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Author Topic: Which list is better?  (Read 871 times)

Offline Athiuen

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Which list is better?
« on: January 28, 2024, 11:54:37 PM »
I've been making lists for a tournament and have it narrowed down to 2. Help me pick the better one.
Both lists are almost identical, the have the same Characters, the same Special, and the same Rare - the only difference is the core (hence my other post). I'll put the core last since it is the part of the army in question. Here it is:

Characters - 693p
Grand Master - Fullplate; shield; demigryph; Sword of Justice; White Cloak
Captain - Fullplate; shield; demigryph; Talisman of Protection; Battle Standard
Wizard Lord - Pegasus; Elementalism; Armor of Tarnus; Ruby Ring of Ruin

The Grand Master will be with a unit of 3 demigryphs. The Captain displaces 6 models in the 30 man spear unit (pushing that unit to a 6x6 square on deployment). The Wizard free roams.

Special - 415p
3x Demigryphs - Fullplate, Full Command, Lances
5x Outriders - Musician
5x Pistoliers - Veteran w/ repeater pistol; musician

I want to try both outriders and pistoliers. The pistoliers will likely be deployed in open order and will hunt war machines or flank. The outriders will cover my army from flankers.

Rare - 390p
Steam Tank
Helblaster Volley Gun

The Helblaster seems good. Stank is probably auto-include for tournament play.

Core 1 (Cheap Core) - 501p
30x State Troops - Spears, Full Command
15x State Troops - Halberds, Detachment
9x Knights - Great Weapons, Shields, Full Command

This is the cheap core option. Regular State troops mean lots of room for a heavy hitting unit of knights.

Core 2 (Expensive Core) - 500p
30x Veteran State Troops - Spears, Full Command, Griffon Standard
15x State Troops - Halberds, Detachment
5x Knights - Great Weapons, NO shield, NO command.

Much more durable 30 man block (WS 4, extra combat res). Cheap throwaway knights.

Which section of core do you think better serves the army?
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Offline Dazgrim

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Re: Which list is better?
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2024, 11:59:56 PM »
Firstly, I'm amused your cheap core is 501 points and your expensive is cheaper at 500, but setting that aside.

I think you're better off with the cheap core and the heavier knights. The infantry will probably FBIGO from whatever charges them first, whether veteran or not. So you will get a counter charge in either way.

I think this edition is leaning towards making sure that whatever blow you throw hits as hard as possible, and 9 knights in 2 ranks should win most combats on the charge.

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Offline Zygmund

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Re: Which list is better?
« Reply #2 on: January 29, 2024, 08:43:41 AM »
I'd like to test both options, against different armies.

Really can't theoryhammer this through. Veteran infantry with the Griffon Standard will fare a LOT better against many unit types, but has little added value against some other. It really depends on what your opponent throws at it and how you maneuver during the first turns.

Agree 9 knights is strong and will win first turn combats with the Ini bonus and First Charge. But can they destroy units, and how do they fare in prolonged combat? How alone will it be fighting, will it get flank charged? Reduced by a cannon/BT shot or a spell?

It's a complicated game, and your opponent has a say too.

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Offline Athiuen

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Re: Which list is better?
« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2024, 09:58:55 AM »
I don't know what I'll be facing - it will likely be a mix of elves, chaos, and vampires. I guess that's the fun of a tournament.
Quote from: warhammerlord_soth
No beer was wasted.
They fired at a can of Heineken.
The end is Neigh!
Quote from: Swan-of-War
Curse you clearly-written rules!

Offline commandant

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Re: Which list is better?
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2024, 10:22:23 AM »
My question is how is this list meant to fight?   How is it meant to deploy? Are the demi griffons meant to be an independent command or do they operate in conjunction with the infantry block.   
If they are meant to operate in conjunction with the core infantry block then I think  you want the expensive core where as if they are an independent command then you want the cheap core.

Also do the knights need great weapons? I donno if you want your knights to be in projected conflicts where the great weapons would help?   In the cheap core what is the expected role of the knights?

Offline Wolfgang aus Wien

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Re: Which list is better?
« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2024, 11:05:35 AM »
I don't have the books yet, but based on my experiences with 5th edition - which this one seems to resemble - you'll need more guns against Chaos (anything that'll reduce or negate armor saves) and and something that can kill the main Vampire. Are handguns core in this edition ? If yes, play Space Marines against Chaos. Elite Space Marines, that is.