just blowing smoke and means nothing - people will play.
3) GW know those saying "8th-for-life, yo" represent a financially insignificant group
4) GW know 9th ed is actually going to be awesome and people are going to be shocked.

GW's relative silence on the subject suggests . . . I dunno what it suggests. It's hard to read silence. But I think it is unlikely GW is unaware of the unabashed levels of hated, disappointment, disillusionment and so forth.

[mottdon]

Oh, I totally agree.  If nothing else, I'm sure someone at GW HQ is getting tons of hate-mail.  Something's up.  I'm holding onto a microscopic glimmer of hope that 9th will actually be very good and we won't really lose anything but special characters.  That I could live with.  Even a very few armies merging who are already very similar would be acceptable, though hard to swallow.  But this...  I don't see any possible way that they could say that this isn't a completely new game.  I just don't think that it's possible anymore.  They've gone too far down this EoT path.

[Finlay]

arent the actual sales of ET books and so on high though? Just because us old fart grumbles dont like it..
dunno.

I still think 9th might be good. I just feel sorry for lizardmen as it does seem they've been squatted. (I can also see fluff easily written to let them back in. "zomg the old ones summoned a vestige of power and created the lizards their own bubble" "zomg one slann escaped and used his power to create one bubble"

remember in previous editions there were 25% allowed allies, and empire used to have ogres, dwarvs and ogres.
so a mixed empire/dwarf/someone else army would have been common back in the day.

[mottdon]

That's the slim glimmer of hope I'm holding onto, but with all of this talk about reducing the number of armies for play, it doesn't look very good for the Lizardmen.  On the other hand, I just bought a very large Lizardmen army off eBay for about $120.  If you wanted to start their army, now's a great time to do it!

[Darknight]

The "gathering together into factions" things has been discussed a lot; did we ever see factions?

Chaos
Greenskins
Undead
Order
Skaven
Elves


??

The people who get hosed here are Ogre and Dwarf players (because their stuff is just part of the "order" faction - unless one can JUST take Dwarfs / Ogres), Lizards (because they have gone the way of the dodo) but particularly Bretonnians.

If you are a player of either undead, or any flavor of undead or chaos, you can probably play much the same style of army (especially in appearance) in the new game. Maybe some more options - being to have Vampires in Tomb Kings might be fun! And beasts combined with warriors etc. etc. is fun. Ancestral hated aside, the mixed elves give an option to field a truly "fae" army hammering the "they are of one kind, we are of another" home like a jackhammer. I am actually REALLY tempted by that - if the 9th ed encourages such things I am likely to do Titania's Summer Court.

But the Bretonnians are getting absolutely hosed - because (and this is key); Bretonnians are NOT simply human knights. Empire would be getting hosed - but the description seems to be that handgunners, halberds and knights will form the core of the human faction - which is Empire! But the Bretonnians aren't just a particular look-and-feel of knights, they are a whole ethos and idea.

I understand they are getting the shaft because the design studio doesn't like 'em, but that seems very sad.

[mottdon]

I have no basis for this other than my own personal wishlist, but I've been hoping that they would allow the Lizardmen to become some sort of "Bubble Space Police", floating around in their pyramids and intervening when needed. 

Kinda like these Judoon off Doc Who:

[Oxycutor]

None of the rumours for 9th say Lizardmen are getting squatted.   Or any other army specifically. 

The rumours did say there would be 6 factions, and even that was contested saying wasn't sure if that was right.   

Because of there only being 6 rumoured factions, speculators have decided that means Lizards are out, based on some of the 'Exodus' stuff in the End Times fluff.

I would speculate 6 may be a starting number of factions, as they build Warhammer 2.0 (a.k.a Bubblehammer), and more could get added later, as they have time to develop the new ranges, if indeed any of it is true.

the rumours are outrageous if taken at face value.  They did first appear around the middle of last year as the so called "Spanish Rumours", not in as much detail as there is currently, but that Warhammer was ending and a new version of the world and rules was taking it's name and place.  People were hugely dismissive of the rumours back then.   Including some of those people who have now said the same rumours and have had to concede there might have been some truth to them. 

There are several ways this could go

1) GW are giving certain people knowledge of certain things and trying to figure out where they are leaking inside info from.

2) GW are putting out false rumours, as each edition change people get enraged over changes, so they're putting out such outrageous rumours that when 9th does arrive and not much has changed people will be relieved, and happy to continue buying

3) There is a divide within GW over the way to take Warhammer forward, and people who don't like the changes are leaking information knowing people will hate what is coming, to prove their point

4) GW just don't care, as WFB doesn't do well enough or attract enough payers that pissing people off won't matter, and they think they can attract more than enough new people to buy into the replacement

5) Maybe there just aren't enough people within GW who like WFB, they're 40 players, so want to make WFB more like 40k, so they think more people will like the new WFBubbles

6) GW have no idea why people do or don't like WFB, as they don't do any market research (Or so they say in their annual report), so everything they do is a complete guess and they just hope it works, but ave no idea why or how to repsond to demand, or judge what people might actually want

7) Rumour makers are making shit up to provoke a reaction, though given how this could harm GW, you might think they would say something

[mottdon]

Well, do we actually know that these EoT books are indeed a precursor to 9th?  This could simply be an elaborate campaign that will have nothing to do with the next edition, simply because they want to advance the story line.  I do think that it would be very odd to have an apocalypse scenario where entire continents are destroyed and then go back to playing as if none of that ever happened, but hey, most people play as though Storm of Chaos never happened.

[Philhelm]

Well, do we actually know that these EoT books are indeed a precursor to 9th?  This could simply be an elaborate campaign that will have nothing to do with the next edition, simply because they want to advance the story line.  I do think that it would be very odd to have an apocalypse scenario where entire continents are destroyed and then go back to playing as if none of that ever happened, but hey, most people play as though Storm of Chaos never happened.

But Storm of Chaos could have just been called Siege of Middenheim; furthermore, the Chaos attack failed.  That is much easier to ignore than the abomination that The End Times has become.